Nicola Sturgeon is on Radio 4 now. She's said that her gender reform won't make any difference

[Clymene]

Transwomen aren't men. Very tiny numbers of people.

She's such a bloody liar.

Some extracts:

The current process is stigmatising and traumatic. If anyone seeks to misuse the process, they'd be committing a criminal offence.

Individual risk assessments.

Abusive men are a risk to women, we shouldn't seek to be further stigmatise and discriminate against a tiny tiny minority.

Many threats to women. Real feminists should be focusing on them.

I really, really dislike her.

@SirSidneyRuffDiamond endure menstrual cramps, possibly endure the pain of childbirth, get paid less, become invisible when they hit middle age, get overlooked for promotion, risk redundancy and other discrimination if they take maternity leave.

Oh dear I seem to have pointed out what it’s actually like but I know you already know this. Great user name btw.

I didn’t know this, the point you make in your second sentence. It’s shocking. I wonder why they suddenly make this decision at that particular moment in their lives 🤷‍♀️?

and now womens hour allowed about a third of their programme in dealing with transphobia

She never gets pushback from anyone in the media it’s outrageous. Just because she trots out the same old ‘bad tories’ schtick she gets away with being in charge of an absolute skip fire of a Scottish governent. Charlatan.

She has total respect for looking through this frenzy at the actual reality and trying to make some people’s lives more equal while protecting women’s rights as well

How can you protect women's rights to single sex spaces, sports, services, prisons etc etc when you cannot define women as a distinct sex class from men?

Pretending some men are magically not men on nothing but their say so and allowing them free access to any female only space does not protect females at all. In fact the opposite is already proven.

All this!

Hearing NS talk about how men are the danger to women and not “transwomen” and just would love to hear her questioned about what exactly is the difference between a man and a man who says he’s a woman. Three months apparently is the answer and she goes on about male violence in a variety of circumstances all over the world. I wonder what she thinks happens in that 3 months in Scotland which magically transforms men from potentially dangerous to absolutely harmless?

This is a bit of an aside, Lucy Mangan reviewing a Netflix show 'A Friend of the Family', based on a truly gobsmacking true story. Anyway, the last paragraph of the review, it could be applicable to many of the threads on FWR:

www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2022/oct/07/a-friend-of-the-family-review-the-most-jawdroppingly-incredible-true-crime-story-there-is

This too.

It will never happen.

How can you ever prove that a man was falsely claiming to be a woman in order to gain access to those he wanted to abuse?

There a currently a great number of male sex offenders claiming to be women, getting more lenient sentences and housed in women’s prisons, even women’s prisons with mother and baby units. A larger proportion of trans prisoners are sex offenders than the general male prison population.

Have any of them been charged with pretending to be a woman to gain access to victims? Are sex offenders barred from acquiring a GRC either under NS proposals in Scotland or anywhere else in the UK?

She's a vile, odious woman.

I think that those in the BBC wanting to challenge this have to do it in baby steps. Mishal Husain's question went as far as it could go and still get an informative response. Anything more direct would have risked triggering reflexive "how very dare you!" outrage from Sturgeon and would have enabled something simply noisy that was even more of a non-answer.

It's shit but I'm more for what is effective in informing the audience than in sticking it to The Man.

Above all, however, it is a testimony to the relentless dedication of predators to achieve their own ends. How hard they work, how far they will go, how unswervingly they will pursue their agenda, smiling all the while. Whichever version of Jan’s story is told, this is the terrifying constant.

Yes. They become priests, doctors, teachers. One predator set up an entire school, focusing on riding to attract young girls. Predatory doctors are always in the news. Wayne Couzens and his revolting peers. One copper admitted that he signed up purely to access vulnerable victims.

Every single time a predator, predates, he's risking arrest, incarceration, violent retribution. Risk doesn't seem to be something they take the slightest bit of notice of.

And patience or disconfirm or effort is all part of it. Look at that predator lying in wait in a septic tank, ffs.

It beggars belief that she actually believes it. I think it's far more likely she's
A. Appeasing the Greens
B. Looking for the youth vote - she knows fine well it'll be younger people with less experience of the real world who will vote for independence so is playing up to them with all this nonsense.

Does anyone remember the excruciating video she put out about transphobia in the SNP?

I do agree with you nauticant, I think Mishal Hussein did an excellent job.

You are right about the sensitivity and skill in finding what questions will get informative answers and continuing engagement.

Hopefully many who heard the interview will be themselves pondering what exactly is going to happen in 3 months, with zero gatekeeping, zero medical involvement that changes a person from a potentially dangerous man into a definitely harmless woman. (To be clear I don’t believe that any amount of time would be sufficient for such a change nor any treatment nor gatekeeping. I am for repealing the legal fiction of the GRA. I don’t think we should be able to alter our birth certificates.)

And I hope that many are also wondering how on Earth any prosecution could ever be brought against someone for falsely claiming a gender identity in order to access victims. Surely we have already seen that to even imply such a thing about violent and predatory criminals is considered transphobic by those who subscribe to gender identity.

Oh she’s awful isn’t she? There’s a thousand reasons to dislike her and her politics but this is top of the list. ‘Real feminists’?? The last politician I recall saying something like that was Maria Miller. Didn’t turn out well for her and the anti-woman piece of legislation she was trying to push through either. I hate that kind of phrase, ‘real woman’ ‘real feminists’ urgh

IF

Women sex rights are fully protected

So no male people in female prisons , sports , toilets and changing rooms , rape crisis single sex options always available , female only events allowed for training and personal development et. etc

Then self ID is no problem.

And if those protections were clearly articulated I think it might also reduce the change of the system being abused

‘Real feminists’?? The last politician I recall saying something like that was Maria Miller.

I think she said that women opposing her plans were "purporting to be feminists"

Looks like her ‘real feminists’ line has been picked up by media

Good

I agree @Hilarymantelspencilsharpener

There really isn’t a widespread understanding of this issue up here - generally, political views tend to be focused on the pros and cons of independence rather than the men posing as women issue, which is still seen in the main to be somewhere out on the fringes and not really something to be hugely concerned about. It’s one of those areas she can make a lot of noise about in order to keep the Greens on side (they are absolutely necessary in order to get any legislation through) and be seen to be ‘inclusive’ in order to appeal to young people - but

She's giving off strong Aunt Lydia vibes.

@Datun One predator set up an entire school, focusing on riding to attract young girls.

In the UK? In the north?

h Scottish people are so much better than any other nation ?

It’s a myth that nationalists try to spin. Scotland, like the rest of the UK has its fair share of arseholes.

Sturgeon is utterly vile. She needs to keep the loony Greens on side to pass any legislation, and as others have said she wants to appeal to young people who don’t have a clue about life to push independence.

Scotland doesn’t deserve independence if it’s government, under any political party, cannot & will not defend & preserve the rights of women and children.

She's giving off strong Aunt Lydia vibes.

oh my god she so is!!

However, it seems to me that Sturgeon is a person who adheres fast to an ideology and will not allow reason to penetrate her beliefs. For instance, she is absolutely wedded to the idea that independence from the UK will solve all of Scotland's woes, and every problem faced by Scotland is the fault of Westminster. During the independence campaign in 2014, she wasn't able to answer some of the basic questions put to her and it's clear that she hadn't fully considered some of the issues. I think the SNP's inability to answer certain questions was the reason for Scotland staying in the UK.

I don’t think you’re quite accurate with the above. Nicola Sturgeon has never said that independence would solve all Scotland’s problems or that every problem faced by Scotland is the fault of Westminster. I’d be happy to stand corrected on this if you can find a direct quote.

During the 2014 independence campaign, a lengthy book, Scotland’s Future, was published which laid down how independence would happen.

Support for independence hasn’t gone away and it remains a key issue.