Is Citizengo having a pro JKR petition a good thing, or will it just confirm to some that GC politics are right wing

[IwantToRetire]

For anyone who hasn't heard about CitizenGo:

CitizenGO is an ultra-conservative advocacy group founded in Madrid, Spain, in 2013 by the ultra-Catholic and far-right HazteOir organization, a similar Spanish platform that has been dedicated to the fight against "gender ideology" since 2001.

The foundation aims to be "a community of active citizens that seeks to promote the participation of society in politics" and "defend and promote life, family, and liberty." It promotes petitions in 50 countries, mostly defending Christian causes, and those opposing same-sex marriage, abortion, and euthanasia.

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CitizenGO

But their politics are quite well known. And it is used by some groups who certainly dont share the politics listed above.

However, does it mean if you sign the petition that you align with the politics of the organiser of the petition, or is it that any acknowledgement of the stand JKR has taken, from any political perspective, should be supported?

Please Note MNHQ! This isn't about linking to a petition but to have a discussion as to whether context outweighs objectives - Thanks

Caroline Farrow, who is one of JK's mates and another prominent GC figure, works for CitizenGo. So if you're worried that simply signing the petition would support an ultra-conservative organisation, you may want to be aware the connection goes deeper than just a petition.

Caroline Farrow is not a GC Feminist. I don't think she and Rowling have ever met, let alone are friends.

I found one supportive tweet from Rowling to Farrow. It's perfectly possible to dislike Farrow's politics and still recognise she's been terribly treated by the police.

Are Caroline Farrow and JK 'mates'?

Source?

Any website can host a petition. It's mostly a data gathering exercise so you can be added to mailing lists. Some of those started on gov.uk petitions site are worthwhile but change.org, 38 degrees etc all pointless IMHO.

No they are not. But Caroline has been hounded and bullied by certain transactivists for years, to extremes, and other women like JKR support her fight.

You can still support someone who's life is being destroyed whilst not agreeing with her viewpoints. Caroline still deserves to live in freedom and not be harrassed and threatened.

Oh I know the background and the way farrow has been targeted by trans activist and treated by the police is appallingly. She deserves support for that, and yes its possible to support her on that, while disagreeing with many of her views.

'Caroline Farrow, who is one of JK's mates and another prominent GC figure'

So, should I file the above under 'lies,' 'damn lies' or 'purposeful obfuscation and mendacity?'

It's not JKR's fault who decides to support her.

I was reminded this weekend of all the nonsense about "right-wing people support gender-critical views, therefore all gender-critical feminists must be right-wing" when I was reading the latest news story about Katharine Birbalsingh.

Birbalsingh is a headteacher with what I regard as very right-wing views, who takes a rigid, uncompromising, disciplinarian approach to education, seemingly designed to stamp down on imagination, creativity, critical thinking - all the stuff I as an old-fashioned lefty think is pretty important.

But Birbalsingh also takes a secular approach to teaching. The school doesn't have a prayer room or religious assemblies, and the canteen only provides vegetarian food, to remove the barriers between different religious groups with different rules about what food they can eat. She says this secular approach enables children to mix well together across cultural boundaries, instead of dividing them.

And now she is being sued by a Muslim pupil for not allowing Muslims to say prayers. And guess what? Although I agree with Birbalsingh about very little, I back her on this.

Does that mean I back her on everything else? Obviously not.

And that's life, isn't it? Sometimes you ally with people on one thing but not on others.

Do you regularly send messages saying "Big love xxx" to people you don't know?

It's absolutely amazing the contortions, bald-faced lies and faux-naivety you lot will employ to deny the obvious connections your movement has to ultra-conservative religious movements and the far right.

Oh give over with the hyperbole. You are obviously quite convinced that everyone who disagrees with you is a far right wrong-un. Nothing anyone here can say is likely to dissuade you of your conviction.

You owe me a new irony meter. Mine has just exploded.

Where is my barefaced lie? I asked for a source.

It's entirely possible to agree generally with someone on one thing (for example farrow has been harassed by some particularly unpleasant TRAs) and disagree with them on something else.

Agreeing on that first point doesn't make someone a far right ultra religious Conservative.

I can't believe this still needs to be explained to people.

I don't care anymore. People who have already decided believing in sex and biology is a right wing, fascist conspiracy will continue to do so. They can crack on.

It's entirely possible to agree generally with someone on one thing (for example farrow has been harassed by some particularly unpleasant TRAs) and disagree with them on something else.

And that is the context of the one message I've seen between JKR and CF. Caroline Farrow was talking about harassment by TRAs and JKR responded in solidarity. Very bad faith to present it any other way, so I imagine this poster is simply mistaken.

I am becoming more and more convinced that gender ideology is rooted in being a bit hard of thinking. I think Caroline Farrow is a fairly unlikeable person, ideologically, but I agree with her on one issue. Doesn't make me a right-wing Christian fundie.

I agree with the Labour Party on most of their policies, except the ones about self-ID. I am still lefty even though I disagree fundamentally with the Party on one issue. Dissenting voices on significant issues is how policies change. I choose to stick with Labour because they're the least worst option overall, and push for change from within.

I am definitely convinced of that, and have been for several years.

😂

PronounssheRa · Today 13:15

Where is my barefaced lie? I asked for a source.

I suspect strongly that you will still be asking, after having turned several pages of the calendar.

If you agree with what JKR is saying and so does an ultra right wing group that doesn't make you ultra right wing - it just means you happen to agree on one specific thing.

I say that as someone who disagrees with JKR. Just because I don't share her views doesn't mean I want to trash anyone who does.

I'm totally with you on the first point BB1, but not the second, as I happen to agree with JKR

From twitter - admittedly some years back:

J.K. Rowling@jk_rowling
Dress however you please.
Call yourself whatever you like.
Sleep with any consenting adult who’ll have you.
Live your best life in peace and security.
But force women out of their jobs for stating that sex is real?
#IStandWithMaya #ThisIsNotADrill

Actually, I'm curious - which bit of the above view do you disagree with?

It's all so messed up - many of the conservative Christian right (esp in the US) actually want to ban Harry Potter because it's about witchcraft and magic and therefore dangerously Satanic.

I wouldn't sign a petition on an anti-abortion anti-feminist website, but I might sign one to defend a GC woman (re a trans issue) even if I disagreed with her other views, if it wasn't connected to such a website. Although like a PP I'm sceptical on how much difference petitions make.

I've declared undying love (or words to that effect) to someone I've never met, and know nothing about but tweets cute otter videos and is an ABBA superfan! Does that mean I personally know them and their views and agree with them on everything (I mean I like Abba, but they aren't in my top ten favourite bands)? Or does it just mean that I thought a particular tweett and otter video brightened up my day a bit?

The trans activists and woke people in general seem to insist that everyone who does not agree with all their opinions about "social justice" is right wing. And everyone right wing is "evil" or "stupid".

We need to stop playing into their mind games and just let it go.

Not only does a complex free society need left, centre and right people to strike a balance but most are not stuck in a box and have some right wing views and a few left and some centre. The world is not black and white.

We are also not one dimensional beings. We all agree and disagree on things with everyone on the planet. That includes people you don't like.

Now so happens that critical queer theory and it's offspring gender ideology are so utterly fucked up and dangerous that it has managed to do the one thing nothing or no one has every achieved before: it has united almost everyone on one issue. And I do mean almost everyone; radfems and MRA's, the religious and the atheists, the left and right, liberals and conservatives, rich and poor, straight and gay, educated and uneducated, etc etc etc

Maybe you don't like it, but we're all on the same team here against gender ideology. So I suggest you all get used to it.

The tide is turning and the last stretch is going to be a real bumpy ride.

The trans activists and woke people in general seem to insist that everyone who does not agree with all their opinions about "social justice" is right wing. And everyone right wing is "evil" or "stupid".

We need to stop playing into their mind games and just let it go.

Yep. It's so bloody tiresome. And predictable.

Although I do feel we have had endless threads about how shameful it is that it nearly always seems to be right wing newspapers etc., who ever report on GC issues, as was trying to ask a slightly different question.

The petition has been started by Citizengo itself. ie the origins / influences must be inline with their politics.

So in signing the petition are you (by default) validating their political analysis which are completely different to say a petition started by a GC group - or even a group of authors who think her personal opinions are her own, but she shouldn't have her publications etc., boycotted because of those views.

I am just interested as I think this is different say to sharing an article published in a right wing paper which covers issues relating to the biological reality of sex.

Given the politics of the web site it is relevant what their end goal is, and that for them JKR is a popular figure to help get people to that goal.

Anymore than the Thatcherite argument that the sale of council housing meant that "ordinary" people could be home owners, but ignoring the fact that the other outcome was the increasing scarcity of social housing because the sale of council housing was on the proviso that proceeds from the sale could not be used to build more houses.