"Transphobic bullying is rife": 15 y/o trans boy's view of coming out at school

[ButterflyHatched]

A rare and refreshing example of the mainstream media actually publishing a young trans person's own words on the subject of their own existence and how the government's draft guidance is likely to affect the people it directly pertains to.

‘Transphobic bullying is rife’: a 15-year-old trans boy’s view of coming out at school | Transgender | The Guardian

And yet that wasn't why she was murdered.

The Japanese anime obsession is probably worth an entire investigation (and separate thread) of its own, because it's a substantial matter that could go on and on.

A lot to do with just watching anime, but also to do with them normally being depicted as very submissive, which isn't what these bullies are trying to recreate. But through their online identities they try to portray themselves as the ideal woman (which for them is an attractive submissive young woman), you hear a lot "I'm a better woman than you".

There is definitely a thing amongst girls who identify as trans boys for anime names.

There are basically 4 categories:

California surfer circa 1980 (Zak, Kai, Aidan, Erik)

Nature & Outdoors (River, Aspen, Orion, Hunter)

Anime inspired (Ash, Viktor, Rin, Akira)

and

Victorian ghost boy (Edmund, Vincent, Arthur, Felix)

In regards to moderation, I've found that moderators (not on this site) become too powerful and a number of sites slowly descend into allowed speech, as in comments are pre-moderated and the slightest most polite alternative views are blocked. It's easy to see where indoctrination comes from.

Victorian ghost boy

😂

The two gender-questioning teen girls that I know definitely fit the '80s surfer' and anime name situation, sadly.

The teen author of the Guardian story in this thread’s OP goes by a name that peaked in popularity in 1880 but was ranked 8,760 in the approx year of the author’s birth 😬

(my family trans-identifying teen is also a Victorian Ghost Boy!)

I'd love to hear more about your experiences of this and compare notes, especially the online gaming side of things. (Letting my clan know that I was 16 wasn't the smartest move - the amount of creepiness that ensued was truly withering though it did instill a healthy respect for online infosec)

We are nearly at the end of this thread, though. Possibly worth starting a new one to be able to do it justice?

@ButterflyHatched Is there really any point starting a new thread when you refuse to engage with what people are saying?

I have yet to see you even attempt to see things from a point of view other than your own.

I would like a new thread on the topic that Red brought up. I find it interesting and see the difference in my own two daughters: one into K pop and active on Discord, one into swimming and only on tiktok. Guess which one was very twaw?

“I’d really like to talk about anything other than the questions I’ve been asked about the illogical points I’ve made on the thread I started.”

Plus the attempt of force teaming with red, after the realisation that she's one of the most popular posters here and goading her was a mistake.

on the other hand, it's perfectly possible that butterfly is completely oblivious and doesn't see why they and red can't have a comfortable coze despite the offensive posting.

Yeah it's all just so fucking predictable, isn't it?

Link to a puff piece giving the opinion of a 15 year old with a special identity that new guidance saying that teachers shouldn't just do what 15 year olds with special identities want them to is dangerous and will cause a rise in "transphobia".

Endless posts talking about their own identity and feelings, where the only pronouns in sight are "me" and "I".

Incessant labelling of anyone challenging these beliefs as anti trans bigots.

Total refusal to answer any awkward questions, such as why women and girls shouldn't be allowed to define themselves according to their sex and have words for that and spaces and sports based on it.

Then finally a claim that the discussion has been interesting and a suggestion that a new thread should be started.

What, so you can show your total lack of understanding and respect for women for another 1000 posts?

Legend. 🙏

Back to the child in the OP. As tedious and self obsessed as they sound, I do think it is worth reflecting on why they don't want to be women.

I can't help but think that when adult males with very, er, peculiar ideas about what it means to be a woman start controlling the narrative about what a woman is, it's not entirely surprising that teenage girls think, well that's not me.

The problem is that society is affirming their belief that they are not women because a woman is what these men say a woman is, rather than saying, "Look, ignore those people over there. They're not women. We are. And so are you. And yes, it can be bloody hard and a bit shit at times, but there can also be moments of great joy in being a woman, if you are open to them. But if you reject womanhood, you won't actually be able to identify out of the shit parts. That's not how it works. Your body will still be female and society will still treat you as female. All it will mean is that you ruin your body and can no longer experience the joyful parts. So don't do it. Stick with us. We will look after you. Ignore those men over there, they have absolutely no idea what they are talking about."

Grr, meant to quote this post previously… have been dipping in and out of this thread over its duration, the thing that stands out always on things like this is (as @MargotBamborough and others say) is the pure individualism. Their experience trumps not only the lived experience of women but the statistics. Every time.

That's exactly what Stephanie Davis Arai of Transgender Trend said.

That girls look at boys in their school who identify as girls, and their over-the-top femininity, or self sexualisation, and think if that's a girl, what the hell am I?

Exactly.

@MargotBamborough I can't help but think that when adult males with very, er, peculiar ideas about what it means to be a woman start controlling the narrative about what a woman is, it's not entirely surprising that teenage girls think, well that's not me

Indeed. Birdy Rose summed it up quite well a while back.

Sadly kids will bully other kids for ANY reason, anything that makes them a target they'll bully them for it. The child in the article is sadly very naive.

Datun said: 'That girls look at boys in their school who identify as girls, and their over-the-top femininity, or self sexualisation, and think if that's a girl, what the hell am I?'

It's worse than that though, it's the worst type of performative femininity, the most degrading stereotypes and sexualisation. It is women = whore, cum bucket, fuck hole, dead eyes and expactant anus. We have all seen these very terms used, and regularly enough to know that it runs through the whole rotten thing. The shock when malaga people go to their reddit hugbox after being 'misgendered' saying '... but I have long hair and I was wearing a skirt!' It's a woman costume that is completely untethered from biological reality.

Well I'm in good company then. She is a very sensible woman.

This is another reason why it is SO important to be able to say, "They are not women, they are men."

We owe it to our girls and young women to say, "Look, all this Dylan Mulvaney shit has nothing to do with being a woman. It's not surprising that you don't identify with that. No woman does. He is an attention seeking gay man on the make and if we all ignore him he will go away."

Incidentally, I strongly suspect that the reason Dylan has not adopted a more feminine name is because he is planning to capitalise on his existing fame once there's no more money to be made in pretending to be a girl.

I don't see how asking Red about why she fell out with her trans sister 18 years ago and whether they have been able to repair their relationship since is goading.

I've just been under nearly 40 pages of inquisition over whether it's possible for a young transitioner with a genetic condition to experience misogyny and indeed whether it is possible for her to even exist at all. Since we eventually managed to laboriously reach a point where some posters were willing to entertain the notion that the base reality of my entire existence is actually physically possible, and one of the most hostile voices has been Red, I think I'm allowed to ask a fellow poster why she has been so consistently hostile and how that hostility affects her family?

Is it 'force teaming' to acknowledge misogyny in online gaming exists, has done since the very beginning, and want a discussion about it in another thread? If so then I'm very sorry that I've experienced these things since I was a child but it doesn't make them any less real.

I think I'm allowed to ask a fellow poster why she has been so consistently hostile and how that hostility affects her family?

yep

not goady at all

nope nope nope

why can’t you answer margots question?

I agree. I’d be interested in a separate thread about the wider social and online media context which affects whether children are drawn into this “community”.