I'm not a woman - which facilities should I use

[Whatiswrongwithmyknee]

Genuinely interested to hear what supporters of gender ideology would recommend here. I am biologically female but do not identify as a woman. I am officially trans though in reality I don't think I am the sort of person Stonewall meant to refer to in their definition of trans (I am gender critical - which for those who have been misled by some made-up definitions, to me means that sometimes sex, rather than gender, matters. It is not an anti-trans stance).

The question is - which facilities should I use? I should not be in the ladies if that is defined by identity but using the men's does not feel right either. How do gender ideologists suggest I negotiate this?

I know it is so ridiculous. If taken literally any woman who doesn't identify as a woman wouldn't apply! I don't identify as a woman I am a woman. Also female technicians who have taken maternity or career breaks for caring do not have the same privilege as men who now identify as women and have never taken that kind of leave. Woke madness and poor language from Herschel.

while you're here:

what does it mean not to have a gender identity?

you are a female by sex, you have female hormones and a female body. Your experience of the world is channeled through your female biological make up.

What does gender identity mean to you if sex is not sufficent for you to think of yourself as a woman?

when my grandma told me I was more like the boy and my brother more like the girl she was referring to stereotypical gender roles.

I didn't think of myself as less female as a result. Just a female who didn't fit I think gender stereotypes.

Yep. Honestly, I can't wait for this batshit trend to die a death. It's an absolute waste of brain cells at best, and damaging to young people who are all happily jumping on the bandwagon.

It’s damaging to young people who are encouraged to undertake medical procedures which often have irreversible consequences.

it’s damaging to women when images such as these which popped up on Facebook are used to indicate what a trans woman thinks it means to be a woman.

Why in all that is holy is this ad coming up on my screen on this thread?

I need to Brillo pad my eyes now.

In my view people should use the toilet facilities that they were born to use, I do not think we should have gender neutral toilets nor a third option.

I disagree. I know a few trans people and they just get on with their lives living the gender they identify as. It makes me really sad to think that my friend James should use the female toilets. You would never know he was born female, and would raise more eyebrows using the women's loos than the men's.

Well James can use the mens as they pose no threat to men.

but also welcome to use the women’s

its TW in the ladies that’s the issue.

When you use street toilets....I mean the units you put coins in and a door opens... they are for people. No gender specified. Just a toilet. Small offices just have a toilet cubicle for everyone to use. I have no idea why toilets need to be gendered.

Always men who say they are women that are the problem.

I know what my body is. But if a mean can identify as a woman, then it's clearly not just about their body. And I have no relation to my 'woman-ness' other than my body. Hence if we accept that TWAW then I am not a woman. The question was for people who support gender ideology because that is what they believe.

I can't tell you what gender identity means and people who support gender ideology are choosing not to.

Well yes ….

Given that women are very low for harming men!

Men commit the VAST majority of all assaults

This is a disgusting advert. It makes me want to mock up one with me in the same pose - in all my md-50's, overweight, asda plain pants, warm slippers on glory. Objectifying females used to be frowned upon.

I understand what you are saying, however I believe that we should have clear and definite guidelines. I think that females and males have the right to use facilities where the other sex is not present - when you use those facilities that is what you expect. Once we blur these lines then really we have lost this for good. I feel the whole issue has been pushed so much and that it is now difficult to make any comment which is worrying as people do have different views and opinions.

I am put in mind of an expression we used to get at school all the time “well, just so you know, a few have just spoilt it for everyone”.

Contrary to the pp who said I must have awful men in my life, and not know any trans people, I know plenty of decent men, and yes, I know trans people too. The youngest trans woman I know is my son’s closest friend, who only came out last year. The oldest has been living as a trans woman for 40 years. But this isn’t that.

Those who bully and obfuscate, and scream about being allowed in everywhere, are not the ones making life miserable for women.

Men who go about their normal day not assaulting women, are not the ones making life difficult for women (except perhaps in their complicity in not speaking up).

It’s the outraged minority of trans, who say they speak for everyone in their group, who make life dangerous and miserable for women, not to mention trans people who are vilified as a group because of their actions.

It is the violent minority of men who make life dangerous and miserable for women.

It is UNNERVING how often those two distinct groups intersect.

To say that all men are rapists is clearly nonsense. To say that all trans women are intending to assault women, is clearly nonsense. But whilst both clearly happen, there is NO way that women should have to open up their spaces to anyone who wants to claim they “identify” as a woman.

Until there is legislation for a 4th kind of space, there is no reason women should just have to hand over the keys, together with their safety, and privacy.

“Those who bully and obfuscate, and scream about being allowed in everywhere, ARE the ones making life miserable for women.”

I was asking about you

you said you are female but don't identify as a woman

what does that mean?

do you mean you don't agree with the idea of gender, but only in sex (ie you are your sex) so the issue of identify with a gender doesn't arise.

or you dont believe that sex determines gender but you reject the idea of two categories of gender.

please can you explain.

you said you are female but don't identify as a woman

People who believe in gender ideology believe that woman is an identity statement, not a biological one. They talk about themselves being males who identify as women or females who identify as women (they call themselves cis) with a few other variants thrown in. I don't know what 'identify as a woman' feels like. Hence although I have a female body I do not 'identify as a woman' and therefore, according to their ideology, am not one. According to people who believe TWAW, your biological sex is irrelevant to your gender identity so you are only a woman if you 'identify as a woman' and you are only a man if you 'identify as a man'. If you think your body type is a relevant consideration you may be misunderstanding what the current direction of travel is.

It's not that I don't agree with the idea of gender. Gender is the expectations and ideas which a culture has about people based on their sex. It is something you do to others - I don't understand it as an identity which is something you 'do to' yourself in some senses. It's something we project on others, we don't get to pronounce what we are.

Gender used to be a polite way of describing biological sex - to differentiate it from the act of sex. Sex determines gender if that's what gender means. If gender means something else - something about masculine or feminine expression perhaps - then no I don't believe those things are determined by your biological sex. Gender ideologists believe that gender is not determined by sex.

Agree. Good explanation.

i refuse to tick the box that asks if I identify as the same sex that I was born in. My Dec is woman. But I wear trousers, work in a traditionally male environment and don’t paint my nails. So I don’t identify as a woman.

Joking surely? I also wear trousers, work in a traditionally male environment and don't paint my nails, none of which has anything to do with my being a woman (which I am) or otherwise.

Op, still don't get why you have a problem with going into the women's toilets?
Genuinely.

Same here. Work in an area dominated by men, despite best efforts by HR to recruit more females. Don't paint my nails, rarely wear skirts, dresses or heels, minimal make up if required ( think 2/3 times a month).

Take part in an unglamorous sport which is male dominated and also makes you pretty ugly tbh.

But I 100% define myself as a female woman (ffs don't use cis).

According to people who believe in gender ideology - say Emma Watson, for example - I am not a woman. That's why. According to gender ideology there is no more reason for me to go into the women's that there is the men's.

I’d put Emma Watson in the same category (bin) I’d put Emma Thompson in. So out of touch with reality of real peoples lives it’s painful.

And these people are biology/reality denying idiots.

a man can no more become a woman than I can become a cat.

you’re a woman. Go in the ladies. The end