How many transwomen/trans girls detransition?

[piddocktrumperiness]

Just that really. I can't quite find stats for this. If you've stumbled across something or know of this, do many young teen trans girls de transition? Do many older trans women detransition?

That’s a fraction of the actual conversation, clipped to smear Joyce.

Here’s the whole conversation on Helen Staniland’s YouTube channel:

m.youtube.com/watch?v=8_u1MQFjxvI

Women are being raped by penispeople in Women’s prisons, that is not a ‘sane society’, so clearly other sorts of special accommodations will have to be designed and built.

Deeply ableist language you are choosing to use there, although I realise it's the term Joyce used and this kind of language seems pretty embedded within the gender critical movement.

I'm off but good luck everyone who persists in trying (but failing) to engage with the bot.

I was quoting you, quoting Joyce!

😃

I read her book. It is really reaching to argue that simply naming some of the possible funders of transgender activism is to be regarded as anti-Semitic.

You can tell it was a quote, because it has quotation marks around it!

HTH.

Thank you. I can see how it comes across as hard to hear as a trans person or trans ideology supporter, but I think I understand how she means it after listening to several hours of interviews with her.

Thanks so much, I really appreciate this detailed reply! I understand and agree with her points.

I'm glad you can see the problem with her language then.

How can you tell what I see and what I don’t see?

I’m a big fan of not tone or language policing other women - I consider it an essential part of my feminist praxis.

So you wouldn't have a problem with a woman using overtly racist or homophobic language?

Well, I'll pop back just the once.

Forgive me for being naive, but why is researching this not encouraged?

Look at this thread. It was started to discuss transwomen/trans girls and detransition. Then look at the trans activist who is all over it trying to make it about anything other than a discussion of detransition.

Detransition is to trans activists what garlic is to vampires.

I don’t know any women who would even consider using racist or homophobic language. Who on earth do you hang around with?

if you think using the word ‘sane’ is more problematic than women prisoners being raped, you are not a feminist.

Good prompt to get this back on topic!

5 Years ago (how time flies!)

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41384473

I think equating women not being raped with 'sanity' is actually pretty troubling and ableist.

But happy to drop this now and discuss detransition.

That research was blocked because he couldn't guarantee the confidentiality of participants. It was rejected by two ethics committees and a review board I believe and this decision was endorsed by the courts.

What I took from the study is that the majority of teenagers who started puberty blockers go on to hormones.

It's not really evidence on detransitioning or not. Because the children who started in the study are just adults at the end of the study and just starting physical transition.

If they were interested in detransitioning, presumably the study would need to run another few years.

I would welcome some research into this. I have a ftm dc who is now questioning their current identity . The pressure they have been under from activists has been enormous. I refused mermaids and latterly the Tavistock however absolutely no one ever asked about their history of being bullied, attacked or poor mental health. My young adult no longer wants surgery or hormones. Only now at 19 do they understand these changes would have been permenant. Five years of grooming and secret forums nearly cost them their life. The more we question this the more people will have choices and the right to question these puppet masters.

A study that found people were not going onto hormones or coming off them very quickly would be more troubling and suggest problems with the assessment process - this is reassuring data but I agree longer term follow ups are needed and they are now being implemented. There's a huge amount of research going on currently into all aspects of youth transition.

Very few kids referred to the Tavistock are proscribed puberty blockers, around 5% according to the most recent data we have, so people shouldn't be put off seeking help for gender dysphoric children if they are worried about that.

All of the treatments for children are based on the original Dutch cohort of 70 or so children. One of the lead authors, Annelou de Vries, has admitted she doesn’t know where a significant proportion of those patients are now as adults. We know one died, aged 18 from complications of a vaginoplasty.

No one with any confidence can say what the detransition rate is. This is the problem: patients, particularly children, can’t be consented properly without this to guide their decision making process.

Anyone who is “confident” the rate is anything, particularly as low as 1-2%, is putting the answer before the question which is notoriously bad science.

No, in a sane world no women would be raped. It is not troubling to want to stop women being raped.

What a fucking thing to say.

Are you saying there would be no rape if no-one had a mental health problem? It's the use of the word sane which is the problem.

t87% in this report

link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-020-01660-8

Lets remind ourselves that this treatment is experimental and 'off-label'.

@FirstandLastBorn technically it was an amendment to the gra and some health law (cant remember exactly) that specifically allowed the linking of all the medical records and numbers of individuals who have obtained a grc aswell as patients who were allowed to change name sec marker and NHS number without a GRC and do so without the patients permission (which is the main reason for the amendment).
There was massive negligence by the Tavistock for not keeping records, following up or even attaining permission for such from patients, however a large part of it is down to the NHSs/Stonewalls interpretation of the gra that gives anonymity to people who have a GRC and extending that to those without and the anonymity clause in the GRA