Scottish Parliament final debate on Gender Recognition Reform today

[ArabellaScott]

At some point after 2pm, in the Big Room (the Chamber).

www.parliament.scot/chamber-and-committees/whats-on-and-watch-live/whats-on#wm

Will be interesting to see how the Amendments go down, if they are all struck down as the ScotGov wishes - www.holyrood.com/news/view,gender-recognition-reform-crunch-vote-after-shona-robison-warns-msps-over-amendments

'the Scottish Conservatives have warned that the debate could lead to a "travesty of democracy" because a 15 minute time limit for each proposal will "shut down" discussion.'

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64032916

Thank you Jamie for raising these issues. Thinking of people who are detransitioning.

Are they going until past midnight again tonight?

Just joined late to listen to the debate this evening.

💪Pam Gosal.

What a powerful speech.

Well I’ve just left

Because I couldn’t stomach any more

Pam was fantastic!!! At the rally and in the chamber

Can anyone give a single good reason why the SNP would not want to analyse the data coming out of the GRC process following its implementation.

They are voting down every amendment that would require the analysis of data to understand the impacts on a variety of things. Surely if they believe that this change is the right move they will believe that data will support that and would want the data analysis to be completed, made available and used to back up the decisions they have made?

Because they don’t care.

I'm afraid that those only hearing about this via the media will not be getting any of the detailed analysis here.

Rather they are being told: MSPs will finally vote through historic gender recognition reforms on Thursday– after Conservative politicians were accused of frustrating and delaying the progress of the Scottish Government’s key legislation during a second marathon session of Holyrood. The Conservatives, the only party who oppose the reforms, continued their tactic used during a prolonged session of Holyrood on Tuesday, when they faced accusations of “wasting time” and having “blatantly and shamelessly filibustered all afternoon and evening then complained about the time”. https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/23207172.gender-recognition-reforms-vote-delayed-second-day/

And sadly the C4 news report was totally slanted and set up to make the speaker representing women's rights as being (yes you guessed it) totally unsympathetic to poor trans people being made to jump through unnecessary hoops.

It's baffling. As someone who works with data and in data protection I do understand the argument that small volumes and detailed information could be revealing, but if at the time of writing the report that is the case, then all they would be is add a footnote saying that that element cannot be reported as it identifies the service user and is at risk of breaching GDPR. If however the volumes are higher than they expect then they would benefit from the statistical analysis and having that data available so would be able to report it.

By deciding to not collect the data at this point they are hamstringing their own ability to use the data to confirm or refute the previous decisions made and to drive decisions for improvement in the future.

Ash Regan's amendment in the final group agreed. Got a clap and a lovely smile from Ash

Can you tell me what her amendment was…? seems very few have been approved but not caught up yet.

This one I think:

71 After section 15A, insert—

VAsh Regan
71 After section 15A, insert—
<European Convention on Human Rights
European Convention on Human Rights
(1) For the avoidance of doubt, nothing in this Act altersthe effect of Article 10 of the European
Convention on Human Rights and the rights and protections that it affords.
(2) For the purposes of this Act, “European Convention on Human Rights” means the
Convention for the Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms agreed by the
Council of Europe at Rome on 4 November 1950.>V

Have to say the voting system is a big improvement on Westminster’s. Much quicker and more efficient.

Can anyone give a single good reason why the SNP would not want to analyse the data coming out of the GRC process following its implementation.

Self-id is to be implemented without any and all checks and balances. It therefore follows that measuring outcomes, uptake, or impacts is undesirable. As well as pointless, really, as there is no intention to revert to the previous law regardless of how the new one works.

You just have to look at what they've done:

Legal obligation under international human rights law (CEDAW) which binds the UK Government and as its constituent part the Scottish Government too: carefully and thoroughly analyse potential impact of any new law on the rights and lives of women and girls.

The Scottish Government solemnly declared its intention to uphold CEDAW and enshrine it in Scots Law in 2018.

In 2022, it point blank refuses to meet the impact analysis obligation under CEDAW because that conflicts with its agenda on self-id.

The same goes for the UN Convention on the rights of the Child, which requires state parties to consider the best interests of the child in everything they do everywhere they do it (Article 3). The Scottish Government sought to enshrine this convention in Scots Law already, but the Supreme Court struck it down as overstepping the boundaries of the devolution settlement.

But the Scottish Government remains committed. It stands steadfast. Apart from on this issue where it has refused to take the best interests of the child into account, breaching the Article 3 rights of Scottish children.

Self-id trumps everything.

There's a similar story for disability rights, minority rights, freedoms of belief, conscience, speech, association and assembly and lesbian and gay rights. The Scottish Government is fully committed to upholding all these until and unless there's even a hint of a conflict with its intention to enshrine self-id in law.

Then all of these good intentions take a backseat to gender identity ideology and it's implementation in Scotland.

What time will this go on until tonight?
Can't believe they are being made to work past midnight for a non emergency 2nights in a row on Christmas week.
As tras on twitter keep saying, it's been 6years and 2 consultations that nobody listened to . Why the determination to get this done before Christmas?
What's the rush?
It can't be good for staff welfare especially at such short notice as members with caring responsibility/in need of carers themselves have pointed out, never mind everyone else legally entitled to breaks and a certain number of hours between shifts.
Maybe it's different for parliament but there are employment laws around working hours and breaks.
I'm guessing some of them would stay up for a week to get this through.
The greens. This is all they have, we are in a climate emergency and they are wasting time with this unscientific nonsense.
Nappies sit in landfill for 400 years before being broken down. Just saying.
All those hormones are not good news for the water supply either.

So did they just vote down an amendment that would have clarified whether services could provide single sex facilities? Unbelievable.

On the last page of the amendments now.

I'm so miserable but I can't look away.

That's how I read it

Apparently Xmas will be ruined if they don’t finish quickly. It will certainly be ruined for women and girls in Scotland who are having to hear the lack of respect for their opinions, concerns and lives

So they are still going.
Anyone got a link?
How can they be thinking straight at this time after 12 hours?
I would not want to be making life changing decisions in these circumstances and I'm saying that as someone who used to work lates/nights.
I'm assuming some of these people had meetings or briefings this morning before proceedings started??
What a shit show.
Just why have they chosen to do things like this?

I don't quite understand what's going to happen now although agree with what Burnett (sp?) is saying w.r.t. pushing the bill through

You can watch here @NoFlowersForEmily
www.scottishparliament.tv/meeting/meeting-of-the-parliament-december-21-2022

How can they be thinking straight at this time after 12 hours?
I would not want to be making life changing decisions in these circumstances and I'm saying that as someone who used to work lates/nights.
Seems like many of them haven't been thinking at all (certainly not about women) and they've already made their decision to just toe the part line and vote against good amendments which might have somewhat mitigated the harm of this bill.