Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Bullying your mum isn't activism, magnificent Glosswitch response to creepy Novara media article

117 replies

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 04/01/2023 15:59

Apologies if this has its own thread already, I couldn't see one. Glosswitch has written yet another excellent article: thecritic.co.uk/Bullying-your-mum-isnt-activism/

It's a response to novaramedia.com/2022/12/24/how-i-deradicalised-my-terf-mum/ published on Christmas Eve. The very timing tells me all I need to know. The people on the right side of history, by their own lights. were sitting on the sofa reading this, nodding and punching the air in support of 'Will' and his chums, while their decrepit, simple-minded mothers, aunts and grandmothers, i.e. the Janets of this world, were toiling away peeling sprouts and checking the cooking instructions on the vegan roast they'd bought for the Novara Media subscriber, hoping against hope it would pass muster.

In short, 'Will', the male child, bullies his mum, 'Janet', who has had great difficulty accepting that her other child, born female, now identifies as a transman, by threatening that if she doesn't give up her 'transphobia', i.e. stubborn adherence to material reality and concern about health consequences of unevidenced hormone and surgical treatments, both of her children will cut her off and encourage all their friends and neighbours to do the same. Nice guy, huh?

Glosswitch nails what's going on here. I was pleased to see that so did dozens of other outraged people on Twitter.

The son “Will” is obviously proud of himself, even though what he is describing is a form of coercive control. Threatening to isolate a female relative unless she denies her perceptions of reality indicates he does not care that she may not believe what she is saying. All that matters is that she has been forced into line. This is not activism; it is patriarchy.

Amen to that! The Novara article was written by a woman, depressingly.

OP posts:
nilsmousehammer · 04/01/2023 18:16

Again its the ability to see the bigger picture and the lack of life experience they're blind to. So many parents will humour them, nod and smile, do whatever they have to do because they don't live in the moment and with totally internal fixation, and have their eye on the long term and trying to preserve both their kid and their kid's future. And have the capacity to put their kid above themselves in doing this.

The TQ+ activist movement need to look up 'carer burn out'. Cos I'm there. It happens.

WolverineBlueyy · 04/01/2023 18:24

IcakethereforeIam · 04/01/2023 17:53

You don't seem to be able to comment below the article.

Here's (I hope) a link to the thing on twitter

twitter.com/novaramedia/status/1606757597272498185?s=20&t=4eGO4v3AfL_0fp9NjydyGg

Everything about it is just so lazy, even that smug tweet which again attempts to tie together the gender critical with the right wing.

It's full of substance-free dog-whistles, absolutely reeks of immaturity and bad faith, and (further) undermines Novara as an outlet.

Ofcourseshecan · 04/01/2023 18:42

I was spellbound by George Orwell when I first read 1984 some 50 years ago. But I did think it was a bit unrealistically grim. Children terrorising and informing on their parents, for example. Adults being forced to pretend to believe impossibilities, etc.

When I discovered these things had happened in other times and places, I was glad that they couldn’t happen here and now ….

Boiledbeetle · 04/01/2023 18:54

Ofcourseshecan · 04/01/2023 18:42

I was spellbound by George Orwell when I first read 1984 some 50 years ago. But I did think it was a bit unrealistically grim. Children terrorising and informing on their parents, for example. Adults being forced to pretend to believe impossibilities, etc.

When I discovered these things had happened in other times and places, I was glad that they couldn’t happen here and now ….

I waited until it was 1984 before I read it for the first time. I was 11 and straight after I read Fahrenheit 451.

I have questioned the reasoning behind everything ever since. Even the seemingly innocuous if It doesn't sit right with me.

Minimalme · 04/01/2023 18:56

Will has no idea what it is like not to be loved by your Mother.

He threatened her, knowing she would 'fix up' rather than loose him.

His triumphant tone betrays his dark desire to defeat his Mother and destroy her independent opinions.

I wonder if Janet has made her son feel a little too important?

Floisme · 04/01/2023 19:05

Can we stop blaming Janet for her son's behaviour please. And I'm not comfortable either with the 'If I were Janet I'd pack his bags for him' posts. If this is a true story and she's really on Mumnset, why make her feel even worse? We all know why she went along with his manipulative behaviour. Don't we?

Boiledbeetle · 04/01/2023 19:17

We all know why she went along with his manipulative behaviour. Don't we?

Quite honestly? No.

Falalalalalalaetc · 04/01/2023 19:19

Or is he sitting around reading the Guardian while his terribly transphobic mum does all the laundry and cooks his dinner?

I'm guessing this. I hope she at the very least goes on strike and refuses to do a single bit of housework or carry any mental load for the ungrateful little abuser.

I bet her friends would agree with her, not him in any case. Maybe not openly, but they would believe the same things as she does.

Falalalalalalaetc · 04/01/2023 19:21

Anyway, this is all making me feel a lot better about telling my children 'no' earlier, even though I felt guilty at the time and they were upset.

They do need to have boundaries otherwise they end up as unlikeable and abusive as Will.

nilsmousehammer · 04/01/2023 19:39

What's one of the biggest and most effective things on MN?

It's the relationships boards. And AIBU and chat, and all the places where a woman can say 'this is happening to me' and other women will prop her up, tell her how it is often in words of one syllable because women have a lot of high expectations of each other they don't extend to anyone else, and many, many women have left abusers, set up again, got lives of their own, learned how to move away from the abusive patterns and find the relationships they deserve.

MRAs have always hated that.

I am increasingly thinking one of the most useful things we can do to stand up to this ruddy awful behaviour and exploitation of women, particularly older women, is to get as many women as possible through the freedom programme, and hand them a copy of Lundy Bancroft's 'Why does he do that'.

And then we need to figure out how we help boys to not grow up to be abusive arseholes.

NotTerfNorCis · 04/01/2023 19:51

Wow I only got a few paragraphs into the Novara article and I'm already horrified.

Realising they would never change their mother’s mind, they made a threat: accept Arthur or lose contact.

'Accept our cultish thinking or lose contact with your own kids!' That's not deradicalising, that's terrorising a vulnerable person - the person who gave you life and raised you. This man is repugnant.

it worked: “I think the fear of losing the people closest to her was a strong motivating force.”

Vile. Just a vile excuse for a human being.

Abhannmor · 04/01/2023 19:52

Ha...I bet Janet is just stringing him along. Reality will come crashing in and she will be magnanimous when the pronouns are binned.

I used to sometimes watch Novara but gave up in despair.

lechiffre55 · 04/01/2023 19:53

Minimalme · Today 18:56
Will has no idea what it is like not to be loved by your Mother.
He threatened her, knowing she would 'fix up' rather than loose him.
His triumphant tone betrays his dark desire to defeat his Mother and destroy her independent opinions.

What you said made me wonder if there some element of oedipus complex going on with Will but with a modern twist of transing by conquering his mother. If he conquers his mother could that be a bit like becoming her through subjugating her to his will?

Wiccan · 04/01/2023 19:54

We have an adult daughter who pulled this controlling shit she is a complete parent hater especially aimed at her mum ! When we stood our ground the accusations started
You're bad parents
You aren't safe to be around
You're unhinged
I don't agree with your values
( Yawn )

If you don't see it my way I will have no choice but to go NC with you .

Our response was If it gives us some peace , no drama and we don't have to tolerate the manipulation we're OK with that . She on the other hand was shocked to fuck !

NotTerfNorCis · 04/01/2023 19:58

Would serve Will right if his own kids signed up for a fanatical political cause, not just any cause but one he was rationally and emotionally opposed to. And they gave him an ultimation: either you sign up too, or we're going no-contact. You can grow old on your own. Except that's a cruel thing to wish on anyone.

ArabellaScott · 04/01/2023 19:59

Finally reading the article.

JFC.

'sometimes you have to have a real threat as a form of leverage'

Is that so, you wee fuck?

NotTerfNorCis · 04/01/2023 20:02

Broader social pressure may have multiplied the brothers’ impact. Will’s family is part of a small, close-knit group of families in south London, and when their children found out what was happening with Janet, they encouraged their parents to speak to her, too. “There was another community she would have been isolated from that she also valued”

Oh my God. This guy has issues. It's okay for people to have different political opinions, you don't have to cut them off from their family and community!! That's the kind of thing groups like JWs and scientologists do.

ArabellaScott · 04/01/2023 20:02

If this mum really is on here, then good lord, woman. I am so sorry. And I'm also sorry for swearing at your son. I have strong reactions to abusive males.

There are resources here for child-to-parent abuse:

www.riseuk.org.uk/get-help/about-domestic-abuse/child-to-parent-abuse

ArabellaScott · 04/01/2023 20:03

More resources here, this organisation specialises in CTPA:

www.pegsupport.co.uk/

MilkshakesBringAllTheCoosToTheYard · 04/01/2023 20:14

Assuming the trans child is the younger one, they decided to transition age 15. Poor Janet, being relentlessly bullied by a 15 year old and a 17 year old for five years...

In passing, that second red pill story is the exact plot of a (fairly dull) play I saw in Edinburgh this year...

LaughingPriest · 04/01/2023 20:22

boatyardblues · 04/01/2023 17:24

From the Novara article:

To me, the moral of the story seems clear: people aren’t convinced by reason but by emotion.

Nope, that’s manipulation not convincing.

I genuinely remember someone I know making this exact point about Brexit.

LaughingPriest · 04/01/2023 20:28

You just know that all this would be over in a week if all mums came out as non binary.

BreadInCaptivity · 04/01/2023 21:25

Goodness me, what I have I just read....

What shines through is a celebration of spite. A joyous glee in the erasure of his mothers ability to express her own opinion. Not content with erasing the meaning of sex, it's a celebration of erasing that person's identity in the context of them being allowed to express independent thought.

It's the same emotion you see in the snarling grimaces of TRA's who yell "witch" in a woman's face, or scream a person holding a baby that they are a transphobe for supporting women's rights.

Have they read Animal Farm?

beastlyslumber · 04/01/2023 22:37

If the mum is on here, I hope she can find us. MN may be a nest of vipers but we really will support you to get out of an abusive relationship.

NotTerfNorCis · 04/01/2023 23:12

I don't know if anyone has posted this link yet - but Novara probably didn't predict this kind of response! twitter.com/novaramedia/status/1606968124061917190