Experiences of a Trans Person

[invalide]

I think it might be healthy to document here the experiences of someone from the other side, and for you to pay it some mind.

I'm an early-twenties STEM student working in renewable energies, and outside of my course I'm a photographer and musician. I've travelled a fair amount and adore my home country of Scotland. Living in Glasgow, I have found a queer community of beautiful people who create a joy to everyday life I treasure.

At the beginning of this month there was a 'Let Women Speak' rally held here that some of you here attended; I have seldom felt more unwelcome and stripped of dignity than while in your crowd, carrying out my photojournalistic duties (images 1&2). While capturing Kellie-Jay Keen pathologising my friends as subhuman perverts and members of the crowd flaunting their homophobia and their use of dogwhistles (subliminal far-right messaging) I was being brazenly looked up and down, receiving steely gazes and pursed lips and hushed whispers behind my back. While photographing the first speaker after Keen, who began her piece portraying autistic people as children devoid of agency, I was approached by one of you who made it clear I looked too queer for their liking and was squaring up for assault. I made my way out at this point (captured at 8:42 here and 9:09 here).
The atmosphere your movement brought to George Square was one I've only before experienced while documenting far-right rallies in Eastern Europe, where I have been hounded through the streets and beaten up for the same reason. I assure you, your ideology would feel very much at home there.

At the other side of the square things couldn't have been more different, you were bathed in colour and music and hugs and laughter, the place is full of friends dancing and dressed resplendent in whatever camp pretty things they felt like (images 2&3).

Ours was a crowd of locals; I strained to hear a Glasgow accent in yours.

Ours is a city that at short notice manages to fill the top of Buchanan Street (image 5) in solidarity with the queer community - the last time I saw it like this was during COP26. It's one that fills George Square in a candlelit vigil for Brianna Ghey.

Your movement has meant I'm called a pervert and a groomer while going about my average daily life. Our morally vacuous, increasingly fascist political class (thinking also of Magnus Hirschfeld and of Martin Niemöller's famous poem) is picking up what you've started and they're running with it. You may not call yourself a homophobe, a white nationalist or an antisemite, but you're sitting awfully comfortably considering that those that do find your movement incredibly attractive.

boiledbeetle
You say you've no idea what I mean - here you go, I meant this bit

And this bit

Ah. I see we're past women being churched for brazenly looking at their betters instead of casting their eyes meekly downwards and placing their hand beneath his foot to give him better ease. Now we're onto how dare you have community jokes, have fun and socialise in your chat community when you should be doing whatever Mr Murdstone your betters currently want to tell you that you ought to be doing.

It's like that thread the other day where how dare a lesbian social club socialise instead of seriously and carefully providing support to a trans person.

Females not serving usefully are a wicked abomination. Apparently. Am wondering what the genderist hell looks like for the damned females.

Ah. I see we're past women being churched for brazenly looking at their betters instead of casting their eyes meekly downwards and placing their hand beneath his foot to give him better ease. Now we're onto how dare you have community jokes, have fun and socialise in your chat community when you should be doing whatever Mr Murdstone your betters currently want to tell you that you ought to be doing.

Yes it looks like it.

The pictures shown of David Bowie, Marc Bolan and L'Nas X (not so much Timothee Chalamet in this picture, but in others he scrubs up well) are not gender non-conforming in what they are wearing, nor is men wearing make-up particularly gender non-conforming either, or long hair. They are like peacocks. It is only in the last 150-odd years that men in western countries have gone round looking so dull, previously any man with the money wore flamboyant clothes, embroidered, with high heels (see any pic of e.g. Louis XIV or Charles II or men of their class and era, or of the eighteenth century prior to c.1790) and make-up as well as long hair. Young men in the 70s wore silk and velvet, large, floppy hats and long hair and sometimes make-up teaming velvet flares with silk shirts with hanging sleeves or full sleeves gathered at the cuff (women wore similar, but usually with skirts). We have got terribly uptight about what people wear. I prefer men as peacocks and find it very odd, as I grow older and older, that young men now want to look so drab and unstylish. OP, btw, has no dress sense whatsoever and if he thinks fishnets go with the weird garment hanging from his waist he is deluding himself (but he is, anyway!).

Yeah nice backtracking attempt.

The Brihanna Ghey thread will have been deleted because it was a thread about a murder
-About which the police have asked the public not to speculate
-For which arrests have been made

If you want to be a disgusting ghoul and use the murder of a teenager to score points against people you disagree with, potentially jeopardising any case the police may have, you at least can't do it here.

I agree with others that it would be useful of MNHQ could give an actual reason for any deletion, preferably in the actual thread.

I might make a post in Site Stuff.

Anyway...cheese eh? Great stuff!

Did they give any explanation for the deletion - did they email you?

It's often possible to work out why from the email - and 9 times out of 10 it's possible to say what you said in a way that doesn't get deleted - it's an art form

This thread just got even more bonkers.

So an echo chamber is now a place where people laugh and make jokes ?

Because did anyone notice the posts last night stopping any one posting their opinion? Instead what I saw was a poster who simply kept complaining that other posters were not posting the way that poster wished.

While that poster just kept complaining about posters responding to a male poster who clearly cannot see the misogyny in their posts.

A male poster who entered a women’s group space while stewards likely clicked that this male person had been over with the protestors and so gave that protestor ‘the steely eye’ and ‘brazen looks’. While that protestor took photographs of women protesting- while probably having their own face covered.

A male poster who came back and failed to engage yet again, while demanding poster’s service of paying attention to that male poster.

So an echo chamber bows seems to be a place where some special posters have to be centred, where posters must not make jokes on a thread that had been abandoned by the OP who failed to present their community in any favourable light, and where posters must not react to shaming attempts. This seems to be the opinion of those who seem to hold the power of threat of wielding the ‘echo chamber’ label as a tool of shame.

Anyone else feeling like that term echo chamber has been used so poorly that it has now lost coherency in its meaning? A bit like so many other words lately.

We're not allowed to have jokes, Helle, it's very unwelcoming to people who come here to tell us off and sneer at us.

Boiledbeetle · Today 00:33

Time for a quick slip in of an unexpected duck pic

Why such a male centric pic? That's a mallard drake, you subversive monster!

I wouldn’t mind helle

but an echo chamber as everyone know is where only one point of view is put forward, and that’s obviously not the case

and also IF it was an echo chamber…which it isn’t….its hardly the fault of posters that actually post on it.

AND while im here, the posts which say ‘ you won’t get support here’ and then dont fucking support are ridiculous….a few posters basically said to the OP ‘ i think you are right and you won’t get any support on here but im not going to support you either’ seriously…i dont get it

and that is in no way, shape or form talking about cremeegg as at least they have made an attempt to support and back up the OP

Creme Egg is such a humourless, tick, eh? Posting unpopular lectures and being miserable, wondering why most people disagree with them. I wonder why that is?

I think we can have jokes - but hijacking's someone's thread to make jokes is different

it does come across as disrespectful on what is a delicate topic
And I don't think it would further the cause to lurkers

I know it's boring when the op is clearly unwilling to engage or discuss or address any of the points people query but to disengage ourselves isn't the best look

That's my reading of it anyway

Whatever happened to that one? It was all over the labour party like a rash at one time but izzard seems to be the favourite now.

Last seen getting accused of sexual harassment and being a bullying creep by several young women that supported the trans agenda in Labour. Hilariously still listed as a "politician" on Wikipedia.

twitter.com/ripx4nutmeg/status/1152145382048239617?s=20

haha this thread is still going strong
are you lot being paid by the post, or the page number?

Both the US Christian Right and Russians are paying us, after all, so we're quids in.

So the point of this thread seemed to be:

A male poster was supremely confident that they know all about patriarchy, and what women who DO understand oppression and patriarchy from their decades of life experience apparently believe. Came onto a feminist chat board and started a thread to supposedly present a coherent alternative point of view. What we got was the usual hyperbole, some manufactured victimhood of mean women using ‘brazen, steely gazes’ and ‘whispers’ to chase off a person using a camera in their faces. That person may have had their own face covered and had likely been identified as detaching from the protest crowd to walk amongst the women who had seen violent placards and chants.

The complete lack of self awareness that this male poster has they even fucking posted that any violence should be accepted because it was ‘retaliation’.

We have then had posters claiming to be superior feminists comforting this male, while claiming to not ‘support’ that male, but joining in the shaming of other feminists because the other feminists hold a different point of view. So, those superior feminists just pop onto a thread where a male has told women violence should be expected and accepted when women say no.

And we also have other posters who have jumped in to join in the shaming of the women who are saying that the opinions of this OP are in no way acceptable. Their contribution is just to point and shame. For whatever they can shame posters for.

Do all those posters joining in the shaming of us realise you have just ‘aligned’ yourselves through your actions to a male who believes that violence against women who disagree with them is acceptable as it is ‘retaliation’. In this time where guilt by association (as per the OP) is heavily applied, we can and should only assume that you (general you) do align completely with the OP.

Or will you too now declare that you don’t support the OP?

But you really just wanted to shame women so you joined in?

”AND while im here, the posts which say ‘ you won’t get support here’ and then dont fucking support are ridiculous….a few posters basically said to the OP ‘ i think you are right and you won’t get any support on here but im not going to support you either’ seriously…i dont get it”

This is so true. And it shows the true motivation for those doing it.

I consider the OP to have abandoned this thread midge.

They never had any intention of real engagement.

And I also don’t consider that the OP had any respect for the topic either. This thread was clearly a tool to show that this male could access women and threaten them. Just as they did by walking through the women gathered to hear women speak, likely with their face covered and using a camera to record women’s faces.

This time they came here and strolled through and told us that women who say no should expect and accept violence as it is just ‘retaliation’. There was no engagement or the opening post would have been worded completely differently.

So if readers cannot see the parallel yet, after that ‘retaliation’ post, I don’t think those readers will see what this OP was attempting to do.

Maybe they will feel uncomfortable with why they believe women should be kind and accepting and should turn the other cheek in light of this very clear male pattern entitled and misogynistic behaviour though.

They never had any intention of real engagement.

And I also don’t consider that the OP had any respect for the topic either. This thread was clearly a tool to show that this male could access women and threaten them. Just as they did by walking through the women gathered to hear women speak, likely with their face covered and using a camera to record women’s faces.

This time they came here and strolled through and told us that women who say no should expect and accept violence as it is just ‘retaliation’. There was no engagement or the opening post would have been worded completely differently.

This.

I’m pretty sure that particular hell would not allow jokes!

Just to clarify, this entitled male poster yesterday re-enacted their deliberate incursion into a women’s area to show women that they, the poster, could do so and women are powerless.

In Glasgow, this poster likely wandered across from the protest group and women picked that up and reacted the only way they could to having a camera in their faces recording them. They gave this male a ‘steely and brazen’ gaze and whispered.

On MN, this poster delighted in telling women they had accessed a space where women were scared and intimidated and deliberately walked through as a protestor. This poster then told women they should expect and accept violence because they, as women, said no.

And posted links with hidden URL which some posters found had trackers on.

It is very clear what the intention of this OP was.

This is was the continuation of the deliberate and direct intimidation they started in Glasgow.

Oh I agree the op wasn't really interested in discussion

It's a Michelle Obama situation- they go low we go high

‘Brazen’ is such a telling word. These people are so transparent.