Pink News Trans Summit & Wickes

[Justme56]

https://www.jamesesses.com/p/the-horrors-of-the-pink-news-trans

Here is part of the video where he is apparently attacking GC women over the issue of a conversion therapy ban:

https://twitter.com/ICanSeeForever1/status/1669629507261587457

The point I would make, is that the purpose of debate isn't necessarily to change your opponent's mind. That mostly doesn't happen.

The real point of debate is to test the strength of arguments, and potentially change the minds of a more neutral audience that may be witnessing the debate.

To say "I'm not going to change the minds of the 10%"... who cares if you are going to change their minds? Just destroy their position anyway, if you have the arguments to do it.

90% are ignorant but mostly kind? Yeah, well they're getting less ignorant now, how's that working out for you?

He is entitled to his personal opinion like everyone else.

But when you are acting as the representative of a DIY company, and your DIY company has zero expertise and no relevance to these issues, and you have a closed mind to contrary viewpoints, maybe don't try to lecture the public or think you are in a position to "educate" them.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12202079/Outrage-Wickes-boss-says-trans-critical-shoppers-not-welcome-stores-sparking-backlash.html

In yesterday's 'trans summit', Mr Longden spoke about Wickes' campaign for an all-out ban on conversion therapy.

He said: 'It's just a logical statement isn't it, if you're saying conversion therapy - which we all accept is a ridiculous concept.

'You know, you can't take me off in a room and try and persuade me I'm gay, you know that would be wrong, just the same as any other form of conversion therapy. So it has to be banned for all.'

Yes. Apparently, 90% are ignorant but mostly kind while the other 10% are full of hot air.

Nice way to describe your former and would-have-been customers, Mr London.

It sounds like he's the ignorant one, to be honest.

Does he really support putting rapists in women's prisons? Or decimating female sport? Or allowing middle-aged cross dressers to disrobe in front of 12 year old girls?

The real point of debate is to test the strength of arguments, and potentially change the minds of a more neutral audience that may be witnessing the debate

Exactly.

'Think of the lurkers'.

We don’t stick to boycotts?? I haven’t been in M&S since about 2018, Starbucks since that first stupid mermaid cookie hit the counters, Lush since they first trod the path Wickes is now taking (or used a Nestlé product in about 15 years, but that’s for other reasons).

I’ve bought a veritable fuckton of Tunnocks stuff, mind you.

(Pretty sure “veritable fuckton” is an SI unit of measurement.)

Nestle for 15years - you're a beginner. My DM boycotted them from 1977 until her death.

You know, you can't take me off in a room and try and persuade me I'm
gay, you know that would be wrong, just the same as any other form of conversion therapy. So it has to be banned for all

You know you can't take me off in a room and try and persuade me, men can be women, you know that would be wrong, just the same as any other form conversion therapy.
So it* has to be banned for all.

• it being any man of any stripe in women only spaces.

Ive successfully boycotted all airlines since ?November? 2004 (intentionally).

'You know, you can't take me off in a room and try and persuade me I'm gay, you know that would be wrong, just the same as any other form of conversion therapy. So it has to be banned for all.'

Anyone who says this is evidencing that they know zero about the history of gender dysphoria diagnosis, the distinctions between gender identity and sexual orientation and how the interests of gay and trans people conflict so fundamentally when it comes to conversion therapy.

If he genuinely cared about LGBTQ people, he would have sat down and done some reading or even just thought about what it actually means to be gay and what it actually means to be trans, instead of parroting nonsense that shows he hasn't applied any rational thought to the issue.

Absolutely LonginesPrime

Owen Jones on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/OwenJones84/status/1669791078625558528

To be very clear:

@Wickes is absolutely correct.

There is no LGB without the T.

What binds LGBTQ+ people together is we all suffer bigotry because we are defying the expectations attached to the gender on our birth certificate.

It's not hard to understand!

[Svein Svendsen:]
Freedom of association means yes, there is LGB without the T. No one own lesbians, gays and bis. We are free to organize as we see fit, or not organize at all. This is up to each one of us.

[Owen Jones:]
go and do it, organise your public 'LGB without the T' event, and show us what an absolute freakshow you lot are. the material will be absolutely golden, I can promise you that!

Oj isn't getting a lot of support in his replies! I agree with the reply that says *no LGB without the T" sounds like a threat rather than a statement - what does that phrase actually mean? It just sounds homophobic to me.

"show us what an absolute freakshow you lot are"

Seems like quite a nasty reply about a subset of LGB people.

Also it's ad hominem and not a proper response to the point made.

A birth certificate records sex.

Society may expect things of people of that sex but we should be trying to alter those expectations not alter birth certificates. In a nutshell, there is the difference between the traditional Gay rights movement and the new corporate sponsored LGBTPLC movement.

For all his socialist pretensions Jones is just drumming up trade for Big Pharma.

Either that or he is just plain thick.

Oh no, it's closest DIY shop and I have a trade discount, sad times.

Longden seems to have a particular dislike for lesbians and gay men who don't want to be force-teamed with straight people who say they're the opposite sex.

I'm all for everyone having an opinion on anything, but this privately-educated straight man is speaking on behalf of a large corporation and telling those lesbians and gays - and women who value single-sex rights and provisions - that they're bigots who aren't welcome at his stores.

But that's alright, because he intones a mantra about 'speaking from a position of privilege'?!

Of course people can and should be able to organise independently if they so wish. Has he never heard of Trans Pride - by his logic they must be a freak show. What a stupid man he is.

'What binds LGBTQ+ people together is we all suffer bigotry because we are defying the expectations attached to the gender on our birth certificate.'

What about gender non conforming women, Owen. And how dare he call LGB people 'an absolute freakshow'? What a horrible wee man he is.

LGB did try to organise without the T. LGBA have been subject to untold abuse for doing so.

Surely even those who support OJ will see how wrong these statements are?

Calling people who are same sex attracted a freak show?!

I still boycott Lush and Body Shop. Haven't had a Yorkie since the early 2000s (but haven't gone the whole way and boycotted Nestle). Me boycotting Wickes won't have any impact on them currently but in future if I'm looking for a DIY store I'll probably bear this comment in mind. Some things just stick with you 🤷‍♀️

Make sure you let them know why, even anonymously. A boycott that always tells why every time a choice is made is more effective.

There is no LGB without the T.

What binds LGBTQ+ people together is we all suffer bigotry because we are defying the expectations attached to the gender on our birth certificate.

Lol, in that case F for feminist should be on it!

And T should be removed purely on the basis that every man I've seen who identifies as T, couldn't conform more to stereotypically male expectations if you paid them.

I know OJ just likes to rile his audience, and stoke their ire towards women, but surely, even they will get bored of the obvious paucity of his arguments.

'Show us what a freakshow you are'.

So lesbians, gays and bisexuals are a freakshow?