DD feeling bad after mis-gendering sub teacher.

[ImDuranDuran]

On the way home this afternoon, DD14 explained how she is 'in trouble' after addressing her sub teacher as 'Sir' during a lesson.

It's the first time the teacher has subbed for the class.

Apparently teacher snapped back "Actually it's 'Miss' to you!".

I asked DD if the teacher had made any announcement at the beginning of the lesson regarding pronoun preference and she's adamant that they did not.

I'm concerned that DD now thinks she's in trouble and to be honest I'm pissed off. It was a genuine mistake and she's 14. She would never intentionally try to embarrass a teacher.

If the teacher had pulled her aside afterwards and explained the situation I might be more understanding.

Should I just leave it?

A non-binary person would be they/them they wouldn’t use the pronoun ‘she’.

I know many female teachers who go by Mx because they don’t like the Mrs/Miss and for letters/emails, so I assume a non-binary teacher would also use this.

A non-binary teacher not want to be called sir/miss or he/she because they apparently don’t have a gender 🙄

It might slow it for 30 seconds but if the attendance officer can't cross reference who was allocated what class as supply and all staff can't immediately find where a kid is meant to be I'd be way more concerned.
You would not need the kids to give a detailed description, schools know who is where.

Don't try and deflect by accusing me of being sexist, just because you have no good answer to what I've said

I'm not deflecting, your post was blatantly sexist and ignorant. Whoever said trans women had to dress 'obviously as a woman'? What utter bullshit.

And what does dressing obviously as a woman even mean? The point about my great aunt was that she's been a biological woman for 86 years but has never dressed 'obviously' as such, so depending on your logic what in the name of god does that make her?

A non-binary person would be they/them they wouldn’t use the pronoun ‘she’.

Plenty of "non binary" people use either he or she, either instead of or in addition to they/them. You are uninformed.

That is Duran point though. It is tw who are sexist by saying women have to dress a certain way. Men are men however they dress and women are women. Wearing a dress doesn't make you a woman. Having short hair doesn't make you a man. It is TRA who say it does and are sexist not Duran for pointing it out.

Sorry you are Duran
Whoever you are quoting but not quoting is not sexist but identifying the sexism of gender ideology.

The teacher could have, or rather should have, started the lesson by stating their name. E.g. "I'm Ms Spikyhair and I'm taking your class today". Or, write it on the board at the front of the classroom.
That would have been sensible.

Reading some of these responses I have realised that I am obviously not a female as I wear trousers but never wear make up.

This is a sensible approach.

No they don’t, that’s the whole point of being non-binary because they don’t like using pronouns which suggest gender.

Its ‘fisherthem’ not ‘fisherman’.

I think you are a bit confused about the difference between non-binary and trans.

Its a bit of a minefield and can be confusing.

Even if this teacher had written 'Miss _' on the board, followed by preferred pronouns, students still might call this teacher sir. Because they can tell it's a man, so the cognitive dissonance made them slip up. Or they just said the wrong word, which happens to all teachers. Or they were unsure, and went with a best guess. Or you may always have one that is being deliberately rude.

The students aren't the issue. The teacher's reaction is. If dd's telling is corrsct, make a complaint.

Lol @Night409 you clearly haven't been keeping up with trends if you don't realise the shifting sands upon which the definition of 'nonbinary' is built.

There are a lot of people who claim the (actually impossible) state of non binary-ness who interchangeably use sexed vs neutral pronouns. It not your fault, the rules keep changing so I appreciate it's hard to keep up, but your binary definitions are actually inaccurate.

But that is the issue with the trans ideology - it is built on stereotypes.

If you are a biological female but like football, fancy girls and don’t like make up - then you must be born in the wrong body.

If you’re a biological male but fancy boys, like the theatre and don’t drink beer - then you must have been meant to be born a female.

There is absolutely no trans woman, who is trying to present themselves as a female, who would dress like a man - that wouldn’t make sense.
They wouldn’t not want to be called ‘her’ but then present themselves as a male.

A biological woman wanting to present as a man and be called a man, wouldn’t wear a dress, heels, make up and have long hair.

A biological man wanting to present as a women and be called her, would not have short hair and wear masculine clothes.

If this was a man in a dress it would be different, but it wasn’t.

Is it sexist or stereotyping - yes absolutely.

But that is the issue with the trans movement, it is built on sexist stereotypes.

There seems to be an assumption this took place in a classroom with a single supply teacher standing in front of a board and 30+ seated kids for the entire lesson.

The tracksuit says PE teacher to me although school dress codes vary and I might be wrong.

We don't know the full facts, quite rightly so, but I can envisage a games lesson on a playing field for example with loads and loads of kids and other staff moving around where it would be possible to make a genuine mistake if the interaction was only fleeting.

I agree the sensible approach is the 'constructive feedback' one - suggest that teachers should always introduce themselves and that the 'snapping' was unprofessional and upsetting.

@Night409

They wouldn’t not want to be called ‘her’ but then present themselves as a male.

Meet Danielle Muscato. A She/her. How would you know, at first glance, if this individual thought of themselves as a woman?

No they don’t, that’s the whole point of being non-binary because they don’t like using pronouns which suggest gender.

No, as @CandyLeBonBon also pointed out, this isn't always the case. I'm not confused at all. I am very aware of these people and their lack of consistency.

This person says they're a man: 

This person says they're a man (sorry pic didn't attach last time!):

I’d be fucking blazing and the head teacher would be left in no doubt that my child was there to learn and not pander to a teacher’s personal indulgence. I’d actually want to say fetish or delusion, but I’d keep it polite.

Tbh I think the teacher not providing his pronouns is a red herring. Our children aren’t there to be gaslit.

I think what some posters are missing is that plenty of "non binary" people are the type of people who deliberately seek out conflict and control of others. Their rules are confusing because they want people to slip up. It's a power trip.

I'd argue that the majority of us are 'non binary' tbh. I don't identify as a woman, and often don't feel like I fit comfortably in the feminine category. I have some typically 'masculine traits' and imagine I'm very far from alone in that. Same for a lot of men I'd guess. So it's not really the special club these people seem to think it is.

YY. Everyone who has ever walked on the earth is "non binary", we just don't give a label to our personality traits.

I've never known a female teacher to go by 'Mx' - only 'Ms'. I have seen a man who identifies as non-binary using 'Mx' in a school.

I've seen some "non-binary" men who have shared their pronouns online as 'They/She'. Rather confusing.

It could well be that this was a PE teacher doing some general supply in addition to PE duties.

When I was working full-time, PE staff normally wore their tracksuits all day because there was no time to get changed if they were given a cover class in another department.

Not sure whether to laugh or cry at that!

I have an issue with stereotypes and young people thinking that liking X, Y and Z must mean they are a male/female.

So in theory, I should respect these people more but then I laughed and shook my head when I saw them 🤔

I can’t work out if this is better or worse.