Page 17 | 'Breaking' - Transgender rapist won’t be imprisoned in Scotland’s all-women jail, Nicola Sturgeon tells MSPs

zaramysaviour · 2023-01-26T12:53:37+00:00

Excellent news. And Sturgeon has really shot herself in the foot here (again). Because if she really thinks 'trans women are women', why is she not allowing this 'woman' to go to a female prison? So therefore she knows this person is not a woman. So therefore she is being transphobic...

Waitwhat23 · 26/01/2023 22:22

SudokuMania · 26/01/2023 22:13

The correspondant standing outside the prison said Police Scotland has stated the crime would not be recorded as being perpetrated by a male.
Is that correct??

That would seem to go against Police Scotland's own policy -

www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/scottish-news/police-scotland-continue-allow-criminals-26715364

murrayblackburnmackenzie.org/2022/01/08/police-scotland-policy-on-recording-rape-how-did-it-evolve-and-where-does-responsibility-lie/

I wonder why, if it is recorded as being perpetuated by a male (as it should be), the policy is being ignored for this one case 🤔

Could it be the adverse publicity? There's some epic reverse ferreting going on.

PoliticalFootball · 26/01/2023 22:28

Yes that was the first time it's been mentioned that these male crimes are being recorded as female crimes by Police Scotland. I'm sure some people probably didn't even process what was being said there. Headline news on the BBC News is excellent.

I think that's a UK-wide thing though isn't it - that male crimes are being recorded as female crimes?

Shame they haven't picked up on Isla's day release to a beauty course in Ayr - all teachers and students (mainly teenage girls I assume?) unaware they were in the presence of a man charged with two rapes. But at least STV have shone the light on this.

I saw one transwoman on Instagram put an image up of 'Isla' with the hilariously revealing comment 'Fantastic, more news to fuel the transphobes' MORE being the operative word.

Boiledbeetle · 26/01/2023 22:30

LoonyQuine · 26/01/2023 21:44

It's great that people are seeing this about "Isla" but this isn't a one-off. Maybe we need to be reminding people that "Katie Dolatowski" the now trans identifying male who sexually abused a 10 and 12 year old and was convicted for same is still held in Cornton Vale. He is 6'5" and fully male bodied.

People are going nuts over one guy once they start looking an see the montage photos of loads of them.

well

You just can't unsee it.

And it is such a massive lie to tell the public that people will be forced to look at all the shit us women have been whinging about.

Then let's see which side is the bigots, and how many suddenly rethink their thoughts on Terfs.

Boiledbeetle · 26/01/2023 22:34

Goldpaw · 26/01/2023 20:07

Looking at a pic of Isla Bryson pre-transition and it's pretty hard to believe that a shaved head, tattoo-faced person like him was trans since aged 4 like he says!

Show quote history

I know you shouldn't judge a book by its cover, but nothing about this guy hints at struggling with his masculinity.

In fact he is the poster child for toxic masculinity when you add in his crimes.

GailBlancheViola · 26/01/2023 22:35

This is doing a marvellous job of exposing the illogicality and blatant hypocrisy of Gender Idealogues and their agenda - the twisting, turning and backtracking is epic. Unfortunately for them all their words are recorded for posterity, they cannot deny their stance.

Peter Tatchell has stuck to the mantra, he's said the quiet bit out loud.

Waitwhat23 · 26/01/2023 22:36

PoliticalFootball · 26/01/2023 22:28

Yes that was the first time it's been mentioned that these male crimes are being recorded as female crimes by Police Scotland. I'm sure some people probably didn't even process what was being said there. Headline news on the BBC News is excellent.

I think that's a UK-wide thing though isn't it - that male crimes are being recorded as female crimes?

Shame they haven't picked up on Isla's day release to a beauty course in Ayr - all teachers and students (mainly teenage girls I assume?) unaware they were in the presence of a man charged with two rapes. But at least STV have shone the light on this.

I saw one transwoman on Instagram put an image up of 'Isla' with the hilariously revealing comment 'Fantastic, more news to fuel the transphobes' MORE being the operative word.

It's not a self id situation for England since Home Office change -

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/home-office-trans-crime-statistics-grc-birth-sex-b2056345.html

MarieKlepto · 26/01/2023 22:43

What a shitshow. Probs not what the SNP wanted on the heels of their GRRB nonsense. Pretty sure where he's been transferred to, and it's thankfully (and quite conveniently for the Central Belt) far, far away and relatively in the middle of nowhere with the skills to deal with this kind of shit. And for anyone who's cottoned on, yes, there is a women's wing but it's generally referred to as a men's prison.

Metabigot · 26/01/2023 22:44

This is the best thing that could have happened for the GC movement, of course regretting the original offences. But this will peak trans a lot of people, especially coming on the back of the wider devolution issue.

Glad he showcased his peen in tight leggings gir extra peaking.

Boiledbeetle · 26/01/2023 22:49

MrGHardy · 26/01/2023 21:46

Inevitable the gender ideologues are already claiming this as a success, and that the system 'works' because an obvious fake trans person was found out. The mental gymnastics one has to jump through. People are what they say they are. Unless it is someone that they really can't many people to believe is who they say they are. Then of course they are not who they say they are.

Now obviously this man is a man, but the trans mantra if they say trans they are trans no debate thing.

Well I'm finally seeing the light and taking them at their word.

This is one of theirs no debate

Boiledbeetle · 26/01/2023 22:53

Metabigot · 26/01/2023 22:44

This is the best thing that could have happened for the GC movement, of course regretting the original offences. But this will peak trans a lot of people, especially coming on the back of the wider devolution issue.

Glad he showcased his peen in tight leggings gir extra peaking.

Can you tell i want these photos recorded here for all time!

What these leggings and that pathetically small cock?

'Breaking' - Transgender rapist won’t be imprisoned in Scotland’s all-women jail, Nicola Sturgeon tells MSPs

FactsAreNotMean · 26/01/2023 22:57

MarieKlepto · 26/01/2023 22:43

What a shitshow. Probs not what the SNP wanted on the heels of their GRRB nonsense. Pretty sure where he's been transferred to, and it's thankfully (and quite conveniently for the Central Belt) far, far away and relatively in the middle of nowhere with the skills to deal with this kind of shit. And for anyone who's cottoned on, yes, there is a women's wing but it's generally referred to as a men's prison.

They're claiming he's in Saughton...

LizzieSiddal · 26/01/2023 22:59

I noticed that on the 10 o’clock BBC news report they cropped that photo at his waist, whilst ITV news showed EVERYTHING.

Thank you ITV.

yestheyhavethesamedad · 26/01/2023 23:04

I've noticed on the news sites on facebook , 98% of comments are WTF , what is the snp playing at , and anyone stating transphobia ,is being told to stop batting for a rapist , where as before stories about transwoman , were either ignored or full of people saying , "live and let live " the snp are majorly screwed up with this one .
They should have put their hands up and said we got it wrong instead of waiting for the publicity thay has spread about it

BruceAndNosh · 26/01/2023 23:12

2023username · 26/01/2023 22:12

It’s very confusing that the Trans Pennine story is running at the same time…

Look, if The Grampians wish to identify as The Pennines, you have to accept that...

OneMorePlant · 26/01/2023 23:14

Metabigot · 26/01/2023 22:44

This is the best thing that could have happened for the GC movement, of course regretting the original offences. But this will peak trans a lot of people, especially coming on the back of the wider devolution issue.

Glad he showcased his peen in tight leggings gir extra peaking.

The photographer deserves a gift basket at least

MarieKlepto · 26/01/2023 23:16

@FactsAreNotMean Ah, you are probably right. I have a fair bit of insight into what I was thinking, wrote my post then was discussing with DH, who has a far more insight regarding what you've suggested.

Boiledbeetle · 26/01/2023 23:20

So we know

Main news covering
Here covering
Twitter covering
Parliament covering
Tiktok covering
Facebook covering
Radio covering

Any others to add?

LizzieSiddal · 26/01/2023 23:28

@OneMorePlant The photographer deserves a gift basket at least

I agree with you! I read in one of the News reports, apologies I can’t remember which paper it was, that the trial had to be stopped for a day as the rapist was so upset at being photographed on his way to court. We can all imagine the audience he had in mind for his skin tight trousers.

EsmaCannonball · 26/01/2023 23:35

Even if this man were to be held in solitary confinement in a women's prison, the female prison staff would still have to deal with him. Female prison staff should not be expected to perform intimate body searches of a male rapist. IIRC, there was a case in America where a female officer in a women's prison was traumatised after being forced to monitor a male sex offender who repeatedly and deliberately masturbated in front of her.

SuperShe · 26/01/2023 23:42

HisRoyalWhineness · 26/01/2023 14:07

BBC:

Speaking at First Minister's Questions in the Scottish Parliament, Ms Sturgeon said she agreed with the chief executive of Rape Crisis that it was not possible to have a rapist within a women's prison.
Referring directly to the Bryson case, she said: "It would not be appropriate for me, in respect of any prisoner, to give details of where they are being incarcerated.
"But given the understandable public and parliamentary concern in this case, I can confirm to parliament that this prisoner will not be incarcerated at Cornton Vale women's prison.
"I hope that provides assurance to the public."
The first minister said any prisoner who poses a risk of sexual offending is segregated from other prisoners including while a risk assessment is carried out.
She said: "There is no automatic right for a trans woman convicted of a crime to serve their sentence in a female prison even if they have a gender recognition certificate.
"Every case is subject to rigorous individual risk assessment and the safety of other prisoners is paramount."
The first minister also stressed it was careful that people "do not, even inadvertently, suggest that trans women pose an inherent threat to women", adding: "Predatory men, as has always been the case, are the risk to women."

Todays rabbit hole led me to the SPS policy, “Gender Identity and Gender Reassignment Policy for those in our Custody 2014”.
I briefly skimmed the first few pages, but ofc got distracted (I blame Twitter 😂)
Then later on, I saw this post and Nicola Sturgeon’s words appeared to contradict what I had read.
I've finally had a chance to read the policy again and, yep, it appears I was right.

Nicola Sturgeon says: "There is no automatic right for a trans woman convicted of a crime to serve their sentence in a female prison even if they have a gender recognition certificate.
Every case is subject to rigorous individual risk assessment and the safety of other prisoners is paramount."

But that is the complete opposite to what the above policy states on how trans identifying males should be dealt with:

“A male-to-female person in custody living permanently as a woman without genital surgery should be allocated to a female establishment. She should not be automatically regarded as posing a high sexual offence risk to other people in custody and should not be subject to any automatic restrictions of her association with other people in custody. However, if there is clear evidence that she, as an individual, may pose a sexual offence risk, then this should be dealt with as for any other person in custody posing a risk. Only where a risk assessment determines it is justified, should she be subject to increased staff supervision or restrictions of her association with other people in custody.” (pg. 26)

Either this woman is a pathological liar or she is completely ignorant about the topic she is spouting rubbish on.

SuperShe · 26/01/2023 23:44

Link to the aforementioned policy: www.sps.gov.uk/nmsruntime/saveasdialog.aspx?fileName=SPSGenderIdentityandGenderReassignmentPolicy20142562_1392.pdf

Boiledbeetle · 27/01/2023 01:02

SuperShe · 26/01/2023 23:42

Todays rabbit hole led me to the SPS policy, “Gender Identity and Gender Reassignment Policy for those in our Custody 2014”.
I briefly skimmed the first few pages, but ofc got distracted (I blame Twitter 😂)
Then later on, I saw this post and Nicola Sturgeon’s words appeared to contradict what I had read.
I've finally had a chance to read the policy again and, yep, it appears I was right.

Nicola Sturgeon says: "There is no automatic right for a trans woman convicted of a crime to serve their sentence in a female prison even if they have a gender recognition certificate.
Every case is subject to rigorous individual risk assessment and the safety of other prisoners is paramount."

But that is the complete opposite to what the above policy states on how trans identifying males should be dealt with:

“A male-to-female person in custody living permanently as a woman without genital surgery should be allocated to a female establishment. She should not be automatically regarded as posing a high sexual offence risk to other people in custody and should not be subject to any automatic restrictions of her association with other people in custody. However, if there is clear evidence that she, as an individual, may pose a sexual offence risk, then this should be dealt with as for any other person in custody posing a risk. Only where a risk assessment determines it is justified, should she be subject to increased staff supervision or restrictions of her association with other people in custody.” (pg. 26)

Either this woman is a pathological liar or she is completely ignorant about the topic she is spouting rubbish on.

Show quote history

Either this woman is a pathological liar or she is completely ignorant about the topic she is spouting rubbish on.

BOTH

Boiledbeetle · 27/01/2023 01:48

Well this conversation is going to remain in the news for another day

lemmein · 27/01/2023 02:43

Ireallycantthinkofagoodone · 26/01/2023 15:55

Prisons are single sex institutions, AFAIK.

No-one can change sex.

They can call themselves whatever they want, and live their lives accordingly. He/She/They/female today/male tomorrow. I don’t care. But in any situation where facilities are for single sex, then you go with the sex you were when you were born.

I also don’t care who disagrees with my stance, so don’t bother with any pointless nasty responses.

I have a friend who is a TW. Even though I'm GC and agree with your post I do wonder what would happen to people like my friend if they were imprisoned.

She's very slightly built and 100% passes. Id known her a few years before I found out she was a TW, I genuinely had no idea. She had reassignment surgery when she was in her late teens/early 20s. I haven't spoken to her in great detail about trans issues because although we're friends we're not close enough for me to be that nosey, but I've seen no evidence of her being involved with TRAs, she just quietly gets on with her life, like the rest of us. I'm calling her 'she' because even though I believe you can't change sex I've only ever known her as a she so saying otherwise would feel weird.

She has relationships with men, pretty sure she has no interest at all in women and I can't imagine her ever being a risk to females - if I got into a fight with her I'd fancy my chances, put it that way.

So, if she was to be put in a male prison she would undoubtedly be in danger. She presents every way as 'female' - zero 'tell-tale' signs, so how could she be housed with men who are likely to rape her? Should there be a separate prison/wing for TG's? But then what would be the criteria - pretty sure Isla-Whatshisname would pose a danger to my friend too, so should the criteria for a TW prison/wing be completed reassignment surgery? Or is it no different to putting slightly built men into male prisons who would be vulnerable to predators and no special measures are needed for people like my friend?

Although I've quoted you I'm not necessarily asking you to answer, just throwing it out there because it hurts my brain thinking about it.

lemmein · 27/01/2023 02:48

*So, if she was to be put in a male prison she would undoubtedly be in danger. She presents every way as 'female' - zero 'tell-tale' signs, so how could she be housed with men who are likely to rape her? Should there be a separate prison/wing for TG's? But then what would be the criteria - pretty sure Isla-Whatshisname would pose a danger to my friend too, so should the criteria for a TW prison/wing be completed reassignment surgery? Or is it no different to putting slightly built men into male prisons who would be vulnerable to predators and no special measures are needed for people like my friend?

Although I've quoted you I'm not necessarily asking you to answer, just throwing it out there because it hurts my brain thinking about it.*

Just wanted to add, although I'm asking others opinions here I'm no way suggesting this is a problem for women to solve, or that women should give up their safe spaces to accommodate vulnerable natal males. Just wondering what others views are on it.