How do you speak up without being called transphobic

[Enterusername111333]

I just feel so lost... I don't know how to voice my opinion without accusations so I just take the easy option. Where does it end?

I don't know about this. If someone looks like a man because that's how they present, would you be comfortable then if they used a woman's toilet? Even though they look exactly like a male but don't have a penis? I sometimes think people haven't thought this through. How would you even know?

I can't see it's really an issue for me as an older woman who has lived for over 50 years! I just think there are other things in the world to worry about. Yes I have heard what people think & say about this & rightly or wrongly that's what I think. No disrespect to anyone you are entitled to an opinion as I am.

@TodayInahurry

This actually worries me too. He's a coward.

@Messyhair321 the more I've seen of this issue the more I've seen there seems to be a dominant type of TW who I think do more damage to the trans community. It isn't about freedom of expression for them but about power and control.

@EvilBee this is incomprehensible. Try saying what you mean rather than slinging out 6th form ‘zingers’

It's not transphobic here, there's people just defending womens rights and realising that trans rights are not womens rights. Funny how people want to shut down those discussions.
OP don't worry about being called transphobic, I don't.

Oh here we go, conflating opinions and violence…….

I am also an older woman who has lived for over 50 years Messyhair321 but I am still affected by male childhood abuse, and ending up in abusive relationships as an adult, and I have a trauma response to men I don't know/trust being close to me when I am in any way vulnerable. Despite years of therapy, this is a reaction that is wired into my body and it's lesson slightly in some situations but I can't imagine it's ever going to go away. So I don't think this is so much of an age thing as an experience thing.

Can I ask @Messyhair321 have you in real life came across a trans man in a women’s toilet that you believed was a man? To my knowledge I haven’t. I have encountered natal men trying to get in to Women’s toilets. It was incredibly obvious they were men. I’m not saying you can identify every trans man, but I do think your post refers to a bit of a flight of fancy hypothetical situation without any grounding in reality and as such I am not sure what if adds to the conversation

I have undoubtedly been in the toilets/changing rooms with a TW but this same type of TW doesn't go around threatening violence. Gender ideology is more than the TWAW trope (again this tagline more prominent that TMAM - why is this do you think if it isn't a direct result of male entitlement?). Gender ideology is in our schools, it is interfering with normal and experimental child development. It is enticing kids to socially transition. It's bringing drag shows into family arenas. It is introducing kids from a very young age to a language they do not need to know about. It is about changing our actual language - the use of MAPs instead of pedophiles. It's about demanding access to Womens spaces and sports and if we dare to speak out we are transphobes/terfs. It is shitting down the science about this issue - grants have been lost, sex based charities have lost funding, lecturers lost jobs etc... For just wanting to research the issue. We know there's trends, but we can't utter them, because you know it's... This terminology is extremely vitriolic. It shuts people (mostly women) down. Women have lost jobs, promotions, been arrested, even targeted and attacked. This isn't a trans rights issue anymore but a male entitlement for some very angry and power hungry men.

You are roughly the same age as me messy, and yes it does matter to me, my daughters and my grandchildren.
No male should go in female spaces.

Being kept out of spaces where women are vulnerable is not being kicked in the face. The transperbole is in part why people are waking up to this insidious nonsense. The constant shrieks of transphobia worked to silence the empathetic for a long time but now you are just peaking more of us with every word.

Load of old nonsense. Accusing someone of being transphobic is often just a cheap trick.

I’m ok with being called transphobic these days because I am so 100% confident that penis=man and chopped off penis=man. It doesn’t stop it being frustrating but people are generally quite intelligent and secretly agree, they just need reassuring that it’s ok to believe in facts and science and standing by your beliefs, even with a fully grown man shouting in your face and making threats.

So we are straight to the not-so subtle accusation that any dissent is the same as physical violence.

Tell me, how is the violent transphobe who physically assaults another human being the same as a woman who wants single sex services?

Telling women they’re as bad as those who commit violent assault because they want a single sex changing room won’t work forever. People know the difference.

FWIW posters here don’t advocate for violence towards trans people. And if a random drive by poster did it would be challenged. But don’t let the truth get in the way, eh?

Not sure what you mean but I've used many many public toilets & not once have I encountered any man trying to use a womens toilet. I am nearing 60 & used many public conveniences all over the world - much more as I'm getting older I hasten to add!
Am sorry you've had this experience if it's negative.

@Boiledbeetle ah BB - I need to take some inspiration from this. Loved what you did with ‘terf’ too. I didn't want to bring up the ‘cis’, but you were braver than I. Only the other day did I learn it's origin - fucking hell.

@EvilBee interesting how I took your mention of violence as actual physical violence? Was it? Or was it the fact there was a group of women discussing how gender ideology/terfdom impacts our health and spaces? Please clarify?

@Enterusername111333 fwiw - I think Bee is demonstrating beautifully what tends to happen in this type of debate. I think women just need to breath near some type of TW and we will be called transphobes. The other day I was privvy to a discussion on cisprivelage. Utter bollocks of course, but another tactic used to fuel the #beekind brigade.

Goodness me there are a lot of new visitors to this board who just don’t see men in women’s spaces as a problem

i wonder why they’re all here…..

My advice OP is to not give a fuck about being called transphobic. It's all they've got in response. That and hyperbole. It's being played out live on this thread.

It might be best to start with what particular opinions you want to speak about. Is it about what is taught in schools? About sports? About the need for single-sex changing rooms?

OP I've disagreed openly with gender neutral toilets in schools, proposed gender neutral changing rooms in a gym (no single sex spaces) and those in shops.

Whatever you think or say, its transphobic to some people.

💯