Gym /. Swimming changing issue

[BelfastDadof3]

I'll start first and say I'm sorry for intruding on a safe space for women.
Am a single dad (widow but not recent) with three kids 2 girls 11 +13 and a 9yr old boy.

Also I'd say kids are bright and confident, very excepting as I've tried to bring them up to accept all body shapes and not point / shame.

I go to the gym three times a week, do my workout and the kids have a supervised kids swim lesson (just the three of them) and I meet them after for a swim and play.

There isn't family changing, but I don't think it's applicable as my girls are old enough.

So having a muffin after the swim my 9yr old boy asked me.
"dad, why do most of the men walk about naked in the changing room?Willie's out. Is it not normal to have a towel around you untill you get your pants on."

So I said some people were just very free, but I think it's a bit over the top. Bit of a discussion about respecting others space etc and then my boy said" it's also odd that some shave all their body hair off, even the old fat men, it's weird looking"

Normal ish conversation.

Then he asked the girls what happens in the changing rooms. They were a bit horrified and said that most women and girls had big towels and kept private. Because - their words " girls arnt horrible like boys"

Then the eldest daughter said "a room full of men drying their bits would be duscusting. When the [transwoman - edited by MNHQ] is in the changing room we use the disabled cubicle. There's lots of room and we don't have to see him dry his bits. And (jokingly) his man bum and huge boobs do not look nice."

So really I don't know how to approach this.
I presumed that if a man transfered to a trans woman he would have female genitals. Maybe I'm niave.

It's a really nice gym and pool - Bannatynes - a treat for the kids..
Is this the same everywhere?
If I raise it with the manager am I being transphobic to suggest no penises in the female changing?

This isn't another chatbot is it? Has a certain feel.....

Statements that have reinforced the implication that @CalMeKate has tried to claim that males with a trans identity, in various stages of transition, are not at least the same risk as all male people in the UK.

"The behaviour is what is important. If the behaviour feels wrong it probably is. The fact the transwomen has breast implants implies to me that this isn’t a man pretending but someone who was born male and now identifies as female."

and

Statistically men are far more dangerous to women and girls that transwomen are.

and

"However MEN far outweigh the balance of predatory risk"

That is a claim that needs to be backed up with evidence. Otherwise those reading along will simply treat all your statements with the same credibility.

You must have these statistics to make such a claim. Otherwise you are incredibly dishonest.

You say strange behaviour but then presumably don’t define a surprise penis as strange (although it would make you uncomfortable) and expect girls to hide and wait for the person to leave?

Am I reading this right?

You ask about transgirls. I still see no reason why a boy who presents as a girl should not change with the boys or have a space of their own. They are no different from the other boys except in hairstyle and outfit choice. As soon as children are separate by sex there is no actual reason for putting them in with the girls. Why should girls have to try and wrap their heads around all this when adults can’t? Why are girls expected to be uncomfortable and be told they are in the wrong for feeling that way? Why don’t we find a way that means girls and women only need to see male genitalia with full, uncoerced consent?

Right. Reading that back to you now:

'Your children are interacting with transpeople and you can either inform your children and prepare them for this world, our society, in an effort to keep them as safe as possible.'

🤔

It’s really not your only agenda is it? Despite your twisting and turning and what if’s we can all see what you’ve posted here

Thankfully my DS is an adult now and had his childhood in the more simple times when men claiming to be women and waving their penis in front of young children in a female only space would mean being forcibly removed and chucked in a police cell.

My DS is very chilled very live and let live but hasn’t fallen for gaslighting around men being women because they say so.

A classmate of his was a trans man and everyone respected his choices but I don’t ever recall them trying to enter the boys changing rooms and show their breasts and vagina.

Funny it only seems to be a one way street with which biological sex seem to think being naked in spaces nor made for them is their right and fuck those pesky women’s rights.

Safe from what, I wonder?

Mosquitos?

A wolf in sheep's clothing?

A male with special fee fees in a female single sex changing room with his penis exposed?

Now why would they need to be kept safe from the lovely transwoman?

If not it is somebody who doesn't know the difference between singular and plural. Hmm.

All of our children are growing up in a world with transpeople and I would continue to have ongoing conversations and trans people in their orbit. Maybe start by correcting the language from tranniemannie to transwomen.

Start by telling these girls not to believe their own eyes?

That's the starting point you gave to a worried dad whose daughters had been exposed to by a man in a female changing room?

Start by "correcting"? Lying you mean. Lying to his daughters who know exactly who they have seen by telling them this man is a woman?

Shameful.

A Trans ally.

It certainly comes across as transphobic to me Arabella

'Your children are interacting with transpeople and you can either inform your children and prepare them for this world, our society, in an effort to keep them as safe as possible.'

🤔

So what's the or that comes after this either?

So what's the or that comes after this either?

I wondered that too

Women and girls matter. I don’t for a second believe that transwomen do not commit sexual assault and rape against women, girls, and children. However MEN far outweigh the balance of predatory risk

Yeah, they're all men.

My point is you don’t know and your children don’t know. Which is why I suggest having conversations with children about what behaviour is acceptable and what behaviour is not.^^

Yes, males getting their cocks in a female only space which women expect to be free of males and their penises is obviously not, is it?

Like it or not transwomen have rights to use single sex spaces including changing rooms, toilets, waiting rooms etc.

Stop lying about the law.

We don’t need statistics or hypothetical what ifs. Exposing your PENIS to underage girls is ILLEGAL and predatory. It’s pretty simple. There is only one reason I can think of to do it and it’s not to do with changing.

As for the hypothetical unisex toilet - where I have encountered them (museums and art galleries) they are floor to ceiling individual spaces with own wash basin etc. There is no risk of seeing an exposed penis there - although unfortunately in my experience there is a high risk of stepping in a pool of male pee.

I don’t remember this from my history lessons. Was it the Parlimentarians or the Royalists who were the rapists? My money’s on the Royalists.

whilst browsing Twitter I've just seen a photo of a man taking a selfie in the toilets!

Transwomen need to be more like this man. And use the facilities for men. I'm sure they will find the world won't stop turning. They will still exist! They may not get the validation they want in the men's, but meh! Not women's problem.

And if this guy can go in the gents with no problem then Kevin who only started transitioning a month ago and likes to be naked in front of young girls, because he's apparently scared of going in the gents, won't have an issue in the men's facilities either.

I haven’t said a women can have a penis, I have said a transwomen can have a penis. There is a difference.

That's actually exactly the opposite of what you said earlier @CalMeKate, but anyway....

You should also know that what you are saying now ( the quote above) is generally not acceptable to the trans community who insist that transwomen are women, no difference. In fact, you'd be considered extremely bigoted by many in the trans community for your above statement. TWAW is pretty basic don't you know? Surprising from a trans ally really.

I'm not sure why you started talking about people with Kleinfelter's syndrome (XXY) in cinema loos, but, in case you're unaware, the individuals wth this condition are always men. In fact Kleinfelter's is a chromosomal condition that only affects men.

Im thinking more 'gone with the wind' type films

Never mind the fact that throughout the whole thread Kate has committed the cardinal sin of writing transwomen every post and not trans women! She may as well just brand herself a Terf target than a trans ally now before the TRAs do it for her

Rather not target. Grrr

Teaching about 'differing abilities' is not at all comparable to teaching that some men will flash their dicks publicly, if given half the chance!
And I'm not teaching my daughter to accept this gender madness. She knows that men who say they are women, should not be in female only spaces!
The OPs daughters have been frightened by a man showing his penis in their changing room and you're on here quoting trans rights. Sort yourself out!

There's not a great deal of point teaching your kids about safe boundaries if there aren't structures in place to support them enforcing those boundaries. Single sex spaces are one set of structures to help them do that, so subverting the restrictions on who accesses those spaces makes it more difficult for them to keep themselves safe.

@OwningAllMyMistakes explain how it is transphobic to safeguard our children. To protect them from predators flashing their dicks at them.