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Peasand · 22/12/2023 15:48

I wonder how they deal with criminals referring to themselves as innocent

Soubriquet · 22/12/2023 16:46

Yeah I got the same stupid reply. Sod the poor children ey. As long as this monster is validated

catduckgoose · 22/12/2023 18:31

Sd1960 · 22/12/2023 15:14

Check the Tameside Reporter newspaper which correctly reported O’Brien as transgender and called out the police on referring to him as female

Thank you, I sent a follow-up complaint citing that Tameside Reporter article as one which involved actual journalism instead of parroting press releases, and asked why BBC journalists didn't do this.

https://www.questmedianetwork.co.uk/news/tameside-reporter/transgender-woman-incited-lover-to-sexually-abuse-four-year-old-boy/

Transgender woman incited lover to sexually abuse four-year-old boy

A transgender woman, from Tameside, has been jailed for encouraging the sexual abuse a four-year-old boy.

https://www.questmedianetwork.co.uk/news/tameside-reporter/transgender-woman-incited-lover-to-sexually-abuse-four-year-old-boy

AncientQuercus · 22/12/2023 18:42

I got the identical email this afternoon. Is anyone planning to take it further?

Rosiestweetlikes · 22/12/2023 19:05

Yes @AncientQuercus

Sd1960 · 22/12/2023 19:38

They hide behind the Ipso regulations. There is a public interest defence which I took advice on. There can be little more in the public interest than the full identification of a sexual predator who preys on young children.

ScrollingLeaves · 22/12/2023 21:46

Very shocked by the BBC answer to my complaint. They say they refer to the person as they refer to themselves, and as the police did.

So what exactly are they, the BBC, contributing to the reporting of facts?

Answer I got:

Thank you for getting in touch about our coverage of the sentencing of Naomi O'Brien, described by a Greater Manchester Police detective inspector as ‘a predatory woman’. We reported: “The 31-year-old was convicted of five offences and jailed for four years and three months at Manchester's Minshull Street Crown Court.”

Some readers objected to us describing her as a woman, maintaining she was transgender and had previously been a man.

Our reporting was based on the court proceedings and a press release issued by Greater Manchester Police in which they describe Naomi O’Brien as a female. We checked with them and they told us that “she identifies as a woman”. They used female pronouns and we reported accordingly.

BBC News editorial practice is to refer to trans people as they refer to themselves. In our reporting we use the term and pronoun used by the person in question, as we did here. Greater Manchester police followed the same style.

We are sorry if you did not appreciate the way we covered this particular case but would like to thank you again for contacting us to make your views known. All feedback from readers is appreciated and shared with senior editors so that they are aware of audience concerns.

Kind regards,

BBC Complaints Team
www.bbc.co.uk/complaints

Complaints | Contact the BBC

These pages have information about how to complain to the BBC, with links to the BBC’s Complaints Framework, the BBC’s regulator Ofcom and regular reports about complaints. If you would like to understand how we collect and use personal data, please r...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/complaints

ScrollingLeaves · 22/12/2023 21:50

I see it is a paste answer sent to all.

Catiette · 22/12/2023 21:53

I’m taking it further. It’s upset me more than anything else this year. The standards the BBC proudly proclaim they uphold in this reply mean that the public

  • Won’t know about the next Isla Bryson
  • Won’t be told if men are setting impossible sporting records women can’t beat
  • Won‘t know that the hypothetical female in a red car they should warn their children about is, in fact, a male
  • Won‘t know that the woman called Suzie they‘re voting for to defend their interests has an inherent bias against female-only spaces…

I could go on.

This is actively dangerous and profoundly anti-democratic.

And it doesn’t affect men in the same way - when was the last time you saw a transman take a woman’s place in sport, politics or the public arena?

We‘re used to the appropriation of woman, & being de-sensitised to the loss of female, but until now I’ve NEVER not seen this qualified by a reference to birth sex.

Their literally, shamelessly stating that they accept women & female as self-identified is, to me, a watershed moment. It formalises, in writing, on a large scale, their rejection of any obligation to report accurately on sex.

This is huge.

Please fight it.

ScrollingLeaves · 22/12/2023 22:02

Peasand · Today 15:48

I wonder how they deal with criminals referring to themselves as innocent

Please would you write and ask them?

Who is working there, replying to a huge number of complaints over false information in a supposed news report by stating that they describe a criminal as that person describes themselves [rather than describing what they actually are] as though that is the only sane and justified position to take?

How can they think they are making sense?

It is the end of their integrity.

Catiette · 22/12/2023 22:11

I always felt I could at least rely on the “tell” until now - the “born male” / “previously known as” / photograph.

If they’re phasing this out to the extent they’re prepared to put in writing what they do above, we’re in real trouble.

All those “Well, women are as much of a risk?” defences? Our gold-standard national broadcaster will evidence it.

The wonderful moments that peppered my childhood of taking pride in reported female firsts? Our daughters will lose that lovely certainty & hope.

Equal opportunity monitoring & reporting? Gone.

catduckgoose · 22/12/2023 22:54

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Peasand · 22/12/2023 23:27

Could someone who knows tell me how to take it further, I’ll have plenty of time after Christmas to email

Catiette · 22/12/2023 23:30

Yep, Peas. Have done a follow-up complaint once or twice before & it was straightforward. Fairly sure it was following the standard complaints route, but along the way there’s an option to tick a box saying this was pursuant to a prior complaint?

Peasand · 22/12/2023 23:33

which email address is it

Peasand · 22/12/2023 23:34

Can I reply to their email

catscatscurrantscurrants · 22/12/2023 23:55

I got the same standard response. Have tried to follow up on the complaint, but BBC website refuses to accept the case number, saying that it 'does not fit required field', despite asking me to enter the number. Convenient.

Boomboom22 · 22/12/2023 23:58

What about tweeting it to the panorama team / news night/ sky news / the times / the telegraph/ gb news to highlight it?

Boomboom22 · 23/12/2023 00:00

And forward it to your mp with an explanation of why this is a lie, especially female rather than woman which is I think, new.

hellsBells246 · 23/12/2023 09:19

WinterParakeets · 22/12/2023 15:25

I take issue with this:

"BBC News editorial practice is to refer to trans people as they refer to themselves. In our reporting we use the term and pronoun used by the person in question, as we did here." It contravenes their directive to report in a manner which is informative and educative.

I think it would be useful to ask them to reconsider this editorial practise in the interest of clarity and accuracy. Best editorial practise would be factual accuracy not a criminal's preferred obfuscation, surely?

I got the same reply and I take issue with the whole bloody response. Reporters are meant to report on truth, not fairy tales.

hellsBells246 · 23/12/2023 09:30

I've just complained about their pathetic response. You just put in the complaint number when asked to.

hellsBells246 · 23/12/2023 09:31

catscatscurrantscurrants · 22/12/2023 23:55

I got the same standard response. Have tried to follow up on the complaint, but BBC website refuses to accept the case number, saying that it 'does not fit required field', despite asking me to enter the number. Convenient.

Mine did.

Catiette · 23/12/2023 10:15

Also, that use of „maintains“. A verb that may as well mean „clings on to an untenable position despite the evidence to the contrary.“ The prisoner maintains his innocence. Gaslighting. I also wonder if the timing of the response is to deter follow-up. Busy time. Cynical, but…

catscatscurrantscurrants · 23/12/2023 11:10

By copying and pasting the case number from the BBC's email to me, I managed to get the form to accept it. No amount of me typing the same sequence worked! I pointed out that they had not addressed the important issue of the crime being recorded as a female crime despite being committed by a male, that this skewed national crime statistics, that they could have chosen to report factually but did not, and this was unacceptable behaviour in a national broadcaster.