Forstater judgment tomorrow

[achillestoes]

In case we hadn’t had enough drama.

Good luck, Maya.

So happy to read this, huge thanks to Maya and all who have worked with her and supported her 🎉

Thank god. I can’t even express my relief - all the last month I’ve been telling myself that even if she didn’t win, she’s still ‘won’ by bring in so much sunlight - and of course that’s still true... - but still. This is good.

How long til we get the 'considered opinion' of a regular MNetter barrister, telling us all how wrong this judgement is & it doesn't say what everyone thinks it says? Before disappearing without explanation of their 'hot take'?

Incoming in 3, 2, 1...

Well done Maya! Thank you.

If they do, I'll be digging a trench for Maya the likes I've never dug before.

Does this mean that some cases against employers will now be settled out of court?

I'm thinking of the Jo Phoenix case against the Open University.

"And, the stickers she was handing out and which I had stuck on the back of my phone until they eventually disintegrated, said

Radicalised by Mumsnet."

I've always wanted a tee shirt that said this

Women fucking matter, our realities matter, our bodies matter, they are real and immutable and not a feeling in a man's head, and thanks to Maya we can fucking well say that out loud.

THIS! ^^^

As Datun says: the doors have just been thrown open and here come the discrimination cases and pay outs.

And this is where insurers will start saying to organisations, "you know the loos/policy/HR issues/biased reporting/excluding groups and voices that Stonewall said were all fine and absolutely the law? They're not fine. We won't be making the payouts that will follow, so start thinking again."

I think that will be fine though.

Since this judgement states that you can hold any belief you like, but cannot require others to share it, or discriminate against them on the grounds of it.

Excellent news for Maya and for any woman who is employed whilst in possession of gender critical beliefs.

Thank you Maya, for all you have done for women.

If they do, @GrumpyMenopausalWombWielder I shall laugh and laugh.

If they have a shred of introspection, they'll give us a wide berth.

I see Monty was criticising the decision on Twitter, stating with real confidence that Maya had lost, but Monty's-self didn't understand 'legal writing', so needs someone (who cared)to translate.
Jesus wept. Maybe all the guitar cleaning solvents are addling their brain. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Is Birdy Rose on Mumsnet? That t-shirt is crying out to be made.

See also: a celebratory Maya t-shirt. I have the one that says "Worthy of respect in a democratic society". I hope she does one for the outcome of the case.

So, when in a suit, can we call Bunce 'a man not in a dress'?

Thank you , Maya, thank you. You're an absolute star and thank god this is no longer hanging over you.

(And not to derail, or move the focus from Maya's marvellous accomplishment, surely this will have implications for Julie Bindel's case against Nottingham City Council as well? I mean, they never had a leg to stand on anyway, but now GC beliefs being #Woriads is enshrined in law wouldn't their legal department be instructing them to apologise, grovel and settle?)

Can someone more knowledgeable explain how they’ll figure out what she she be awarded?

I’d like to think her costs will be covered, plus whatever the contract she didn’t get was worth, plus an amount in compensation for the shit she’s been through. But I doubt it works like that.

Would it be unkind to send Nottingham CC a link to the judgment?
<sits on hands>

DO IT! It would be kind I think and we are always being told to Be Kind after all.

I don’t think costs are awarded in first tier ETs. Presumably she will be awarded damages though.

Interesting, both #maya and #sexmatters were trending on Twitter, and are inexplicably no longer trending - Twitter strikes again…

The toys are already well and truly out of the pram on Twitter, with claims already so far that:

1. the points 1&2 were “minor issues” and the “really beefy” claims were dismissed [simply not true, massive misunderstanding of the judgment]
2. “60 percent” of the claims were dismissed, so
3. therefore it’s actually a win for the genderists (how d’ye work that one out then, aye?), BUT
4. in any case it’s totally minor and will be overshadowed by Westminster politics and no-one will ever know or care about it; plus it’s terribly out of step with public opinion so who cares anyway, but
5. ALSO it’s simultaneously “a victory for fascism” and “trans folks WILL die” as a result, because it’s an ABOMINATION and legitimises open harassment of trans people and anyway it’s actually a victory for gender ideology anyway so see (1)
6. rinse and repeat….

This is brilliant news. But it must have been such a stressful time for Maya.

Looking forward to seeing if, where and how high up this appears for the BBC (given that a prominent story on the website at the moment is a mea culpa by the creator of Friends about using he/him pronouns to describe a character who was a drag queen)

Shall I take a bottle out to the monitors?

(to be clear, those are all claims I’ve seen so far on Twitter more widely, but not by said barrister in @GrumpyMenopausalWombWielder ’s post)

Fan bloody tastic