Page 3 | Miss Netherlands 2023:

mrshoho · 2023-07-09T16:26:09+00:00

Slow hand clap for the male winner of Miss Universe Netherlands 2023. Don't know why women would enter these things anyway but more so than ever a reason to just hand the whole thing to the men from now on.

Chersfrozenface · 10/07/2023 13:10

The contest should really be renamed Mx Universe.

And described as a mixed sex looks-OK-in-an-evening-dress competition.

At least that would be honest.

JulieHoney · 10/07/2023 13:10

Floisme · 10/07/2023 12:59

I disagree strongly.

I think that if women enter a contest believing they're competing with other women on a level playing field, and if their good faith turns out to have been misplaced, then I'm going support them. It's not the competition, it's the gaslighting of the women involved, so my personal approval is neither here nor there.

It would be different if it were openly mixed sex.

The rules specify that transwomen can enter and have doen for over a decade, so I don't think women are participating under the misapprehension it's a single sex competition.

In many women's events there are inherent biological advantages for male participants, or social/cultural barriers women face that males don't. In those cases it is wrong to disadvantage women to include natal males (transwomen)

Where we're measuring femininity, as gender critical people surely we accept men/males/transwomen (delete as appropriate) are welcome to be as feminine as they like, aren't we?

Teapot13 · 10/07/2023 13:15

When a woman says she doesn’t mind allowing trans women in women’s spaces, we all say that it’s not acceptable to give up other women’s rights. How would a beauty pageant be different?

sanluca · 10/07/2023 13:27

BlackForestCake · 10/07/2023 10:43

You could defend Page 3 with many of the arguments being used here.

I compare beauty pageants to being a model, both are all about a certain set of beauty standards, require a certain level of nudity and are focused around the male gaze.

Original poster

mrshoho · 10/07/2023 13:28

There already is a separate miss trans universe competition that I linked to earlier. Interestingly they have very strict rules on who is permitted to enter, ie biologically born Males only. Unbelievably hypocritical.

OP posts:

TrainedByCats · 10/07/2023 13:34

Floisme · 10/07/2023 12:59

I disagree strongly.

I think that if women enter a contest believing they're competing with other women on a level playing field, and if their good faith turns out to have been misplaced, then I'm going support them. It's not the competition, it's the gaslighting of the women involved, so my personal approval is neither here nor there.

It would be different if it were openly mixed sex.

100% this

RufustheSpecuIatingreindeer · 10/07/2023 13:35

Floisme · 10/07/2023 12:59

I disagree strongly.

I think that if women enter a contest believing they're competing with other women on a level playing field, and if their good faith turns out to have been misplaced, then I'm going support them. It's not the competition, it's the gaslighting of the women involved, so my personal approval is neither here nor there.

It would be different if it were openly mixed sex.

This

i dont like page 3, i dont like miss world…i would be happy for them both to be wiped iff the face of the earth

but thats not the point….the point is that yet again men are muscling in on women only things

it does not matter whether i like the actual event or not, there are loads of things i don’t like….

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 10/07/2023 13:36

Teapot13 · 10/07/2023 13:15

When a woman says she doesn’t mind allowing trans women in women’s spaces, we all say that it’s not acceptable to give up other women’s rights. How would a beauty pageant be different?

Because I don’t accept that beauty pageants are women’s spaces

in fact I consider them to be actively harmful to women

Floisme · 10/07/2023 13:50

This is sounding very much like only supporting women if they're taking part in something we approve of.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 10/07/2023 14:04

There’s no we

it’s just what I think

I think beauty pageants are stupid and harmful

I’m not going to fight for the rights of women to have single sex access to something I think is stupid and harmful

Floisme · 10/07/2023 14:12

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 10/07/2023 14:04

There’s no we

it’s just what I think

I think beauty pageants are stupid and harmful

I’m not going to fight for the rights of women to have single sex access to something I think is stupid and harmful

Ok I'll rephrase it.

Do you only support women if they're taking part in something you approve of?

Floisme · 10/07/2023 14:17

And I'm being persistent because this, I think, is why feminism can be bloody hard.
Because sometimes women do things I don't like.
Sometimes they piss me off.
Sometimes they do things I think are bloody stupid.
Sometimes I don't even like them.

I don't think it means they don't deserve my support.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 10/07/2023 14:18

Am I going to spend any energy supporting the right of women to have single sex access to something I consider stupid and harmful?

no

I’m pushing this by the way because I’m aware I sound like the women who don’t care about single sex toilets and therefore think it’s ok for men to use them

of course there’s evidence that mixed sex provision leads to harm to women in the form of increased risk of sexual attacks and voyeurism

I’m not sure there’s evidence of harms to women arising from mixed sex beauty pageants

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 10/07/2023 14:19

I think we’re both testing our positions!

Floisme · 10/07/2023 14:19

Yes I think we are!

WickedSerious · 10/07/2023 20:16

mrshoho · 09/07/2023 22:33

Christ on a bike! Those photos paint a thousand words. It's like a little Britain sketch on acid!

Show quote history

The only beauty queen in the village.

OnAPostItNote · 10/07/2023 21:21

What’s next? What space is there left to invade?

whoamI00 · 10/07/2023 22:04

She's beautiful and gorgeous, deserves to win.

TheBiologyStupid · 10/07/2023 22:16

He is neither of those things and doesn't

MowingTheTerf · 10/07/2023 22:43

This person won due to the virtue signalling of the judging panel and the fact that it's generated a lot of publicity.

In reality men in women's sports is unfair due to the male attributes meaning that they gain an unfair advantage, in female beauty contests a man/biological male/trans woman would be at a disadvantage because of those male attributes.

Now of course there should be a debate whether trans women should be eligible, but I don't think you can use the same argument as you use for sport.

Of course the reason why trans women have been banned previously was due to the internalised homophobia of the men that ran the competition.

DysonSpheres · 10/07/2023 22:48

mrshoho · 09/07/2023 19:23

This entire industry looks to have been captured when you see who now owns the Miss Universe organisation..

How is this person the first female billionaire to own a beauty pageant then??

smilesup · 10/07/2023 22:51

I would quite like all of the beauty bollocks to be taken over by men and we can leave them to it.

Neverinamonthofsundays · 10/07/2023 23:03

Oh look a chick with a dick has won a perv comp. Lovely.

Neverinamonthofsundays · 10/07/2023 23:04

whoamI00 · 10/07/2023 22:04

She's beautiful and gorgeous, deserves to win.

You mean HE is beautiful and gorgeous. If he were a she there would be a vagina in there somewhere.

Gothambutnotahamster · 10/07/2023 23:22

Blinkinbloodyhayfever · 09/07/2023 19:15

Can they not just have their own category? It's appropriation, again. One woman came second - lost the prize fund and bid for world peace 😉 because a bloke wanted to play dress up. I'm not one for pageants and find the whole industry grotesque to be fair, but appropriation is appropriation.

Completely agree with this.