How do you speak up without being called transphobic

[Enterusername111333]

I just feel so lost... I don't know how to voice my opinion without accusations so I just take the easy option. Where does it end?

@maddy68 the problem with utilising the term transphobic now is if you just want to have a discussion, state biological fact, want to discuss Womens right and spaces. ‘Any’ deviation from the trans ideology (which research is strong and fast disputing and trying to question) is considered transphobic. This is dangerous territory, as it not only obliterates free speech - something that is needed to ensure everyone in society is treated equally and fairly, but it actually damages the very people trans ideology is professing to try and help. The current dialogue is aggressive and is often accompanied by actual violence, mostly against women (the irony in this), which then creates an ‘us and them’ situation and further creates a divide. Those most vocal in the trans community who spew trans ideology are amongst the most dangerous people I have ever encountered. They don't.care about actual facts, just that there feelings are pampered and validated. Fuck everyone else. Male privilege at it's worse.

Again, I will reiterate I don't think this is all TW, but a select aggressive and violent minority who imo are dangerous and need help.

I need this compass! (Great post)

@LiesDoNotBecomeUs

Ta da

www.politicalcompass.org/test/en

Why do you want to force team sexual orientation with someone claiming they are the opposite sex?

Sexual orientation is simply who attracts someone sexually. It is not required that other people engage in a suspension of reality.

As the esteemed Professor Robert Winston said "you cannot change your sex". Now, if someone maintains this simple truth is transphobic, I think we have to employ the words of Alexander Solzhenitsyn "Live not by lies". and stop trying to co-opt sexual orientation as a forced cover for something unrelated

People who are born male cannot change sex and become female.

This is not a transphobic opinion. It is basic biology.

It's actually so basic, your average pre-schooler could spell it out for you.

It's astonishing how many times I have been told that it is incorrect/unkind to hold this view.

But what I think is REALLY incorrect/unkind is to encourage confused young people to pursue a fairytale ideology that signs them up to a lifetime of medication and surgery.

Do you think they just press report on all posts, or do they deign to bring themselves to read them? Wouldn’t reading uncensored posts be unsafe and litoral violence?

Or do they take it in turns? And then mass report a post after just one has read it and framed it to match their perception of this board?

note: this is not aimed at particular posters but at random readers who may be reporting posts, if the posts are in fact being reported.

Hi @Enterusername111333
It's hard when you're being shouted down by the likes of @pickle_bee.

I started to write down the pearls of wisdom as I learn.

"Use sex not gender"
"Sex is binary"
"Gender dysphoria is a mental health condition"
"I don't believe in transing away the gay"
"Surgery is irreversible"
"What's wrong with being proud to be gay or lesbian?"
"Dress as you like!"
"You can't BE trans. It's a verb. You can be born gay but you can't BE trans"

I think they target certain posters. And they target anything that's likely to get the scales to drop.

These days people are getting a lot of information about this issue, and the doubts are tip toeing in. It doesn't take much for creeping realisations to explode in a blinding flash of light.

I screen shot mine this morning as I knew it wouldnt stay up

So looking at it now. I pulled up the c I s issue reminded about his be polite dictat

Reminded them where they currently were.

Told them most impolite thing they could do here is to cisgender. That we needed no descriptive word in front of woman.we aren't a sub setof

And gave an example of them being upset over mister gendering and then in capitals gave back exactly what we get called as insults back at him for the crime of cisgendering. Ending with. Now that makes me look mad doesn't it. Think on it.

And it went pffft.

Admittedly looking at it having not woken after little sleep only five minutes before I wrote the post I will admit I might have been out of order....if I'd just given out the shit without the whole bunch before it and the question at the end. If it ever appears in shortened form online I have the original.

They can give it but they can't even take an example back in return to show how nuts their behaviour is. Because they know they are not the good guys in the behaviour of how the two groups interact

Hey sorry I fell asleep after posting and have spent the day dipping in and out reading the many amazing responses. Thank you.

I'm in Scotland and the whole self ID stiff has really made me uneasy. I think or thought, I was fairly lefty liberal but have been doubting that giving my feelings on this topic

For me I feel like theres a feeling from some transwomen (men) that as a woman I should just sit down and shut up as they are here to woman better than me.

There have also been adverts on local radio inviting people with cervixs to book their smear test. I couldn't understand what I was hearing.

Yes, and I don't believe for one minute this is for the benefit of transmen. Easy enough to dsy woman and trans men.

No, its to avoid offending transwomen. Those words that cannot be linked to woman, such as smear test must be put in Newspeak

Yes, the imbalance is quite astonishing

We must accept their language rules etc unquestionably.

The minute you dare go off script it's terf bigot time.

I am estranged from my wokebro brother due to one conversation along these lines.

Has any other minority group in history changed the language of the majority group against their will?

Gay people saying heterosexual are to be called ' non gay'

Black people saying whites are now peachy hued

I think the main objection to cis is that it's been enforced, no question, and people generally don't like being told what to call themselves.

Plus it makes women a subset of women of course

I am not surprised. Devon NHS Trust twitter account was reprimanded for calling women ‘pregnant people’ whilst continuing to label men and boys as men and boys.

See here - men get to be called men, not people with prostates! So Trans activists have not called out these tweets about males for excluding trans women. It’s almost as though they don’t care about trans women accessing appropriate healthcare such as prostate exams. All they seem to care about is maintaining the fiction that trans women have changed sex and that every little bit of discussion they challenged their view is transphobic.

if you think this is wrong, please tag @jane_milligan who is the chief executive of Devon NHS Trust. They need to retrain their social media manager.

It's the m word. We cannot refer to m'ing because it is upsetting to those who m.

Keep up!

Much of this political movement is based on the fond belief that if you control the words and control everyone else saying the words you can change reality and make the unwanted bits go away.

As opposed to just making everyone really pissed off and forcing them to explain reality increasingly loudly and in very small words.

@nilsmousehammer sadly I think there is something in that argument, especially if comprehension control starts in infant school.

There are many people (men and women) thinking this is a good thing because to quote Victoria Coren here: www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/mar/12/transgender-free-speech-bbc-jenni-murray-victoria-coren-mitchell?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

it’s the transgender lobby’s moment. The future is now! The smashed spectacles have become a clenched fist, the stammering croak is a battle cry!

For me the issue is still not understanding what trans is. It is incoherent, a feeling, an assertion that results either in overstepping spaces of the vulnerable or in surgery on healthy tissue. I don't understand why we are teaching this to children. The whole issue is under comprehensively understood. Was quite upset to read that piece to be honest.

I am not surprised. Devon NHS Trust twitter account was reprimanded for calling women ‘pregnant people’ whilst continuing to label men and boys as men and boys.

My local hospital thankfully still has signs saying Women's and children department.

I had to go there for a scan in the summer during a week where 'pregnant people' was being discussed quite heavily on here...

Women's and Children Department

Sat there in the waiting room, waiting for a scan
Everyone a woman, though a few had brought their man
You could tell which ones were pregnant and none of them a man
It was the women with the bellies on the way in for their scan.

Temporarily at best.

If one group of people can change reality by changing words, then any group of people can change it to something else by changing the words. A group may rise by the incoherent tosh and manipulation and have created the means by which they will fall to someone else's incoherent tosh and manipulation.

It's all very short sighted, childish and the thing about trying to block out reality is that it doesn't go away, it just comes around behind you and bites you in the bum.

I think there is a balance and both sides seem unable to see that the other has a point!

My take is, there are times when single sex spaces are important and that should be honoured eg shared, hospital bays, changing rooms without individual cubicles and in these circumstances all public spaces should have provision for those who do not fit into the gender binary so nobody is made uncomfortable eg a side room at the hospital or a disabled changing room. In other parts of society moving towards unisex facilities is a better option (eg smaller public spaces like coffee shops often have unisex single facility toilets). For services like prisons they need to have a system in place to safeguard the trans person and the other inmates, it's not rocket science. In a few professions, where there is genuine need, single sex provision should be an option eg non emergency gynaecology, intimate nursing, counselling following rape, but it is pretty limited after all, who cares about the sex of their brain surgeon!

We need to get over the panic, honestly it's not that complicated to live together whilst showing respect and provision where necessary. My DD's generation really doesn't care, they just aren't self conscious in the same way

honestly it's not that complicated to live together whilst showing respect and provision where necessary.

That isn't what's happening though.

Yeah we tried being nice being kind being polite offering new third spaces.

NO BIGOTS WE WANT EVERYTHING came the reply.

and with respect @gogohmm the word "panic" is used in the same way as the word "transphobe". Stop making points and arguments, sit down, and shut up!

My DD's generation really doesn't care, they just aren't self conscious in the same way

Well whoopdeedoo for your DD and her incredibly fortunate friends who've yet to discover the world isn't all unicorns and sparkles.