Can MNHQ set up a new discussion category called Feminism: sex & gender discussion (inclusive, non-GC)

[PlanetLuna]

MN, will you please create a talk group/category of Feminism: sex & gender discussion (inclusive, non-GC)?

MN appears to currently have only 2 feminism categories:
Feminism: chat
Feminism: sex & gender discussions

But the Feminism: sex & gender category on MN is predominantly GC, with its emphasis on trans exclusion ideology. Feminists who do not subscribe to those beliefs are often unwelcome and treated with derision and hostility in discussions. Certainly not always as some GC posters do enjoy open, intellectual discussions but often enough that engagement can be toxic & intimidating all around.

It is almost impossible for non-GC feminists to find inclusive/non-GC feminist discussions, and we have to wade through unpleasant (for us) GC threads while attempting to do so.

GC feminism dominates on UK parenting sites in particular. However, inclusive/non-GC feminism is extremely popular around the world (especially in places like the US, NZ, and AU) and in the UK among younger feminists and those who do not see trans rights as a threat to women & girls’ safety. Many UK feminists are non-GC but may feel silenced on MN.

The addition of another category will help open up and improve MN discussions while reducing the toxicity and hostility that many feminists on both sides experience in discussions.

So I propose the following feminism discussion categories:
Feminism: chat (general)
Feminism: sex & gender discussions (GC)
Feminism: sex & gender discussion (inclusive, non-GC)

@MNHQ

No ta.

Nah. Sex and gender discussions were kicked out of feminism chat to the naughty step, because apparently biological reality was too much for some people.

I don't know how you can define feminism if you can't define a woman, anyway...

Just post in Feminism Chat if you don’t like it here. Problem solved. We didn’t want the board split in two in the first place.

You'd need to call it something other than 'feminism' though. 'Men's rights'?

😂

How about
Feminism Lite: sex & gender discussion ( male centric)

Oh please.

You have Feminism: Chat all to yourselves. It was separated off for you - is that not enough?? Now you want an additional section too??

Feminism Chat is a deadzone, tumbleweed abounds. Have at it and get creating your chosen threads fgs.

@mnhq

I would like to see the end of the silencing of non-GC feminism.

I would like to see threads about gender and trans issues moved out of 'feminism chat' to 'sex&gender' and threads that aren't headline about gender and trans moved out of S&G and in to chat.

That was the original concept, was it not?

WTF?

The whole point of having 2 separate categories for feminism on MN (Chat and Sex & Gender) was so that liberal feminists could keep using Feminism Chat whilst the GC folk moved their discussions of the intersection of trans rights and women's rights to a dedicated section. Now you're saying you want yet another area for lib fems?

You can ask for different sections for different topics, but you can't reasonably ask that only people who agree with you post on particular topics, that's bonkers!

Never mind how you could discuss the concept of gender in relation to feminism without being critical of it, fgs.

Feminism: sex & gender discussion (inclusive, non-GC)

It never seems to amaze me when I see something that says, "Inclusive, excluding those people I don't like".

Why is this different from, "Inclusive dating club (non-gay)" or "Inclusive tennis club (no women)"?

By definition, if it is properly inclusive, it includes those who's opinions you disagree with.

Like the current forum does.

I would actually quite like to see how busy such a board would be. I think OP might be quite disappointed, but who knows?

"GC" means believing that sex is real and sometimes it matters. If you want a space to discuss believing that sex isn't real and/or that it never matters you can do that pretty much anywhere?

OP - could you please set out what you think gender-critical actually means and why it's relevant to having a discussion on here?

There's a great big Internet out there full of people who aren't fussed about women's rights. Fly free and join them.

How can you be a feminist if you're not critical of the concept of gender?
I don't get it.

Do consider using the feminism:chat board.

That's what it is there for, so us norty unkind dried up bitter old Nazi hags can not sully your eyeballs with our adamant written refusals to agree that humans can change sex. HTH.

How about the OP does what everyone else has to and debate the issues?

You want a little echo chamber, get a cupboard and someone who shares your views.

Just to clarify, a non-GC feminist is someone that thinks women have a common factor that is not sex, but it's.... what? I would genuinely love to know.

I can't even tell if your feminism would include me or not.

I'm assuming the OP won't answer because they never do, which should give an indication of how much discussion a "non-GC" board might generate.

I don't see what discussions would go into that category?

If you believe TWAW then there would be no discussions to be had wrt sex & gender.

If you want to discuss where trans issues are impacting women's issues then there is a board already for discussion.

If you want to discuss any other aspect of feminism then there is the feminism chat board.

It is hardly the GC feminists fault that the 'be kind' argument doesn't stand up to much scrutiny.

This is a board for all opinions about the topic. If you are unable to present your evidenced point of view on the existing board, why do you think a second board will be of use?

And if you cannot post within the guidelines and refrain from making the negative generalisations that you have been making while you have been on this board, that is your own issue to deal with.

🙄 You want a board which excludes opinions which you disagree with because you can't find traction on a board that doesn't exclude your opinion?

a) the place for this request is "site stuff"
b) no thanks. It's bad enough that any talk that might even be vaguely seen as "anti trans" (which actually generally means pro-women, not always but generally) has to be hidden away here in case the new-version of the blue-rinse brigade see it and throw their collective teddies from the pram

Feminism Chat performs that function btw

This is what I genuinely don't understand! What group of characteristics make someone a 'woman' and therefore centered in feminism? Not sex, but what?

As a general point I think it would help civil discussion infinitely on here if people explained what they mean when they use these terms! It's so exclusionary to assume everyone knows what you mean.

Also, a tip on using MN:

"It is almost impossible for non-GC feminists to find inclusive/non-GC feminist discussions, and we have to wade through unpleasant (for us) GC threads while attempting to do so."

There is a 'start new thread' button in blue on the top right of the screen (don't know about the app). This is where people begin chats on subjects they want to chat about.

Who is silencing 'non-GC feminism'?

There is a whole board set up just for people to not discuss 'sex and gender'. Or is it that most feminist issues actually incorporate sex and gender and therefore no one posts on the other board. Because no one visits it.