The police

[BlackForestCake]

I was just thinking that the GC analysis is the only one that can explain the behaviour of police forces up and down the country.

The liberal position is “It’s awful that the police are institutionally racist and misogynist, but it’s great that they stand up for LGBTQ+ people!”

No. The promotion of trans ideology is part of the misogyny.

How do we get a situation where a man makes a complaint to the police that a woman has posted memes on the internet, and they take his word for it, arrest her and seize her devices to ascertain whether or not this is the case.

Its staggering that this can happen. That someone can make a malicious accusation based on a feeling in their water and accuse a person of being x poster on the internet (an accusation they know not to be true and have accused a number of other people) and police decide to arrest the suspect in front of their kids and check their socks for drugs before banging them in a cell?

How can this be proportionate or reasonable?

It's almost like there are different sets of rules for different kinds of people.

Thelnebriati
Log it as yet another call from the same individual, and if he has no evidence its low priority. At what point do you investigate him for wasting police time? If you didn't log his calls how do you know he is persistent?

All calls are logged - and it was classed as low priority, that's why it would have dropped onto the non-emergency event queue to be dealt with as and when.

To investigate him for wasting police time, you have to have evidence that his call is malicious. What evidence do we have to say this - baring in mind we don't know what his actual report is?

But can we say that if he regularly reports things that do not end in a prosecution - we can class him as a malicious caller? If he makes regular complaints about his wife that do not end in a prosecution - we can class him as a malicious caller there? And would it change things if its his wife was making regular complaints about him that do not end in a prosecution - would she be a malicious caller?

ScreamingMeMe
And I am questioning why you treat all reports of crimes exactly the same, with the same 'rules' when some are clearly more serious than others.

I have answered this. All crimes that are reported are graded as to threat, harm & risk and prioritised accordingly. So a murder will always out trump a report of common assault for example.

But a victim of a common assault also deserves some kind of service and investigation. This has to be proportionate however, so we wouldn't look at sending items for forensic submissions for a common assault - but we can do things like obtaining statements, CCTV, interviewing the other party.

Ultimately its the court which decides guilt for any crime - so the evidence the police collect will be passed to the court via CPS for a trial, if it passes the threshold. However, the police can discontinue the case at any point if they believe there is insufficient evidence to prove the offence.

Justasmallgless
You need evidence to say he is wasting police time. So in this case what is the specific complaint he is making at KJK. And to show its not true, whats the evidence against it? The fact police were at the event doesn't add anything, as we don't know what the specific complaint is. We also don't know if KJK was under constant observations 100% of the time by a police officer.

Yes we can use ASBO's & CRASBOS - but you need evidence against him to get those.

We also can't just assume he has mental health issues in order to get a mental health assessment. There has to be a specific issue with him - is his current mental capacity making it impossible for him to cope with day to day life?

Brefugee
There not treat as crime of the century - they drop onto an event queue to be dealt with as and when. The cop will probably have about 15-20 of these event queue jobs on their own personal investigation queue which they have to try and deal with in among everything else coming in. These will be things that have no immediate threat, harm, risk - historic burglaries, commercial breaks, shop thefts, frauds, breach of orders etc etc

SnapeAlways
How do we get a situation where a man makes a complaint to the police that a woman has posted memes on the internet, and they take his word for it,

A reporting person can report any offence. if they have supporting evidence (an injury for example or a missing car) then this will support their report.

The problem occurs when its just their word. Most crimes are like this. If its just one persons word however, we can just ignore it - it needs to be investigated.

In this case the meme was swastika wasn't it?

So is this grossly offensive?

Might not be to you or me - but might be to someone else. And who judges whether a swastika is going to be offensive to someone? If it is offensive, then an offence of malicious communications is made out.

The arrest has to have a necessity to it - but I can't judge what that is as I don't have the circumstances that the OIC had. For me, I would look to vol interview which would be a lot quicker.

The merits of vol interviews were discussed at length earlier.

I currently have a woman stalking and harassing me. It's phenomenal, life limiting. Amazingly. AMAZINGLY - the first thing she did when she decided to make my life hell, was report me to the police.

Even more amazingly, it's first come first served. So even though I've never met this woman and have no contact details for her, yet she knows where I live and work and regularly parks outside my parents house, the police aren't interested because according to them, she's a victim.

She's using them like wee little puppets and they are playing right into her trap.

In the meantime, my work have helped me develop an anti-stalking working pattern, I've changed my phone number and deleted all of my social media.

Thanks Felix. You're doing a cracking job.

this is exactly the point I'm making that slides right past Felix' eyes/brain.

Have you reported the stalking, @Bearyhumcrack do it. Keep doing it. At some point something must happen. But. Gather your own evidence that she is outside your home (ring doorbell?) because they as sure as eggs are eggs won't.

So again for Felix: it's not the actual report of hurty feelz that is the problem. Because the police should a) tell them to do one and b) they should be connecting the dots of this one person (or plenty of persons) reporting the same woman/women/people for the same thing over and over and over.

Bearyhumcrack

I don't know if you are aware of the National Stalking Helpline, here's a link.

www.suzylamplugh.org/pages/category/national-stalking-helpline

Stalking is an awful crime and stalkers can be very dangerous indeed, take it seriously. As Brefugee said gather your own evidence by keeping records because the police sure as hell won't.

In this case the meme was swastika wasn't it?

No it wasn’t, though it was Nazi themed. And it was posted on a message board that a high court judge has told the complainant not to look at, if he feels it is harassing him.

Not a scrap of evidence it was me. So the police traumatised my kids by arresting me in front of them to see if they could find any.

They said a voluntary interview wasn’t possible in case I destroyed evidence and threatened DH with criminal charges if they went into the parish office at a later and discovered any IT equipment had been moved or tampered with.

How they would be able to tell if devices had been moved is beyond me.

They asked my DD if Mummy ever used the iPad she was holding and then took it off her, when she replied yes. (I only use it to oversee restrictions).

They also eyed up her Switch and asked her if I used that as well.

Over memes on the internet. And people wonder why the police are so widely despised.

When you’ve got a local church community of law-abiding citizens thinking that the police have totally lost their minds and cannot be trusted or relied upon to do their jobs, then you’ve got a problem.

Bearyhumcrack
Have you reported her then?
What is she actually reporting against you?
What evidence has she presented to police to cover her claim?
What was her actual report given to the call taker or the OIC
have you been interviewed/ arrested etc - is so what was the offence claimed?
What was the evidence offered?
If she is stalking you, then report her for the same offence?
have you reported it and what was said by the police?

Brefugee
So again, if its just 'hurty words' that's being reported here then it would be triaged out through the various process I have mentioned.

But we don't know what is being reported here do we?

Unless you do know - as you seem to have made your conclusion that the reporting person should be told to 'do one' in this case. So what was the specifics of the allegation here then? And what investigation occurred in this case that you are against?

And i have asked before, but you have failed to answer - at what point do we start to ignore a persistent caller. You can join all the dots up you want , but at what point do we ignore them from the outset? 2 calls, 3 calls, 4 calls? Do we do this to all regular callers? cry wolf etc etc

Police gather evidence - that's part of what the OIC does. So if you can say what CCTV is and where it is, the OIC will view it/gather it. Any witnesses? Any phone records? What the other person's side of the story is? Its all part of the investigation.

Which will be done as & when as it will not be a priority job

So again, if its just 'hurty words' that's being reported here then it would be triaged out through the various process I have mentioned.

well there are people here saying other. And again: it is the serial complaining that is the issue that you are completely ignoring.

How come a woman who was being stalked was fined prior her murder but a man who is a serial reporter of memes and women on the internet given free reign? do you even understand the issue?

And i have asked before, but you have failed to answer - at what point do we start to ignore a persistent caller.

FFS. Are you for real? I DON'T WANT YOU TO IGNORE THE PERSISTENT AND SERIAL CALLER I WANT YOU TO TAKE ACTION TO STOP THEM. JFC it isn't rocket science.

Real time demonstration of why the police consistently get it wrong ✅

Of course I've fucking reported her. She's reporting me phoning her up daily and threatening her. Following her into a restaurant, breaking into her house with a knife.

Your English is characteristically poor but I will persevere. Something like harassment with fear of violence. I've been arrested twice.

Don't forget I don't even have her phone number.

The evidence offered so far is a screenshot of my instagram account profile. From which she is blocked. And of course her statement.

I have reported her and am repeatedly told, nothing can be done until the investigation against me is completed.

What really helps is another patronising PC with poor English, taking 3 months to track my phone down after it was seized and then a further month to extract it. He clearly cares deeply about me doesn't he.

The best bit is she knows that every time she gets me arrested, it delays the investigation so she can keep doing this until one of us dies of old age.

You are embarrassing yourself here Felix. Stop doubling down and actually listen. Or just do one because we are bored of your incessant inability to emplathise.

*empathise. Gah.

blimey, @Bearyhumcrack , that sounds appalling. Kafkaesque doesn't even begin to cover it.

Brefugee
So what was the triage process that was considered in the KJK case? Since you are an expert in it, you must know to form your opinion.

FFS. Are you for real? I DON'T WANT YOU TO IGNORE THE PERSISTENT AND SERIAL CALLER I WANT YOU TO TAKE ACTION TO STOP THEM. JFC it isn't rocket science.

FFS back at you - You need evidence if you are going to prosecute someone for wasting police time. What is the evidence here other than just assuming that this must be a false call as his other calls did not end in a prosecution? Bare in mind you don't know what he is reporting against KJK & you can not comment if KJK was under constant observations by police 100% of the time at the event .

The woman who was stalked - what was she fined for, what are the specifics of each report she made to the police?

Was she being classed as a serial complainer?

If so - can you see my argument for not ignoring what she is reporting each time?

SnapeAlways
So a judge has told a reporting person not to look at things in a public forum if he finds them harassing. - So its the reporting person's fault. Is this victim blaming - and this was from a judge?

Great - I will campaign for rainbow cars and rainbow lanyards. If you find them offensive - just don't look

The twitter post that stated 'No TERFS on our turf" - if it offends you - just don't look at it. After all a judge has said.

So what was the actual 'Nazi themed' post then. And can you not see that a Nazi themed post my be grossly offensive to some people?

What was the link to your address - did they have the IP address of where it was sent or reported from? Do they have the netwrok cell site data? Devices can be tracked by their GPS signature - everything you send from a phone, I pad etc has a GPS signature.

If they have this, then as part of the evidence they will need to locate the device it was sent from. we can only seize things under PACE and if the person is arrested - this maybe the reason for the arrest necessity.

Did you have a solicitor - are they making representations on your behalf
Have you complained to IPCC about how the case was dealt with by the OIC and what was their conclusion?

Bearyhumcrack
So what is in this woman's statement then that can be negated at source?

If you have reported her and been told nothing can be done - then this is wrong advice. It can't be dealt with by the same OIC, but a new investigation can be started. Go back and make representations that you want it investigating as a new enquiry.

The phone should be easy to locate as its in the property office - if they can't track it down, complain as it should be easy to find.

Every time you get arrested won't delay the case. What ever the primary case was still runs. If its S2 harassment its time-barred in any case - so further arrests on reported incidents won't delay it.

Were you bailed or RUI'd?

Did you have a solicitor and what are they doing to chase things up for you??

Simples, just complain. That will just sort it all out.

AlisonDonut
OK - don't complain then and just accept things as they are

Just seen this tweet thread on Fair Cop

twitter.com/Tantrumfly/status/1597894577197023234?s=20&t=XDFF6_fW-DMWNKhhRhl6bw

But it was just the old-fashioned 'cunty' type of lesbian. I hope she didn't use any hurty words while being assaulted or the Police'll be back.

Why do cases against women take ages but blokes who assault women get their slap on the wrist in nanoseconds?

Not asking you Felix, I do appreciate your engagement but I seem to have a psychological block and cannot read your posts. Sorry.

IcakethereforeIam
Not a problem - but others may read.

So they are taking it as a formal complaint - that means an investigation will start leading to CPS and a prosecution etc etc. Formal is the key word here.

CCTV will last for 30 days and will be collected by the OIC

Medical reports have to be requested and provided by the consultant/doctor - that's not a police thing to produce, but the hospital - its classed as a medical record

the victim has been to the hospital and is back at home - so this will not be classed as an ongoing emergency and there are no immediate threat, harm or risk issues currently to the victim. So this is a job which will drop onto the event queue. Traiged and disptched.

Has the OIC made contact - are they days off?

if the call was made whilst the incident was ongoing - it would be classed as an emergency. But as the victim is now back at home with no immediate threat, it will drop down the queue to be replaced by other ongoing emergencies, suicidal missing people, safeguarding issues etc etc - this is where you lose your resources.

Oh gosh. Silly me. Never thought of that. @AlisonDonut aren't we glad @Felix125 was here to magic my problems away.

Felix, you are so patronising I can hardly articulate it. I seriously hope you aren't in my local force.

going to do the honourable thing now and ignore you until you go away.

OK - don't peruse it then. Its up to you. Just accept things as they are.

You need evidence if you are going to prosecute someone for wasting police time.

That's your bloody job. Or do we have to cut it up for you into bitesized chunks and do all the investigating ourselves?

*pursue

You need evidence if you are going to prosecute someone for wasting police time.

Perhaps you could invite Bearyhumcrack's stalker in for a voluntary interview to give her side of the story. Beary has made a complaint and now you need evidence for the defence, right? If she refuses to attend and you don't think prompt investigation of the allegation is warranted therefore leaving you without necessity to arrest you can just summons her to court where her refusal to offer a defence in an interview room will end very badly for her.

I think I've got that right from all the absolute bull you've posted.