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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Bullying your mum isn't activism, magnificent Glosswitch response to creepy Novara media article

117 replies

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 04/01/2023 15:59

Apologies if this has its own thread already, I couldn't see one. Glosswitch has written yet another excellent article: thecritic.co.uk/Bullying-your-mum-isnt-activism/

It's a response to novaramedia.com/2022/12/24/how-i-deradicalised-my-terf-mum/ published on Christmas Eve. The very timing tells me all I need to know. The people on the right side of history, by their own lights. were sitting on the sofa reading this, nodding and punching the air in support of 'Will' and his chums, while their decrepit, simple-minded mothers, aunts and grandmothers, i.e. the Janets of this world, were toiling away peeling sprouts and checking the cooking instructions on the vegan roast they'd bought for the Novara Media subscriber, hoping against hope it would pass muster.

In short, 'Will', the male child, bullies his mum, 'Janet', who has had great difficulty accepting that her other child, born female, now identifies as a transman, by threatening that if she doesn't give up her 'transphobia', i.e. stubborn adherence to material reality and concern about health consequences of unevidenced hormone and surgical treatments, both of her children will cut her off and encourage all their friends and neighbours to do the same. Nice guy, huh?

Glosswitch nails what's going on here. I was pleased to see that so did dozens of other outraged people on Twitter.

The son “Will” is obviously proud of himself, even though what he is describing is a form of coercive control. Threatening to isolate a female relative unless she denies her perceptions of reality indicates he does not care that she may not believe what she is saying. All that matters is that she has been forced into line. This is not activism; it is patriarchy.

Amen to that! The Novara article was written by a woman, depressingly.

OP posts:
Boiledbeetle · 04/01/2023 16:16

The coercive little bully that he was he tried to tell his mum that she meant nothing to get online friends in Mumsnet.

We may just be funny names on a page, and have never met or know each others actual name. But we are there for each other. That shines through on these threads every single bloody day. We do actually care about each others well being as has been made very clear to me over what has been an emotional few days on this site.I

He thinks we are doing what they do, using people for their own gratification. It's like they have no idea how normal people interact with each other. The fact that a group of women could come together with diverse backgrounds and opinions and be able to support each other just because seemed lost on him.

But yeah we don't care about each other at all. And using coercively bullying behaviour to bring your mother into line is not a good look.

How dare he the little gobshite

Right off to read the article this post is about

Boiledbeetle · 04/01/2023 16:16

To HER online friends

RoseslnTheHospital · 04/01/2023 16:22

It's a great response to that article, and the comparison with her mum's beliefs about abortion is a good illustration imo.

Rightsraptor · 04/01/2023 16:25

That Will is a little patriarchal shit.

I'd take him at his word and remove him from my life. See how long it'd be till he came crawling back.

OK, so maybe he wouldn't but it's a risk I'd take. My own 40-something child treats me similarly and would be disowned if it came down to my being told 'say what I tell you or else'. I suspect It only hasn't come to that as we don't see much of each other.

Twicebakedroastpotatoes · 04/01/2023 16:29

Ugh. I'd be so ashamed if I'd raised a revolting, intolerant little bully like Will. Janet should tell him to run along and come back when he's finished his pathetic tantrum, and tell the parents of the other brats to fuck off while she's at it. Friends who will cut you off for believing in biological sex are not friends.

Helleofabore · 04/01/2023 16:33

I am keen to read it. I thought that Navara media article was a shocker. And that the author though that was a great thing to publish.

All it did was show exactly what the polls have said lately about the totalitarian intolerance of those in and around that age bracket.

It couldn’t have been a better example of it. Either from the son OR from the media company who thought that was a thing to celebrate.

LaughingPriest · 04/01/2023 16:35

Young adults who boast of “schooling” their “bigoted” mothers are model patriarchs.

One thing i have noted loud and clear since coming here several years ago to ask questions - they're not really teaching anything. I have a bunch of questions about both large issues and specifics about gender ideology, and guess what? They are never, ever answered. Any responses are 50% dishonest rewording of the question so it says something else, or just responding to a different question altogether, and 50% just saying "that's what the Christian far-right (etc etc) says".

They don't know their subject well enough to be "schooling" anyone on it. Those that do are usually people with gender dysphoria who recognise that men are male and women are female and wish to change sex accordingly. Yet others insist that gender identity has nothing to do with bodies.

Boiledbeetle · 04/01/2023 16:35

It's like the critic article shows they require complete and utter capitulation to their ideals.

When did children get so much power over their parents? When did it start being OK. Before kids accepted their parents are from a different generation, had lived and therefore are looking at it from a place of experience. Didn't mean we agreed with our parent's but at at least treated then with respect and agreed to disagree.

What happened?

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 04/01/2023 16:35

That Will sounds a right wanker.
Sympathy to her on having a son who turned out like that.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 04/01/2023 16:39

LaughingPriest · 04/01/2023 16:35

Young adults who boast of “schooling” their “bigoted” mothers are model patriarchs.

One thing i have noted loud and clear since coming here several years ago to ask questions - they're not really teaching anything. I have a bunch of questions about both large issues and specifics about gender ideology, and guess what? They are never, ever answered. Any responses are 50% dishonest rewording of the question so it says something else, or just responding to a different question altogether, and 50% just saying "that's what the Christian far-right (etc etc) says".

They don't know their subject well enough to be "schooling" anyone on it. Those that do are usually people with gender dysphoria who recognise that men are male and women are female and wish to change sex accordingly. Yet others insist that gender identity has nothing to do with bodies.

The word ‘schooling’ has bothered me for a while and I think I see why now. It’s because it’s not about teaching in the true educational sense it’s about using punishment to train them to behave in the way you want. Like schooling an animal. It is dehumanising, it is not about responding to the person as an equal human being.

WinterFoxes · 04/01/2023 16:39

I wonder what she was guilty of? Trying to explain how men have always found new ways to encroach on women's spaces and remove their rights? Or trying to explain to her trans child that they cannot literally, physically change sex?

Helleofabore · 04/01/2023 16:43

I hope Janet is ok. I hope that she is reading this and knowing that she still has support. What a terrible abusive situation to be in.

And we know Janet is not the only one.

Flowers
DontAskIDontKnow · 04/01/2023 16:46

What Will won’t realise is that Janet is now probably more determined to push back against this nonsense.

We women tend to be stubborn and know that we’re in it for the long haul on this one.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 04/01/2023 16:47

WinterFoxes · 04/01/2023 16:39

I wonder what she was guilty of? Trying to explain how men have always found new ways to encroach on women's spaces and remove their rights? Or trying to explain to her trans child that they cannot literally, physically change sex?

Assuming it's a true story, 'Janet' has two children. The Novara journalist and Janet's son, 'Will'. have unhesitatingly accepted that 'Arthur' is a son now because 'Arthur' identifies as a man. 'Arthur' presumably used to have a more typically female name and to be referred to as she/her. I have a son and a daughter. If my daughter told me she was now my son, I would struggle very badly with the news, especially if it was clear that cross-hormones and surgery were on the cards, because I would be so worrried about the long-term health consequences, and also about what might have led to this life-changing decision. I would find it next door to impossible to remember to refer to my very obviously female child by him/her. I would be unable to explain any of what was happening to my elderly parents. It would be a nightmare.

Will et al have fallen for the ludicrously oversimplified sloganising that trans rights are just an extension of gay rights. No rigorous thought has gone into this at all. Just another case of a male who's never given women's rights a moment's serious thought airily waving them away. Not yours to give away, mate!

OP posts:
Justme56 · 04/01/2023 16:47

Wonder if there is a correlation between the sister transitioning and having Will as a brother?

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 04/01/2023 16:49

Yes, I must say I did wonder, and indeed hope, that Janet has been allowed to keep her Mumsnet account. Presumably Will doesn't monitor her internet history .

OP posts:
NothingTraLaLa · 04/01/2023 16:52

I think this extract from the Novara article sums up the TRA movement quite nicely. Emotion over reason (because heaven knows reason and logic are absent in much of the ideology):

“To me, the moral of the story seems clear: people aren’t convinced by reason but by emotion. When it comes to talking down your rightwing relatives, your biggest leverage isn’t the Marx you’ve read, but your relationship with them. Remember that before going all guns blazing into Christmas dinner.”

lechiffre55 · 04/01/2023 16:54

Isn't this what they did under Mao? Denounce the parents as traitors and berate them during struggle sessions.

Floisme · 04/01/2023 16:58

For Janet Flowers
Will's attitude chilled me to my core.
I'm looking forward to Glosswitch's book.

AutumnCrow · 04/01/2023 17:03

lechiffre55 · 04/01/2023 16:54

Isn't this what they did under Mao? Denounce the parents as traitors and berate them during struggle sessions.

It's all so tedious, isn't it? A bunch of middle class fuckwits trying to re-enact the Cultural Revolution in order to feel relevant and act out their arrested childhood resentments of their mothers. They really hate their mothers.

I'd like to see #JanetIsCuttingYouOutOfTheWillDearWill trending. See how the nouveau faux Chinese peasantry like them apples.

Floisme · 04/01/2023 17:07

The thing is, Janet is highly unlikely to cut her son out of her will. The chances are that she loves him more than life itself. And doesn't he know it.

Nothingandnowhere · 04/01/2023 17:11

I'm cringing so hard over that 2nd piece - the author has confused 'red-pilled' with 'black-pilled'. I'm sure they would say it reflected poorly on me that I'm pointing this out but at least I'm not appropriating language from a subculture I'm clearly not familiar enough with and making embarrassing mistakes like that.

Boiledbeetle · 04/01/2023 17:11

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 04/01/2023 16:49

Yes, I must say I did wonder, and indeed hope, that Janet has been allowed to keep her Mumsnet account. Presumably Will doesn't monitor her internet history .

Well he obviously rifled through her stuff and hacks her accounts in order to find her secret ( he sounds like an abusive husband not child) Mumsnet account. And I can't imagine how toxic the atmosphere in that house must have been before the discovery for her to have felt the need to hide it originally.before

It's just so wrong.

WolverineBlueyy · 04/01/2023 17:14

Not sure what I just read on Novara. A work of fiction, surely?

Nasty, aggressive, entitled and hard to follow, I'm not sure what kind of editor would think that was worth publishing for any reason.

TidyDancer · 04/01/2023 17:16

Wow. Will is a nasty and abusive little bastard isn't he? I really hope Janet is able to see some hope for her daughter to one day wake up but I wouldn't bet on it for her vile son. Sounds like he may very well have had a hand in the daughter transing.