Conversion therapy to be banned - Sunak

[BeetleDeuce]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/19/rishi-sunak-ban-gay-and-trans-conversion-practices

Apparently Sunak to add this to the King’s Speech, banning conversion therapies for trans and gay people.

This is a potential nightmare for counsellors/psychotherapists/NHS services who want to explore trans people’s experiences of trauma and other sources of gender dysphoria. It basically means “affirming only” as far as I can tell. This is exactly why this was always a bad idea.

So no more conversion of gay children into trans?

There is no conspiracy. The bill is happening because Tory MPs want it to happen and threatened to revolt if it was delayed any longer.

The social law equivalent of the Labour treasury secretary in 2010 leaving a letter in the desk at No. 11 to the new chancellor George Osborne saying "sorry, there's no more money left".

No. It fails entirely if the Tories lose. Labour don't have to pick it up.

And because none of them have properly thought any of it through. They’re just being reactive to a fear they won’t be re-elected.

possibly.

But it doesn’t need to be a conspiracy. Incompetence is a totally viable
explanation for this.

The problem on "thinking it through" is that if an MP (or anyone in civic life) did this, they'd almost certainly come to the conclusion there's no such thing as a Trans Child, and the "need" for a trans conversion law would be both unnecessary and counter productive.

However I believe no MP or policy person in the UK, the West in general, could ever admit or confess to such a conclusion. So much easier not to think critically, and be a sheep here.

I think we have to all realise that civic institutions are going in one direction, and our public servants won't buck this trend. Rumours even that Kemi Badenoch won't object to the Bill. Can Miriam Cates also bury her objections?

They're not being "reactive". This Bill has been in the pipeline since PM May and was backed by PM Johnson. Nor do I think they're worried about losing votes if they ditch it. The Tory party has loads of TRAs and allies who see this bill as a really good thing and are committed to it.

Eurgh to referring to British prime ministers as PM May and PM Johnson.

it was kicked into the long grass and they’re being weird and reactive in dragging it back out now.

I think we have to all realise that civic institutions are going in one direction, and our public servants won't buck this trend. Rumours even that Kemi Badenoch won't object to the Bill. Can Miriam Cates also bury her objections?
That's an interesting thought. All this time I've been agonising over who to vote for, but now I'm starting to wonder if I've been asking myself the wrong question.

I'm settling on the opinion now that this law will be a law whether the Tories do it or not, because Labour certainly will.

After Rayner's prostrating herself at the Pink News event the other evening, this will be existential for her.

Better Sunak does it now, with as tight wording as possible protecting the taking therapies and parental rights, setting in stone legislation that Starmer would not dare to revisit when he assumes power.

If it's left to Labour, someone switch off the lights.

Just to add to the mix of all those speculating about why now, why the change in direction, here is Janice Turner's version (sorry if already posted) which implies that no one has any back bone and there is a slim chance that Kemi Badenoch is the only one sticking to her principles (even though compromised by other Tories' wibble wabble)

With such complexity in mind Kemi Badenoch, equalities minister, and Baroness Falkner, head of the Equality and Human Rights Commission, are proposing pre-legislative scrutiny in both houses of parliament on the conversion bill to address all possible consequences. While the Tory right has opposed the ban largely as a culture wars weapon, Badenoch cares deeply that progress she has made unpicking gender ideology will be undone by a Labour landslide. Presented with careful definitions, Starmer’s party may stick with them; left to create their own, Stonewall may exert influence.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/a0c8f7ec-6f70-11ee-b5d7-5487922f056f?shareToken=32cb444c7cd828fe035ea2f3162d54d5&

Sorry should have added not sure how long the share token on the JT article will last.

Have checked and it is archived on https://archive.ph where you just need to paste the Times link into the box provided.

PS I know some of us think JT should be on the naughty step because of her personal attack on Glinner, but thought worth reading as she may well be one of the those journalists that people in the civil service or even the tory party leak things to.

PM Sunak backtracked because Tory MPs and ministers demanded it and threatened to quit if he didn't go forward with the Bill. It had been held up when Trans was removed. But earlier this year Trans was reinstated.

So the Tory proponents and creators of this Bill are making sure it is coming to fruition before the next GE.

https://www.itv.com/news/2023-10-19/rishi-sunak-set-to-ban-conversion-therapy-in-england-and-wales

Good. Get it right. Because I can guarantee Labour won't. Especially because the likes of Rayner and Iain Anderson will get their grubby GI political paws all over Labour legislation.

We need a trans conversion ban that is worded absolutely with an eye towards Cass criticisms, and the overarching necessity to not criminalise the talking therapies, parental/family discussions, exploratory approaches.

So do it now, and get it right. And get it so right that Starmer won't dare open it up after the GE.

There is no getting it right here. If they wanted to get it right, Trans wouldn't be part of it at all. This legistlation does fuck all to protect the vulnerable or safeguard women's rights. All it does is further the TRA cause at the hands of TRAs in the Tory party who were so committed to getting it through, they threatened the PM with revolt and resignations.

The only people this Bill is getting it right for is the TRAs. It's a fucking unmitigated disaster.

You'll get no argument from me this is a disaster. Blunt, May, Mordant, Noakes, Millar, Keegan, they have their fingerprints all over this.

I'm afraid only one conclusion can be made, politics is divided into three groups, as it always has been.

Those that will work tirelessly to get an outcome. Crispin Blunt has never left this alone, a trans conversion ban may not quite be the Self ID law he wanted, but it sets up the possibility at a later date. You can also throw Harriet Harman in here, her slice of PIE is still sitting in her larder.

Those that are complicit in many ways, the politicians and "leaders" who have no moral compass or principles, those for whom politics is just a means to an end of career advancement. Sunak fits the bill perfectly. And maybe 75%+ of jobbing MPs.

The small number who do speak out, have some principles, some consistency. The jury is out on so many, but love her or hate her for her political opinions, Badenoch fits the bill. Cates and Kruger as well. Rosie Duffield.

Back in the day, yes many MPs were careerists as well, but there were the Tony Benns and Barbara Cartlands and Mo Mowlams and of course Maggie Thatchers and Keith Josephs who spoke their mind, and challenged their parties.

Today? Who will genuinely hold the govts feet to the fire on the trans conversion ban legislation?

If it's found wanting, will Badenoch, Cates and Kruger quit?

What do you see as a way for a labour getting it right? Abandoning it would be ideal but what's the plan b?

Yes, given that Boots is dead sure Labour will get in, and we have a good idea what Labour would do with this, what is the best way to mitigate the pile of shit that will be?

I have no idea what Labour will do. I don't know what any coalition government will do.

What I know is the TRAs in this Tory government haven't finished ballsing things up for women and children yet. Nice of them to leave a toxic legacy. I wonder what their next surprise will be?

For me, the biggest test where they've failed is inability, or active refusal, to end non transparency of gender teaching in schools. This could have been done purely by simple decree by the SoS.
But no, it's been left as murky and impenetrable.

It seems the only reason that Sunak stood up to Sturgeon on A20 re their Self ID law was purely party politics, to create a buzz. Purely performative.

But the lack of openess in schools. For me, that's the ultimate test for the party I've voted for since 1983. And they've failed miserably.

If anyone's unsure of what might constitute 'conversion therapy', I've seen varous people on Twitter suggest Dr Hakeem is a 'conversion therapist'.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4924897-4924897-dr-hakeem-speaks-the-truth-again

Bio:

Biography

Born in North Wales and educated at Rydal School before studying Medicine at University College London. Completed House Officer posts in Medicine and Surgery at London and Glasgow teaching hospitals. Completed Senior House Officer training in Psychiatry on the Royal Free Hospital training scheme and gained membership of The Royal College of Psychiatrists.
Completed Higher Specialist Training in Forensic Psychiatry and Psychotherapy at The Tavistock and Portman Clinics alongside a Kleinian full training analysis.
Following his individual psychoanalytic psychotherapy training he then trained as a Group Analyst at The Institute of Group Analysis, London (IGA) and completed an MSc in Group Analysis at Birkbeck University for which he was awarded a distinction.
Dr Az Hakeem worked as a Consultant Psychiatrist in General Psychiatry & Psychotherapy at Camden & Islington and in Forensic Psychotherapy at The Portman Clinic where he worked for 12 years until 2012. During 2012 he completed a one year sabbatical in Sydney, Australia. He remains a senior lecturer in Psychiatry at the University of New South Wales. In addition to his clinical work, Dr Az Hakeem has worked as a consultant to the media on a number of TV programmes both on and off screen.
In 2011, in recognition of his contribution to Psychiatry Dr Az Hakeem was awarded Fellowship to The Royal College of Psychiatrists. In recognition of his contribution to Psychiatry and specialist Psychotherapy.
After over 15 years working in the NHS, Dr Hakeem now works exclusively in private practice and he was a Consultant at The Priory Hospital Roehampton for eight years.
In 2017 Dr Az Hakeem became part of The Shaw Mind Foundation for whom he is a Founder, Professional Patron and Ambassador. The Shaw Mind Foundation is an exciting mental health charity working synergistically with schools and workplaces along with other existing mental health charities to increase awareness and reduce stigma in relation to mental health.
2019 also saw Dr Hakeem’s appointment as Honorary Associate Clinical Professor at University College London (UCL) Medical School.

Qualifications

Medicine MBBS : University College London
Fellow of The Royal College of Psychiatrists
CCST in Forensic Psychiatry
CCST in Psychotherapy
MSc Group Analysis

Training

University College London
The Royal College of Psychiatrists
Royal Free Hospital Training Scheme
The Tavistock Centre
The Portman Clinic
The Anna Freud Centre
The Institute of Group Analysis
Birkbeck University

Source:

http://www.drazhakeem.com/about/

Sun reporting it's been dropped:

x.com/kateferguson4/status/1715797072782242020?s=20

This may be related:

https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1715825764942123330

'MPs opposed will meet on Monday and are trying to see PM face to face to make their concerns heard. Conservative Party is deeply divided over the matter of banning conversion therapy. No10 simply say wait for Kings Speech.'

Every time Boots posts these boring repetitive its all the tories fault, its worth remembering that the tories also stopped the proposed changes to the GRA, and have at least responsed to the notion that what is going on in schools is wrong and that women have the right to single sex services.

Even without Labour being in power we know that they would not have done any of this.

Unfortunately those who just want to use the attack on women's sex based rights to bring out the usual boring party slogan type posts, show that women aren't a priority for them.

And also, if that was / is the intention, make the case for Labour look any stronger. A bit of an own goal.