Caroline F - new arrest / harassment ?

[catsrus]

Caroline has just posted on twitter that the police were trying to force entry - WTF going on?

Three officers saying she has to go with them.

Three.

twitter.com/cf_farrow/status/1651514281471492096?s=46&t=rbPMHI1uvxUAiQC4E1EE3A

Not at all - I'm reading from the "20+ years experience working on an emergency response team" book. I know they way it works and how a team is manged with regards their own case queue and incoming emergency jobs

Lord, you're zipping through that library at a remarkable pace, what with now being nose deep in the Big Book of Arrogance.

What do you think women are bringing to this? You've got a measly 20+ years of experience. Collectively we've got thousands. Much of it direct experience. Not something we are reading from a book.

And You still don't get it. It's not about Caroline has done. None of it. It's about how women are targeted using men like you.

And I guarantee if the Home Secretary saw how you use your downtime arguing in favour of police targeting women, to women on a website hosting the biggest gathering of women in history, there is no part of her that would accept you were doing it at her request.

Total agree with this @JacquelinePot . We need less policing of people by thought however well meant it is just not doable aand it has lead us to where we are now with police trying to judge between hate and just rudeness between fair comment and hurt feelings. It is so easily misused. In fact women would get prosecuted for upseting transwomen. I am delighted by them not making misogyny a hate crime. It feels like progress and common sense at last.

A big part of legal justice in this country relies on the premise of the accused being assumed innocent unless found guilty in court.

With that in mind (and given that Caroline is just one of many women who have found themselves on this position over the last few years), why is it that we are being continually asked by a member of the police to assume the worst possible reason is the most likely truth, rather than the actually more likely version which is that Caroline is the victim of sustained targeted harassment that the police have, knowingly or not, colluded in.

We are not stupid women. We, as Datun said, have much more experience of this. There are posters on this board that have been the actual women targeted on occasion.

As we are only speculating I feel confident in my suspicion that Caroline is being targeted and the police are helping the abuser.

so people can come and quote what the police are supposed to do until their fingers seize up from typing. I know what I know. I see what I see and what is happening to Caroline is not acceptable and it's certainly not the way to go about it from the police even if she has done something worthy of arrest.

she's not a violent monster, she sent some bloody tweets.

Is it standard police procedure to send three officers (including someone to break the door down) when someone doesn't attend an interview (as opposed to sending an officer round to remind her politely)?

MrsDanversGlidesAgain

The reason whey there were three there was explained earlier - its probably one officer who is dealing with this particular job. That officer was double crewed that day; they can't just leave their colleague on a corner whilst they attend the address so ts one-to-one. So the colleague goes with them.

The third officer was probably summonsed in order to open the door (snap the lock) - not every officer is trained in this. Or the third one might have been for transport purposes. If the double crewed unit is in a car, you need a van to transport - you shouldn't transport arrested people in panda cars

so people can come and quote what the police are supposed to do until their fingers seize up from typing. I know what I know. I see what I see and what is happening to Caroline is not acceptable and it's certainly not the way to go about it from the police even if she has done something worthy of arrest.

she's not a violent monster, she sent some bloody tweets.

Exactly.

Which is why it's so tedious for Felix to keep banging on about what if he's done something, and then consider if a gotcha if she has done something.

It's not a bloody gotcha because my interest and issue has nothing to do with what Caroline is doing. It's to do with the wholesale capture of the police force being sucked into acting as foot soldiers for a misogynistic ideology.

Targeting Caroline is an example of that.

ChristinaXYZ

And do we definitely know that the allegation made against Caroline here is just that?

Why would they think they have to snap the lock? can't they just knock and say 'Awfully sorry, but you missed an interview at the police station, just here to let you know you need to turn up.' Or isn't that intimidating enough?

Pixiedust1234

We can all speculate all we want - where it crosses a line for me is where people start to say that the police are defiantly wrong in taking the action they have when we know nothing about the allegation or investigation.

If Caroline has sent a tweet saying that Mr Smith is "...very wrong in what he says..." - then the police should not have crimed it or attended her house

If Caroline has sent a tweet saying "....next time I see you I'm going to kill you..." - does that change things?

If Caroline has turned up at the persons address and put his window through - does that change things?

If Caroline has sent numerous threats and has stated that she intends to carry on doing so - does that change things?

We just don't know what the allegation is - so we can not judge. But we can not simply say the police must be wrong in the action they have taken unless we know more about it from both sides of the investigation.

No Felix she is probably alleged to have robbed the local off licence with a banana in her pocket.

I have no idea why anyone else is posting, but to me the whole approach the police take to this woman is completely OTT. Three officers and someone to break the door down, just because she forgot she had to turn up to an interview.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain

Why would they think they have to snap the lock? can't they just knock and say 'Awfully sorry, but you missed an interview at the police station, just here to let you know you need to turn up.' Or isn't that intimidating enough?

Yes - could do. But what if that does not work

What if she refuses to open the door - What if she shouts "YOU'RE NOT COMING IN - GET LOST" and then jumps in the shower.

Do the police just leave and tell the reporting person - "SHE WAS IN BUT SHE WOULD'T OPEN THE DOOR"

Then what if she does this tactic every time the police attend.

Do the police just keep trying - or keep offering appointments for vol interviews which she never attends?

How do you think the reporting person/victim feels about that? - "OH SORRY, THERE IS NOTHING WE CAN DO WITH YOUR CRIME BECAUSE SHE WON'T OPEN THE DOOR OR TALK TO US - YOU WILL JUST HAVE TO PUT UP WITH THE ABUSE/HARASSMENT/DAMAGE/THREATS (whatever the allegation is)"

Bare in mind - we do not know what the allegation is here. Has something else happened the previous night that has escalated this into a necessity to arrest her?

Who knows - we certainly don't know - so how can judge how the police have dealt with it?

ChristinaXYZ

No Felix she is probably alleged to have robbed the local off licence with a banana in her pocket.

So what is the allegation then?

Before you can judge on the response by the police - you need to know what it is?

Caroline is beginning to sound like a one woman crime wave.

Oh my!

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · Today 11:38
I have no idea why anyone else is posting, but to me the whole approach the police take to this woman is completely OTT. Three officers and someone to break the door down, just because she forgot she had to turn up to an interview.

But - you need to know what the allegation is?
Has something else happened that has escalated things to necessitate the arrest?

Do the police just leave and tell the reporting person - "SHE WAS IN BUT SHE WOULD'T OPEN THE DOOR"

Well, what's wrong with doing that? then the reporting person can decide what is a proportionate response to a woman who has every right not to open her door to the police if she doesn't feel like it.

Frankly you sound like you're assuming she's a hardened violent criminal with all this 'we don't know what the offence is' bleating.

WickedSerious

I'm not saying she is

It will be another job on the officer's queue of ongoing crimes that needs to be dealt with and investigated.

Before they get swamped by other incoming jobs and other ongoing crimes that gets added to their queue

You also have a victim/reporting person who is wanting some level of service for the incident they have reported.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain

Well, what's wrong with doing that? then the reporting person can decide what is a proportionate response to a woman who has every right not to open her door to the police if she doesn't feel like it.

I'm not assuming anything

If you have reported something to the police that you feel aggrieved at - something that is effecting your life - perhaps harassment, or your window has been smashed, or you have been threatened.

You phone the police because you want some sort of action - after all a crime has occurred in your eyes and you want action - you pay your taxes and want to be protected. You want them to be punished through the courts for what they have done against you.

Would you be happy if the police come back to your address and give you that update?

Would you be happy do drop your complaint because she forgot to turn up at the police station and now won't open the door? Would you be happy for the police the close the investigation down because of that? If you are not happy that it is closed down, what do you want the police to do next?

some level of service for the incident they have reported

That's an interesting way of describing it.

You also have a victim/reporting person who is wanting some level of service for the incident they have reported.

Without wanting to sound like a stuck record… again I’d ask how many victims of burglary have an officer attend? Based on recent stats, not many.

It’s extremely unlikely that Caroline has been accused of a violent offence, or she wouldn’t have been offered a voluntary interview. This is likely to be something within the ‘hurty words on the internet’ territory. It shouldn’t, IMO, even have made it into a PC’s job queue, let alone had three rock up for a missed voluntary interview.

Before you can judge on the response by the police - you need to know what it is?

Right back at you mate.

We are working on innocent unless proven guilty.

You for some strange reason have chosen to assume all women in this situation are the local crime Lord!

We know as much about the situation as you do. Our views on why it is happening however are different.

And most on here judge the police by the lack of rapes and assaults that are properly investigated, we judge the police on the numbers in the ranks that enjoy beating raping and even killing women. We judge the police on the disabled woman putting up stickers being arrested. We judge them on the decapitate Terfs sign being seen as acceptable and nothing done about the sign holder. We judge the police on the fact they allow groups of masked yobs in black to intimidate, spit on, and call nazis and wish us dead to groups of women.

That's the metric we judge the police's response to Caroline on. Not you pontificating about best practice.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain
some level of service for the incident they have reported

That's an interesting way of describing it.

A victim of crime or an offence deserves a level of investigation or a reason as to why the investigation has been concluded

PaterPower

How do you know the reporting person here had a visit?

Crimes are graded under threat, harm & risk as to the response - so some crimes may not require an officer to physically attend.

But we don't know what the incident is here, do we

You can vol interview for violent crimes - you can vol interview a murder if you wish. For an arrest to be lawful, you have to have a necessity to arrest.

Carolines situation is sadly just another example of why many many women have lost respect for, and trust in the Police.

From the misogynistic obscenity that is the Met, the serving rapists and murderers and racists in Police ranks that keep coming to light, the absolute fealty to Stonewall and their ideological demands, is it any wonder any women would not feel safe opening the door to a Police officer. For any reason?

And that's leaving aside the abysmal 'service' that delivers the disgraceful reported figures around crimes such as rape, domestic abuse and VAWG. Who even expects a Police Officer to attend a home burglary or car theft nowadays? - we simply 'inform' them for a crime number for the insurers. No expectation that the Police will actually do anything.

I have family members who are serving officers. There was a time when I would have said I support the Police, that I respected their work and felt a ‘few bad apples’ didn’t define them as a whole. Not anymore.

A friend of mine had her phone stolen and because it's linked to her watch, she could tell the police exactly where it was. The police would not go and retrieve it and deal with the thief, even though it was highly likely hers wasn't the only stolen phone there. So no three officers breaking down the door for a demonstrable theft where the stolen property's whereabouts is known. But then she's just a female victim of actual crime.

Don't bother responding to me, Felix, I won't read your post as I don't read any of your other posts.