Trans Widows are the only mothers of our children.

[TinselAngel]

I don't want this claim by @bathhy to get lost in a thread that will no doubt go along the usual lines.

"As a trans woman mother who uses Mumsnet, I would never recommend coming here."

Trans women can never be the mother of any child. We women, the trans widows who are usually your exes, who give birth to those children are their mother and always will be.

If you adopt a child, you can be the child's parent, but as a male you are not the child's mother.

Trans widows say no to having our status and legal responsibility as mother taken from us.

Women here must not allow forced teaming from men who wish to appropriate our status as the mothers of our children.

Every woman here should consider how they would feel if the father of their child after having taken so much from them already, then demanded to be called "Mum."

I'm still waiting to hear how you get a GRC before the legislation happened.

I'm still waiting to here how a name change IS a safeguarding risk now but 20 years ago wasn't.

To be honest, I think the whole scenario smells like bait.

This is two "old fashioned transexual" adopters in as many weeks. You'd think it was quite a rare situation?

Bathhy has posted very clearly that that will continue to use female single sex spaces on other threads. Bathhy was on another thread last night seeming to support a poster who believes that violence against women is justified because of retaliation of effectively woman saying ‘no’. Whether Bathhy read all of the poster’s posts or not.

Bathhy has now said their child has been told that Bathhy is their ‘mother’.

TeenDivided, do you think a child will be fine realising their life has been based around falsehoods when they understand and a person they fully trusted was not a female but a male? It may well be different if the child has been told the truth from the beginning.

However, calling a male ‘mother’ is all about that male person’s needs, it is not even one shred about the child.

I actually feel that Bathhy is likely to be one of the TW who has got caught in the self id crossfire. Going about their daily family life and then the TRAs come along, overreach, upset everyone.

You could be right. However, I look at this poster’s contributions as a whole on FWR and I think that the ‘upset’ is that this male has to now realise they were using women’s spaces and words thoughtlessly and without ever considering the harm they were and still are having on woman. But seeing this poster’s contributions has led me to believe they are certainly not about to change their actions now they are fully aware of the situation.

Yes. It does seem strange.

You may well all be right. I tend to have an automatic bias in favour of adopters.

Me too. They may well have adopted an older child, who won't have had the same unquestioning acceptance a little one would have. Or perhaps a child with significant additional needs.

They will have faced significant challenges, whatever.

I am ill with a b£##@‘?d virus at the moment and I can’t rtft.

A man is not and cannot be a mother. A mother can only be a woman. We are the sex who gestates and gives birth to everyone. No man can do this.

I see that on page one the clear illustration that the falsehood ‘a child can have ‘two mums’’ is given full leverage to justify men calling themselves mothers.

We feel pathos for the insecurity of the women who cannot, or have not, born children, and tell them “it’s exactly the same, you are just as much, if not more, the mother of the child as the woman who gestated and bore the child”. But this is a lie, to make that woman feel better. Deep down, everyone knows the truth. The mother baby dyad is a unique and powerful relationship like no other. Every other relationship is secondary. A baby who is denied this relationship, is at a serious loss because the baby wants its mother like the air they breathe. If this is not possible, they crave a mother-substitute in another woman, for comfort and security.

They do not long for any man, even a man who has taken hormones and got implants. It is wrong to gaslight children. They will sense something is off and never be able to put their finger on that feeling of emptiness. I completely deplore the use of innocent children as props in adult games of ‘let’s pretend’. This is their whole lives being toyed with for goodness sake!

@EndlessTea You are getting awfully close to saying that men shouldn't adopt without a female partner. Some children are deemed to positively need single adopters, or just male adopters due to their previous experiences. Other children need first and foremost parents with the ability to cope with their emotional or physical SN whatever the sex, sexuality or gender orientation of those adults. If the SWs and a panel have approved someone as a suitable adopter, and a matching SW thinks they are the best available parents for a child and a matching panel agrees, I think that has to be considered good enough.

You are getting awfully close to saying that men shouldn't adopt without a female partner.

I am not ashamed of it. I believe children should only be raised without a woman/mother-substitute if there is no other choice. For example, hard to place children.

Yes. Absolutely this.

The onky peoole who can deny this are those who have not experienced the mother baby dyad, or jealous men who desperately wish they could have this.

Some children are deemed to positively need single adopters, or just male adopters due to their previous experiences

Also, I seriously doubt there are ever circumstances where it is positive for a child to be raised without a mother figure. This is the problem when men fight for equality’ with women. All we have that they don’t is our biology and our motherhood. And they can never have it. Cry your little tears fellas, you got pretty much everything else over us.

The only circumstances I can think of where a child might be better placed without a woman is if they are a teenage boy who has been violent and sexually abusive towards women and girls and will only respond to the authority of men.

There is transition that happens from the baby being literally part of your body, one and the same, and into being their own self. This doesnt happen at the moment of birth, but over months and months of the baby's life.

No word changes or peices of paper or costumes or forced language will ever change this reality.

100 people can point at a bull and say it is the mother to it's calf, but it does not make it so. It is just a group delusion or a lie.

I had to read it several times before I figured out what he meant.

The only people who can deny this are those who have not experienced the mother baby dyad, or jealous men who desperately wish they could have this.

Absolutely.

It is a joy, but also, a huge responsibility, that women have.

Its amazing how the T gets framed as the most important person in everything, who's whims come first, who's ego must be protected at all costs.

Men in womens prisons? But what about the men?

Men in womens toilets? Poor men.

Men ruining womens sports? How lovely men can validate their identity!

(A different thread) - Male teaching assistants making SEN pupils nervous? Well the pupil needs to get used to it.

Men gaslighting adoptive children into calling them mother? Well how might the man feel being called dad? He makes a lovely mum in that dress.

--

This is not the way to get society to embrace you. The pushback is inevitable.

Yes, male entitlement knows no bounds.

Amazing how a thread about trans widows ends up being about which men should be allowed to adopt. Phallic drift in action.

Yes , and I can totally see how a trans widow having to share the title 'mother' with her ex is just a perpetuation of his abuse.

This man has attempted to take everything from this woman... Her marriage, her sense of reality, her family, possibly even her clothes and name (in some cases). Allowing this male to they try to take the word mother off her is disgraceful.

It also makes me wonder how many abusive/coercive partners might try to do this just to attack the mother of their child.

In order to deal with narcissistic abusive men, women need really strong boundaries in place.

Society needs strong boundaries too.

What exactly do they think motherhood is?

Is it makeup, breastfeeding and wearing a frilly apron?

It has me thinking... Is society going through a macro- level 'relationship' with a narcissit (the T movement). Like the same ehich happens on the individual level...

Yes. I've been thinking this for a while, too.

'Amazing' as in, all too predictable?

If I am honest, I don’t think I can handle the rage it gives me, to fully empathise with the trans widows when their husbands do this, right now. It is too infuriating for words. I’d end up in A&E. I think all I could manage would be a capitalised, sweary outburst that would end up deleted.

@TinselAngel Sorry for derailing your thread with adoption related issues.

I completely agree that fathers of children shouldn't later change to call themselves mothers.

Agreed in spades. Great post.