Page 27 | Ben Cooper QC - Lawyer of the Week (in the Times)

Justme56 · 2022-08-04T07:13:39+00:00

Sorry I can't share the article, but liked this: *What is the funniest thing that has happened in your job?* As a result of my work in this area, apparently becoming an object of admiration on Mumsnet [the Internet parents' forum] - improbable in many ways. 😁

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 19:25

Helleofabore · 21/08/2022 17:17

Are you telling me these lesbians you apparently know agree with LGB Alliance supporter Baroness Nicholson that two women marrying is "degrading" and that lesbians families are neither "natural nor normal" and that there should be a different gay of consent for gay and straight couples? I very much doubt that

I am saying that you don't hold the universal beliefs of LGB people. That many people, most of the population I would expect, are able to agree on some issues and not others and still appreciate the efforts of those who are contributing to progressing the movement.

I am saying that if you only view historic attitudes of people who have made decisions based on the knowledge and the opinions of even LGB people at the time, and without also being able to respect that some people sought to actively find solutions that worked until they were confidence that no harm was done to another group with the law changes, is an extreme view.

I am also saying that cherry picking words and phrases and detaching them from context and simply constantly repeating them is a very poor approach to engagement. And is an indication that you cannot actually process and analyse information with any coherency, or you are simply acting like a zealot for your own reasons.

But mostly, I am saying, that it is up to those lesbians to make up their own minds as to how comfortable they are about the past attitudes of people they have active dialogue with. And that it is up to those lesbians to either include them or not based on in-depth conversations to establish if that person still retains the opinions being ascribed to them, or in fact, ever did.

And maybe hearache you can again tell us how come you have seemingly posited yourself as an expert on what lesbians think and what feminist analysis of issues impacting their sex as a class based analysis is?

Care to tell us?

"I am saying that if you only view historic attitudes of people who have made decisions based on the knowledge and the opinions of even LGB people at the time"

I would add, she was a homophobe in the 90s and she still one now!

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 19:39

@Hearach15 ' I can assure you I'm not straight. I cannot think of anything worse.'

You do realise that's bigoted and against the law to be derogatory about straight people, don't you?

You see, that's how the Equality Act works - if you can't replace 'straight' with 'gay' without it being prejudiced statement, then it is a prejudiced statement, and you're a bigot. How does it feel?

Apollo442 · 21/08/2022 19:40

Hearach, you really are a nasty small minded bigot, who wrongly believes themselves to be a progressive.

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 19:42

@Hearach15 'Should add also most LGBT people are pro-trans rights and that includes their right to bodily autonomy' - any decent sources for this, or are you just shooting your mouth off?

(We all know you are, but you seem to position yourself as some sort of expert, so surely have all the data at your fingertips?)

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 19:46

@Hearach15 Both Juno Dawson and Monroe Bergdoff are on record stating horribly homophobic things, a lot more recently than the 90s - will you condemn them and ensure they're excluded from your movement?

Will you fuck - hypocrite as well as bigot, how does it feel?

VestofAbsurdity · 21/08/2022 19:48

You are the patriarchy.

Fuck me, that would be funny if it wasn't so stupid.

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 19:53

In fact, the more I think about it, the more appalling your statement about 'nothing worse than being straight' seems @Hearach15 .

Your sexual orientation is not a choice FFS, you don't choose to be straight, gay or bisexual. How can you judge people 'worse' for their sexual orientation they have no choice about, what's wrong with you?

Do you also think there are 'better' and 'worse' skin colours?

Cowgrrrl · 21/08/2022 19:56

In fact, the more I think about it, the more appalling your statement about 'nothing worse than being straight' seems @Hearach15 .

You do realise @Hearach15 was taking about themselves.

Do you understand how words work?

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 20:04

Cowgrrrl · 21/08/2022 19:56

In fact, the more I think about it, the more appalling your statement about 'nothing worse than being straight' seems @Hearach15 .

You do realise @Hearach15 was taking about themselves.

Do you understand how words work?

So it would be ok for someone to say 'I'm not lesbian. I can think of nothing worse'?

Do you understand how logic works?

Stealhsquirrelnutkin · 21/08/2022 20:04

the vast majority of people in the community agree with me

No they don't. Your "queer" friends agree with you, because their brains have been rotted by pornography and self hatred.

As a 65yr old lesbian I can tell you that a lot of us didn't want to get "married" because we wanted to retain the freedom of our own lesbian relationships, outside of the confines of patriarchal society. What we wanted was the same legal rights that married people had. The right to visit our partners when they were unconscious in hospital, without their homophobic parents being able to turn up and ban us from seeing them while they were too ill to speak. The right to inherit and to stay in our homes if the worst happened and they didn't recover. We recoiled from the prospect of white dresses and big weddings, we just wanted the same security and rights that heterosexual couples were given when they married.

How old are you hearache? You seem to be completely cut off from history, your brash accusations make you sound very ignorant and your refusal to listen and learn from older, wiser women puts you at a disadvantage. No doubt you are another fool who believes the lies about transpeople bravely lead the fight for gay rights and starting the Stonewall riots.

Grow up, or go and find somewhere else to spout your nonsense.

Datun · 21/08/2022 20:07

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 18:57

"If I remember correctly too, and Hearache can correct me, is not homosexual either. Certainly not a lesbian."

Lol. I can assure you I'm not straight. I cannot think of anything worse.

Show quote history

Strewth, in your self righteous bubble, you just can't help your bigotry.

I realise you probably don't know this, but sexual orientation is a protected characteristic.

I'm sure you 'can't think of anything worse', than a protected characteristic. But guess what? That's why they were made protected in the first place. Because people like you, who enjoy spouting bigoted and prejudiced views, can't get away with it.

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 20:24

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 19:39

@Hearach15 ' I can assure you I'm not straight. I cannot think of anything worse.'

You do realise that's bigoted and against the law to be derogatory about straight people, don't you?

You see, that's how the Equality Act works - if you can't replace 'straight' with 'gay' without it being prejudiced statement, then it is a prejudiced statement, and you're a bigot. How does it feel?

"You do realise that's bigoted and against the law to be derogatory about straight people, don't you?"

It's not against the law. It's free speech.

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 20:27

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 19:46

@Hearach15 Both Juno Dawson and Monroe Bergdoff are on record stating horribly homophobic things, a lot more recently than the 90s - will you condemn them and ensure they're excluded from your movement?

Will you fuck - hypocrite as well as bigot, how does it feel?

I've no idea who Juno Dawson is and have no interest in finding out. What I will say is trans people saying homophobic things is just as bad as the gays and lesbians in the LGB Alliance saying transphobic things.

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 20:28

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 19:53

In fact, the more I think about it, the more appalling your statement about 'nothing worse than being straight' seems @Hearach15 .

Your sexual orientation is not a choice FFS, you don't choose to be straight, gay or bisexual. How can you judge people 'worse' for their sexual orientation they have no choice about, what's wrong with you?

Do you also think there are 'better' and 'worse' skin colours?

It's not a choice and I do feel sorry for straight people. It must be awful.

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 20:30

Stealhsquirrelnutkin · 21/08/2022 20:04

the vast majority of people in the community agree with me

No they don't. Your "queer" friends agree with you, because their brains have been rotted by pornography and self hatred.

As a 65yr old lesbian I can tell you that a lot of us didn't want to get "married" because we wanted to retain the freedom of our own lesbian relationships, outside of the confines of patriarchal society. What we wanted was the same legal rights that married people had. The right to visit our partners when they were unconscious in hospital, without their homophobic parents being able to turn up and ban us from seeing them while they were too ill to speak. The right to inherit and to stay in our homes if the worst happened and they didn't recover. We recoiled from the prospect of white dresses and big weddings, we just wanted the same security and rights that heterosexual couples were given when they married.

How old are you hearache? You seem to be completely cut off from history, your brash accusations make you sound very ignorant and your refusal to listen and learn from older, wiser women puts you at a disadvantage. No doubt you are another fool who believes the lies about transpeople bravely lead the fight for gay rights and starting the Stonewall riots.

Grow up, or go and find somewhere else to spout your nonsense.

"What we wanted was the same legal rights that married people had."

So, marriage?

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 20:33

Stealhsquirrelnutkin · 21/08/2022 20:04

the vast majority of people in the community agree with me

No they don't. Your "queer" friends agree with you, because their brains have been rotted by pornography and self hatred.

As a 65yr old lesbian I can tell you that a lot of us didn't want to get "married" because we wanted to retain the freedom of our own lesbian relationships, outside of the confines of patriarchal society. What we wanted was the same legal rights that married people had. The right to visit our partners when they were unconscious in hospital, without their homophobic parents being able to turn up and ban us from seeing them while they were too ill to speak. The right to inherit and to stay in our homes if the worst happened and they didn't recover. We recoiled from the prospect of white dresses and big weddings, we just wanted the same security and rights that heterosexual couples were given when they married.

How old are you hearache? You seem to be completely cut off from history, your brash accusations make you sound very ignorant and your refusal to listen and learn from older, wiser women puts you at a disadvantage. No doubt you are another fool who believes the lies about transpeople bravely lead the fight for gay rights and starting the Stonewall riots.

Grow up, or go and find somewhere else to spout your nonsense.

"your refusal to listen and learn from older, wiser women puts you at a disadvantage."

People who defend Baroness Nicholson and her views may be older, but they are certainly not wiser. They are bigots x

ErrolTheDragon · 21/08/2022 20:41

"What we wanted was the same legal rights that married people had."

So, marriage?

If you'd read that with any comprehension, no - many wanted civil partnerships but not marriage. And do note that there are also heterosexual couples who wanted the same - the legal protections of civil partnerships but not the institution of marriage.

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 20:46

ErrolTheDragon · 21/08/2022 20:41

"What we wanted was the same legal rights that married people had."

So, marriage?

If you'd read that with any comprehension, no - many wanted civil partnerships but not marriage. And do note that there are also heterosexual couples who wanted the same - the legal protections of civil partnerships but not the institution of marriage.

Yes, civil partnerships were brought in in 2005 and LGBT people kept campaigning because it was inherently homophobic to deny gay and lesbians couples the right to marry while our straight peers could continue to do so.

If you want the same rights as "married people", you want to be able to get married.

ErrolTheDragon · 21/08/2022 20:53

Some wanted marriage, some wanted civil partnerships. Imo, ideally both/options should be available to all couples - many (gay or straight) have very serious philosophical objections to marriage. It's not that hard to understand. And it's surely extremely easy to understand why lesbians in particular might have felt that 'marriage' was not a helpful or progressive concept.

Hearach15 · 21/08/2022 20:56

ErrolTheDragon · 21/08/2022 20:53

Some wanted marriage, some wanted civil partnerships. Imo, ideally both/options should be available to all couples - many (gay or straight) have very serious philosophical objections to marriage. It's not that hard to understand. And it's surely extremely easy to understand why lesbians in particular might have felt that 'marriage' was not a helpful or progressive concept.

Yes, well done. That's it, we wanted the choice.

TheBiologyStupid · 21/08/2022 21:15

Here's Simon Edge's tweet about the "open homage to the Westboro Baptist Church. Same layout, font, very similar colour palette (and an identical palette in the adjacent Britney banner)":
mobile.twitter.com/simonjedge/status/1560986745478455297

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 21/08/2022 21:41

Damien Barr said some horrifically transphobic things this century. He tweeted mocking comments about a transwoman's uncompleted suicide.

But he's a TRA media darling. Why?

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 21:49

@Hearach15 'It's not a choice and I do feel sorry for straight people. It must be awful.'

I have no idea what it's like, but I should not imagine it's any worse than being gay or bisexual, as in my mind it's not not a judgment on that person.

Why would you judge someone by their sexual orientation?

Helleofabore · 21/08/2022 21:52

Just coming back to this, let’s get back on track? You know, considering I am now the patriarchy…

I mean, fuck that is just the most astonishing accusation I have come across and shows the absurd lengths some posters go to.

so, getting back to this much avoided question.

Is that a yes or a no, Hearache

Do you support the statements about ‘intergenerational’ sex (and more recently underage marriage!) that Peter Tatchell has made?

Yes or no?

Do you hold Peter Tatchell, Jane Fae and Nancy Kelley to the same standard as you are holding Baroness Nicholson?

Continued avoidance indicates that you are indeed a very hypocritical person. And really says all that needs to be said about you and your opinions.

LK1972 · 21/08/2022 21:52

@Hearach15 Are you actually an LGBT expert, or do you just identify as one? You've never heard of Juno Dawson, really? Wow, as they say, please go educate yourself.

Glad you seem to know who Monroe Bergdoff is - so is Ms Bergdoff a homophobic bigot forever, in spite of all the apologies?