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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Roald Dahl books have been edited to remove the word "female" along with other edits.

374 replies

GoChasingWaterfalls · 19/02/2023 08:39

www.theguardian.com/books/2023/feb/18/roald-dahl-books-rewritten-to-remove-language-deemed-offensive?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

It's literary terrorism.

OP posts:
Fairislefandango · 19/02/2023 08:41

FFS Angry

Lockheart · 19/02/2023 08:41

That article mentions two instances of the word "female" being changed to "woman"... Personally I find woman much better.

AthenaWhite · 19/02/2023 08:44

I find the whole thing utterly horrific and shudder to think that there are enough people in the profession to cheer lead this on. Write your own books and leave other books alone. If you are that easily offended then stay at home wrapped in bubble wrap. EEjits.

ANameChangePresents · 19/02/2023 08:44

I'm glad I've kept the copies I've got from when I was a child. Would much rather have something closer to the artist's original vision than art by committee.

mach2 · 19/02/2023 08:45

The worthless shits should leave the books alone. Stop trying to edit the past to fit the present.

plumduck · 19/02/2023 08:46

References to “female” characters have disappeared. Miss Trunchbull in Matilda, once a “most formidable female”, is now a “most formidable woman”.

What's wrong with that?

JacquelinePot · 19/02/2023 08:46

I saw this yesterday. Another reminder to buy copies of media you love before it can be memory-holed or sanitised.

I really don't understand how anyone can think that it's right to tamper with texts like this. Who decides what we can read, hear and watch and where does it end?

Lockheart · 19/02/2023 08:49

How does changing "female" to "woman" render something totally unrecognisable or constitute sanitation or terrorism?

mach2 · 19/02/2023 08:49

What's wrong with that?

Everything. Not one comma of old books should be touched.

plumduck · 19/02/2023 08:49

Lockheart · 19/02/2023 08:49

How does changing "female" to "woman" render something totally unrecognisable or constitute sanitation or terrorism?

I don't see the issue with that change.

plumduck · 19/02/2023 08:50

mach2 · 19/02/2023 08:49

What's wrong with that?

Everything. Not one comma of old books should be touched.

They could still publish the old version with some sort of warning of appearance based prejudice.

ExiledElsie · 19/02/2023 08:50

This were the group of people involved. I don't think any of them have the maturity to understand any of 1984 yet.

www.inclusiveminds.com

GoChasingWaterfalls · 19/02/2023 08:50

Lockheart · 19/02/2023 08:49

How does changing "female" to "woman" render something totally unrecognisable or constitute sanitation or terrorism?

Explain to me why it needs changing in the first place. Mrs Trunchbull is a female character. A formidable one. Why change it?

OP posts:
Wittow · 19/02/2023 08:51

www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4745956-to-think-if-you-find-a-book-this-bad-best-just-not-to-read-it

Similar thread. Agree, it's literary terrorism.

PaleBlueMoonlight · 19/02/2023 08:51

I imagine that "Inclusive Minds" prefers "woman" over "female" because they see it as inclusive of gender identity over sex. Hard to think of another reason.

Not much to go on as the website is sparse.

www.inclusiveminds.com/

TWETMIRF · 19/02/2023 08:51

It's incredibly arrogant of someone to rewrite somebody else's work as they think that their version is better. Doesn't matter what the changes are and how insignificant they may be, it's not your words, leave them alone

VoodooQualities · 19/02/2023 08:51

I read all the CS Lewis books when I was a child and they had some pretty dodgy white vs brown, othering representations of the neighbouring enemy state. They were called the Calormenes or something like that, they wore turbans, worshipped a different, evil god called Tash and ate oil on their bread instead of butter like normal people would.

The reason all this remains fresh in my mind nearly forty years later is because I recognised it then as writing from a bygone era, and I worked out all by myself that attitudes change and that a reader should apply a critical eye to older texts.

Beamur · 19/02/2023 08:52

If these were books for adults I would agree. But as they're kids books I don't think it is unreasonable to substitute some words - if a word has changed so much over time that it's current use would be offensive or would actually lose the meaning of the narrative then - provided it's thoughtfully done, I think it's fair enough.
Both DH and I have picked up much loved children's books from our childhood to read to our kids and put them in the bin on a further read as by current standards they were appallingly racist or sexist.
Dahl's books should transcend that as they are such brilliant stories. The substitution of a few dated words shouldn't change the enjoyment of new readers.
Presumably the estate of the author will have been involved?

PaleBlueMoonlight · 19/02/2023 08:52

www.inclusiveminds.com/about

TinaYouFatLard · 19/02/2023 08:52

I cannot believe this is being done. It honestly makes me shudder.

PaleBlueMoonlight · 19/02/2023 08:53

Last try.

www.inclusiveminds.com

TheUsualChaos · 19/02/2023 08:53

PaleBlueMoonlight · 19/02/2023 08:51

I imagine that "Inclusive Minds" prefers "woman" over "female" because they see it as inclusive of gender identity over sex. Hard to think of another reason.

Not much to go on as the website is sparse.

www.inclusiveminds.com/

This. It's subtle but actually quite important.

VoodooQualities · 19/02/2023 08:55

Presumably the estate of the author will have been involved?

The estate of the author is owned by Netflix

ReedRite · 19/02/2023 08:55

plumduck · 19/02/2023 08:46

References to “female” characters have disappeared. Miss Trunchbull in Matilda, once a “most formidable female”, is now a “most formidable woman”.

What's wrong with that?

It’s not what Dahl wrote, that’s what’s wrong with it.

Where do these eejits get off, thinking that they get to arbitrarily change the work of a writer based in their own ideology, and impose it on the rest of us?

ladyvimes · 19/02/2023 08:55

Beamur · 19/02/2023 08:52

If these were books for adults I would agree. But as they're kids books I don't think it is unreasonable to substitute some words - if a word has changed so much over time that it's current use would be offensive or would actually lose the meaning of the narrative then - provided it's thoughtfully done, I think it's fair enough.
Both DH and I have picked up much loved children's books from our childhood to read to our kids and put them in the bin on a further read as by current standards they were appallingly racist or sexist.
Dahl's books should transcend that as they are such brilliant stories. The substitution of a few dated words shouldn't change the enjoyment of new readers.
Presumably the estate of the author will have been involved?

How does this apply to changing the word female to woman?

Books should not be edited in this way, particularly when the author is dead and has no say over the changes.