Year 8 trans child - in secret

[WoollyMammoth1]

The recent news article about the trans child at a primary school made me think of sharing a similar story at my DD school, big difference being is that's a secondary school.
DD is in year 8, there's a child in her year that identifies as a girl but is a boy. No one at school, besides staff knows, DD doesn't know either as whilst I feel bad withholding the information, I don't want her to keep this secret at school.

The child has a sibling at the school, who calls him by his girl name. They change in the disabled changing room and use the disabled toilet.

I found out through social media, the parent came up as a possible contact, their profile is open and there were many pictures of her children when younger making it very clear. Absolutely no doubt.

When I first found out, I researched and found there is little I can do. The child's rights seem to trump all others.

DD and the child started building a friendship last year, but this went sour. Which I am glad for considering the circumstances.

My issue here is the deceit and secrecy. Non of the year group know the child is a boy which is such an obvious safeguarding risk, and once they find out they'll feel betrayed. Any friendships are based on a lie. And I feel like I am condoning the situation by not saying anything, esp to DD.

The child lives further from school then most other kids, likely to try and ensure there were no other children at the school that might know them.

It feels wrong to keep things quiet, esp for my daughters, and other girls in her year's sake, so hoping that someone here may have some good ideas in where to go from here.

(Long term Mumsnetter, name changed for this post)

You are saying that this child is a boy and pretending to be a girl but you don’t know that, neither does OP.

No one else has mentioned this at all, so why would OP start spreading a rumour about a child that may not be even true.

This bullshit is why I rarely read the feminist boards on Mumsnet anymore.
I think there’s a major problem with sport and I think women’s safeguarding can be threatened sometimes by self id, but I also think some people are trans.

It’s none of your business. Zip it.

How can you shout about treating trans people with dignity and respect whilst simultaneously making it so shameful it has to be secret?

This is one of the many inconsistencies in the trans narrative.

We should treat trans people with dignity and respect, just as we should do with everyone else, but we should also celebrate their transness.

At the same time, we're not allowed to know they're trans unless they choose to tell us. But why should we not know about it if it's something to be celebrated?

And then when we find out that they're trans and they didn't tell us, and that they've been lying to us about their sex, it's going to be difficult to respect them because of their dishonesty.

Pretending to be someone you're not, and lying to everyone about it, is never going to end well.

You believe that there is something called being trans. That is your belief and you're entitled to hold that belief. I don't share your belief. I believe that your belief is particularly harmful when applied to children.

Children cannot be transsexual. If adults want to be transsexuals, fine, but it's not appropriate for children.

Thank you for your considered response.

This pupil is in year 8 so while legally a child they will be 12 and on the brink of adolescence. It’s at this time that problems will surface. They are obviously getting support and should be allowed space. It’s the child’s life and rubbernecking is not going to help.

Have you spoken to the head, OP? That seems like the obvious first step. The school are keeping a secret from the children that may impact on their wellbeing. To put it more bluntly, they are lying to the children. Given that schools rely for their smooth functioning on the ability of pupils to trust the staff, this would seem unwise.

I also think it unlikely that you are the only person who knows. At some point, another adult will let it slip to their child, and the child will tell their friends, and then it won't be a secret any more. Quite possibly all hell will break loose at this point, and the head and SMT are going to find themselves in an even trickier situation than they are at present.

This could be so dangerous, if any of the boys have said they fancy this ‘girl’ or been boyfriend/girlfriend they could feel humiliated when they find out and teenage boys aren’t known for being great at controlling their tempers!

This. There is no need for you to essentially ‘out’ this child to their peers who they will be with for at least 3 years more - there’s no need for the other kids to know whatsoever as it’s not affecting them.

Given that you only know through snooping and that the school have taken appropriate measures such as separate changing, it really isn't any of your business. Adults keep plenty of information to themselves so there is absolutely no reason to share this gossip with your dd.

It's also the lives of all the other children in the school, who, it appears, are being lied to by the staff.

Do you really think it doesn't affect all the other children if all the adults in the school are lying to them?

Well no - they’re not being lied too. They’ve not asked and been told explicitly that the child is a girl/boy. They don’t know any different - they’re not sharing a changing room/toilet with them - there’s no need for everyone to know everyone’s business or sex.

This doesn’t make sense and since it’s not a secret you may find that people do know. I can’t work out why it’s obvious from looking at the mums open Facebook page but no one knows. That’s not likely

You haven’t found yourself in a difficult position. You put yourself there. You went through the mother’s Facebook. You can’t tell me it’s a secret that her ‘daughter’ is actually her biological son and it’s a secret she keeps to herself. But she posted recent Facebook photos of him clearly looking like a boy.

This is situation could be far more complex than you know. I am not entirely comfortable outing a child at school. Though, as op said above the child could be I in danger if someone asks the child to be their girlfriend and it later comes out.

I do get the sense the Op is wanting to tell her daughter in the hope she lets the cat out of the bag. And using your child to out another child is a terrible idea.

I am also not sure the school has responsibility to ensure everyone knows that this girl is a boy. Especially if the boy is using private facilities. Trans children are extremely vulnerable. And while they can cause issues for other vulnerable groups, this is a child that is struggling with some sort of issues. the parents could even be the cause of these issues.

It’s a very delicate situation. Where the child in question is very likely to be struggling and possibly a victim of the system that’s in place.

It will become clear very very quickly. If people don’t know already they soon will.

I think it could definitely prompt a situation where you discuss this issue with your daughter and remind them that not everyone is what they appear. Not just in relation to the trans issue. I am more sure I would tell my daughter. Given the current situation he outing this child, even by accident could really cause her problems.

Children need to understand that, actually, they don’t need to be told everything. Their parents might make mistakes in keeping something from them, but more often than not it’s protect them. And as adults we need to make that judgment call. Even if it does come out. There’s no reason for the daughter to know the Op knew.

There is plenty of private information that is not shared with children. This does not mean they are being lied to. It means it is private and none of their business.

The OP said that the child is a boy, but the other children have been told by the staff at the school that he's a girl. So they are being lied to.

Do children have a right to all the private information about another child?

I would have far more issue with this if the child in question was using shared facilities. The other concern is PE.

But I am not sure children should ever expect to be given someone else private Information. Would you expect a teachers medical history to be the knowledge of the children?

Its very complicated for schools.

I am not entirely comfortable outing a child at school.

I'm not at all comfortable with people pretending that children have changed sex. It's harmful to that child as well as harmful to all the other children who are being lied to.

There should be no such thing as 'outing' a child's sex at school. They shouldn't be pretending to be the opposite sex in the first place and the adults around them, both teachers and parents, shouldn't be pretending that they're the opposite sex.

Have they been told that?

Or have they assumed from appearance and name? No teachers ever went through the register and confirmed everyone’s biological sex when my kids were at school.

Trans children are extremely vulnerable.

All children are vulnerable. It's part of being a child. And girls are vulnerable if there are boys who are pretending to be girls and adults aren't telling them that they are really boys.

I am Joe comfortable with that either.

But that’s not the situation we are in. That’s not the situation here. There’s massive concerns around that child. For that child and the other children.

Whether we agree in principle about trans children, isn’t the point. Telling people now would be outing them. Whether we think it should have happened in the first or not. Isn’t going to change this situation.

Is someone's sex private information?

This child obviously doesn’t feel comfortable being themselves authentically (telling their peers they’re trans) so who are you to think that your opinion trumps their safety? If they want other people to know that they’re trans then they will tell them. You are assuming something that may or may not be true.

I didn’t say they weren’t. InFact the sentence after mentions the issue they cause for other vulnerable groups. But you didn’t quote that bit. That’s weird.

But there’s not getting away from the fact that this child is clearly struggling with issues. Could even be child abuse from the parents.

I can’t bring myself to blame the child for the situation they are in. It’s the adults around them.

Of course it is.

If no one knows the sex of the child, then that information is, by default, private.