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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Emma Watson's dig at JKR

1000 replies

IamSarah · 15/03/2022 07:39

It appears she said at the BAFTAs 'I am here for all of the witches... bar one'

Disappointing but not unexpected.

twitter.com/emwatsonbestof/status/1503505167207084034?s=21

OP posts:
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19
EeeICouldRipATissue · 15/03/2022 15:40

Go to page 2 it’s explained there about mama cash

Yes.
We know.
This is a thread about Emma W though, yours is a whole new discussion that a new thread would get better replies to.

LaTisaniere · 15/03/2022 15:41

@littlbrowndog

Go to page 2 it’s explained there about mama cash
Thank you, but I read that post and whilst I understand what the poster is saying, I don't understand the relevance to this thread, I.e why the poster posted it here. I genuinely think it would make an interesting separate thread, but the reasoning for it being here is lost on me (happy to be told I'm missing a link if I am!)
Clymene · 15/03/2022 15:42

So you missed the screenshot when leading inclusive feminist Watson tweets that she gives mama cash money?

EeeICouldRipATissue · 15/03/2022 15:43

I don't understand the relevance to this thread

It's not.
Anyone else doing it there'd be cries of derail and whataboutery.

LaTisaniere · 15/03/2022 15:44

@Clymene

So you missed the screenshot when leading inclusive feminist Watson tweets that she gives mama cash money?
No, I didnt miss it. I think it would make for a very interesting discussion. My confusion is what the relevance is to Emma Watson at the Baftas - for example, if she mentioned Mama Cash at the Baftas and I missed it.
Clymene · 15/03/2022 15:45

@EeeICouldRipATissue

I don't understand the relevance to this thread

It's not.
Anyone else doing it there'd be cries of derail and whataboutery.

So we're not allowed to criticise Watson for her poor acting, her snide irrelevant and inappropriate asides or her support for trafficking women in developing countries?
EeeICouldRipATissue · 15/03/2022 15:46

My confusion is what the relevance is to Emma Watson at the Baftas - for example, if she mentioned Mama Cash at the Baftas and I missed it

Exactly

DialSquare · 15/03/2022 15:49

@Clymene

So you missed the screenshot when leading inclusive feminist Watson tweets that she gives mama cash money?
In the middle of a dig at JKR.
DrSbaitso · 15/03/2022 15:54

It's really not that confusing.

Toseland · 15/03/2022 15:58

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LaTisaniere · 15/03/2022 15:59

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Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 15/03/2022 15:59

[quote PurgatoryOfPotholes]extract

Whilst in Britain anti-carceral justice is likely to be shrugged off as the studentcause de jour, there is evidence that US-style anti-carceral values are being imposed by woke NGOs in the developing world. The full decriminalisation of prostitution has been enthusiastically taken up by many working in international development; this approach reframes what feminists have traditionally seen as commercial sexual exploitation as instead empowered individuals exercising their agency. The removal of criminal sanctions for pimps, brothel-keepers and punters is central to US-style anti-carceral justice.

In 2018, international and domestic NGOs collaborated to prevent the passing of the Trafficking of Persons Bill in India. This was heralded as a victory by the Netherlands-based Mama Cash [my bold], which claimed the bill, “conflated trafficking with sex work, which would have increased stigma, discrimination and violence against sex workers, reduced their autonomy and agency, and threatened their human rights”.

The campaign, part funded by Mama Cash, [my bold] undermined the work of grassroots feminist activists in India like Vaishnavi Sundar. After years of working to stop the sex trade, Sundar, a documentary film-maker and activist based in Chennai, sees the halting of the anti-trafficking bill as a form of ideological imperialism:

“In a country that is known for its ineffectual jurisprudence where women fight for three or four decades for any legal recourse, it is disquieting to see Western organisations like Mama Cash siding with groups that further amplify women’s sexual exploitation. While ‘sex work’ may benefit a minority group, to halt a bill that could potentially save thousands of children over semantics is cruel and anti-women.”

thecritic.co.uk/issues/june-2021/putting-women-last/[/quote]
I had no trouble working out why @PurgatoryOfPotholes posted that screenshot of Emma Watson supporting trans rights and saying that she donated to Mermaids and Mama Cash, and suggested others should do the same.

Anybody who follows this debate knows that Mermaids is a problematic organisation.

PofP has pointed out that EW is also promoting a European organisation which intervened in an Indian domestic issue, steamrollering over Indian feminists who had been working towards a different outcome.

Choosing these two organisations to promote suggests that EW has not thought very deeply about this fashionable cause she's decided to support.

It's perfectly evident to me that JKR has spent a great deal of time thinking, reading and talking about the current threat to women's rights and safeguarding of vulnerable people. She isn't paying lip service to a fashionable cause. She's donated millions to charities looking after women and children. She is now being vilified and threatened for pointing certain obvious but inconvenient truths.

I don't know what EW actually said at the BAFTAs, but I do know that she is well known for disagreeing with JKR on this issue and if she didn't want this confusion to arise she should have been very careful indeed in what she said and how she said it. I think as others have said she possibly misjudged how it would be received. JKR has been much in the news in the last few days. Possibly the BAFTAs audience wasn't in the mood for a bit of witchhunting.

EeeICouldRipATissue · 15/03/2022 16:04

As has been said, that does actually sound like an interesting discussion.
So why not start a thread about it as you're more likely to get people with more knowledge on that rather than a what was or wasn't said at the Baftas thread?!
It's worthy of its own and more likely to get better responses then

DrSbaitso · 15/03/2022 16:06

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LaTisaniere · 15/03/2022 16:06

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g Thank you, I understand the post itself, but not the reason why it was posted on this particular thread, so I'll just go with my original thought that it's not relevant to this thread and hope a new thread is created about it.

LaTisaniere · 15/03/2022 16:07

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hazandduck · 15/03/2022 16:13

MrsWooster

Janesmom
“Hate to break this one to you but, as an Ivy League alumnus, I’m going to take a punt she’s a damn lot more intelligent than most of the posters here.”
You ain’t frum round here, are ye?

Haven’t got to the end of the thread yet but…This made me actually snort out loud. Just imagining you saying it in a Hagrid voice @MrsWooster!! 🤣

DrSbaitso · 15/03/2022 16:13

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WinterTrees · 15/03/2022 16:18

MN is a great at looking at things in the round. Emma Watson's previous comments, the people she supports, her actions and her 'activism' are all relevant to the decision she chose to make in her very brief BAFTAS speech, especially given its ambiguity.

MN provides a useful archive of material and links which (as stated in pp) help people to join the dots. 14 million users of FWR, and I'm sure not many people have the time to sift through lots of individual threads or search out info for themselves. Anyone reading this who isn't aware of EW's position or who she supports might be interested in the links provided to get a clearer picture.

Honestly, all this objection on the grounds of irrelevance to the thread sounds like something you'd hear from a nervous defence lawyer in court.

SamphiretheStickerist · 15/03/2022 16:27

Or American CEO level witness in an arbitration... I don't really know 🙃

littlbrowndog · 15/03/2022 16:35

@SamphiretheStickerist

Or American CEO level witness in an arbitration... I don't really know 🙃
🤣
Hasselhoffsheadband · 15/03/2022 16:36

Jesus, I had seen her 'witches' comment at the Baftas, but hadn't looked closely enough to see the 'but one' bit. She really did go there didn't she?

What does she think she is going to achieve? It's such a desperate 'pick me' dance: 'Males, look at me, look how much of an ally I am, pick me, pick meeeeeeeeee!'

Emma love, they don't give a shit about you. They would send you death and rape threats if you did anything at all to upset them. And not only has she not called out the abuse that JKR has been subjected to, she is now joining in. Like a kid at school who is so scared of the bullies that they join the bullies just to avoid trouble. And 'but one' from people who shout from the rooftops about how inclusive they are.......

I get that people like Rebel Wilson will make cheap jokes about JKR for attention and click bait (in fact, she already used the 'transformation' joke on Twitter back in January). But Emma is closer than that. I get that she doesn't owe JKR anything and she doesn't have to agree with her. But she must know what she has been subjected to, and the barrage of shit that has been fired at her, and from her joining in like this, the only conclusion that can be made is that she thinks JKR deserves every single bit of that abuse. Either that or she is just desperate to appease the men. Either way it's pretty sad.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 15/03/2022 16:44

[quote LaTisaniere]**@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g* Thank you, I understand the post itself, but not the reason why* it was posted on this particular thread, so I'll just go with my original thought that it's not relevant to this thread and hope a new thread is created about it.[/quote]
Last time someone made a thread about Vaishnavi Sundar and linking to her website on this (it's vaishnavisundar.com/ezine/indian-ezine-gender-ideology/ ) if you're interested, a white bloke from Manchester came along to yell at the OP. An OP who was far more connected to India than he realised, as he has a habit of assuming everyone on here is white.

But he (un)helpfully disrupted discussion anyway.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4447677-gender-ideology-harming-women-and-children-in-india

dinodora · 15/03/2022 16:48

I can take Wilson's joke as just a joke rather than a dig, but the mouthing of "but one" by Watson is a silly naive dig from a young woman who's had nothing but privilege in her life.

JK may be privileged now, but she has experienced things Emma never will.

dinodora · 15/03/2022 16:48

(As a woman.)

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