Where can I buy a bra?

[GoldenGorilla]

Need new bras but would like to be fitted properly. By a woman. In a changing area that only has women in it.

Are there any actual shops I can go to? Or do I need to buy a hundred bras online and probably return 99 of them?

It's interesting how posters twist the words. It's not about "trans" anything. It's about not wanting members of the opposite sex there

Interesting how it takes about 2 mins for the racism to come out to. As if black women somehow confused the definition of women so much the next logical step is to let males have it too.

Black women and Jewish women are women. Female like the rest of us women. What they aren't is a man /male

And how dare anyone compare what black people went through to a man/male being told they can't change next to an 11 yr old having a bra fit.

You know, I find it genuinely fascinating that on a site set up by and for women, in the feminism section, there are posters berating or criticising those of us who want single sex changing rooms.

A lot of women (in fact the vast majority) want single sex changing rooms.

A lot of women (I would suggest the vast majority) experience sexual assault or harassment at some point in our lives, and want to minimise the risk of it happening again.

Why is that a problem for some of you? Why can’t I choose single sec facilities if that’s where I feel safe and comfortable? Why do men’s desires always trump my desires?

And yes I absolutely do think that there are men who want to watch me trying on my beige bras. Because a lot of men get off on illicit spying, rather than on all the boobs they can see online.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Have you never come across the concept that many women want single sex changing rooms, Beth?

I don't see the issue with who else is in the vicinity there once you're in your own locked compartment. I'm 47 years old, have tried on hundreds (if not thousands) of different items of clothing in changing rooms over the last 35 years and can never once remember being awkward or threatened by others in there (apart from in those awful open plan, communal changing spaces in 1990s Top Shop - yes, I admit they were a bit awkward).

@Beth13579

I am not bothered about men being in there, I am bothered about men going in there to put hidden cameras in the changing rooms

But it's ok if a woman puts a hidden camera in the changing rooms?

This thread is bonkers.

Its only bonkers to you because you choose to have your head in the sand about the proliferation of male sexual criminality (they account for 99% of all sexual predators). you also choose to ignore the fact that 63% of sexual allegations and rapes are never investigated/charged so the figures we do have are a drop in the ocean.

you are ignoring the fact the prison population is 77k males and 3k females in this country so criminality is by far and large a male pursuit.

and your faking ignorance of the many many online communities that post images of women about and videos of them without their permission for the titillation of other males.

you are welcome to bury your head in the sand, you have no right to tell other women what their boundaries should be.

@WorkEvent

Oh bloody hell. I’m broadly speaking gender critical but posts like this really do take the biscuit. Do you get this paranoid about everything? There are plenty of tits on the internet for free, no one is bothered about middle aged women trying on beige bras ffs.

Right. And this is why paraphilias like voyeurism just don't exist.

Anyway. Tbh im not sure I can be bothered to debate this one with the handmaidens.

If anybody wants to suggest more shops that meet my criteria, that would be great :)

I'm 47 years old, have tried on hundreds (if not thousands) of different items of clothing in changing rooms over the last 35 years and can never once remember being awkward or threatened by others in there (apart from in those awful open plan, communal changing spaces in 1990s Top Shop - yes, I admit they were a bit awkward).

I guess you can see that's a sample size of one though?

There are plenty of tits on the internet for free, no one is bothered about middle aged women trying on beige bras ffs

You sound quite naive. Why do you think non consensual sexual behaviour exists when men can easily satisfy their urges on the internet?

@Beth13579 I have already stated that I wouldn’t have a problem with a transwoman in another cubicle but that I cannot consent on behalf of other women.

I have also stated that I will do my daughter’s fitting myself, at no point have I said anything about complaining about trans fitters. I have only pointed out that I want the fitting to be done by a biological female should I want a fitting.

The main problem here are males, especially males who are trying to get access to female spaces. There are male perverts out there, some may claim to be trans in order to get access.

I don’t think anyone wants to see my tits. I do worry about my 12 year old daughter, again there are perverts out there.

You seem to be very supportive of transwomen and I think that is great. If we come across a transwoman fitter, I will let you know. You can then go there, bring your daughter, your sister, your mum and your niece and you could all validate that particular transwoman’s identity. That would be a bigger acts of support than to criticise my personal feelings about biological males or my fears for my own daughter.

Just an idle google: Bedfordshire. One county. Over 100 reports of voyeurism and flashing in a year. And of course this is just from police reports.

How much goes unreported? How many times have you been flashed - have you reported it? How many times have people spied on you and you weren't aware?

www.biggleswadetoday.co.uk/news/crime/more-than-100-voyeurism-and-flashing-reports-in-bedfordshire-3521546

I'm not trying to scare people, just noting that this is still a thing. No matter how much porn is on the internet. I mean, some of the voyeurism is going to be creating porn for the internet. I daresay porn is more likely to increase this type of crime than decrease it.

@WorkEvent

Oh bloody hell. I’m broadly speaking gender critical but posts like this really do take the biscuit. Do you get this paranoid about everything? There are plenty of tits on the internet for free, no one is bothered about middle aged women trying on beige bras ffs.

Thats very misogynistic of you, what kind of women do you think men want to look at?

is there a particular type you think should be worried and everyone else talking about it are just looking for attention and hoping to get it from males when they are old and unattractive?

what about fat women or brown ones etc should they not bother about their privacy because in your opinion no man would find them attractive? how does your attitude square up when we are talking about children surely no adult man would find a under age child attractive?

do you see how stupid your comment is yet?

OP, have you tried the facebook group 'Boob or Bust'? Good measuring advice on there.

VelvetChairGirl

I am not bothered about men being in there, I am bothered about men going in there to put hidden cameras in the changing rooms

Same I have not set foot in any bravissimo stores since they declared they would welcome men in.

@WorkEvent

Oh bloody hell. I’m broadly speaking gender critical but posts like this really do take the biscuit. Do you get this paranoid about everything? There are plenty of tits on the internet for free, no one is bothered about middle aged women trying on beige bras ffs.

I take it you don’t know any women who know they have been recorded in a state of undress by a hidden camera. Once that happens you don't know where that footage is shared.

There’s plenty of men get off on footage of women being recorded without their knowledge.

@DomesticatedZombie

Just an idle google: Bedfordshire. One county. Over 100 reports of voyeurism and flashing in a year. And of course this is just from police reports.

How much goes unreported? How many times have you been flashed - have you reported it? How many times have people spied on you and you weren't aware?

www.biggleswadetoday.co.uk/news/crime/more-than-100-voyeurism-and-flashing-reports-in-bedfordshire-3521546

I'm not trying to scare people, just noting that this is still a thing. No matter how much porn is on the internet. I mean, some of the voyeurism is going to be creating porn for the internet. I daresay porn is more likely to increase this type of crime than decrease it.

it does increase it, the more men are encouraged to objectify women online the more they will do so in life, theres no divide.

the entitlement grows.

I don't see the issue with who else is in the vicinity there once you're in your own locked compartment
I'm 47 years old, have tried on hundreds (if not thousands) of different items of clothing in changing rooms over the last 35 years and can never once remember being awkward or threatened by others in there (apart from in those awful open plan, communal changing spaces in 1990s Top Shop - yes, I admit they were a bit awkward)

Exactly- although I'm 62. I expect this will be dismissed as a sample of 2.

M&S apparently had one trans woman bra fitter in one London store and that now equates to all bra shops being unsafe for women.

@KimikosNightmare

I don't see the issue with who else is in the vicinity there once you're in your own locked compartment I'm 47 years old, have tried on hundreds (if not thousands) of different items of clothing in changing rooms over the last 35 years and can never once remember being awkward or threatened by others in there (apart from in those awful open plan, communal changing spaces in 1990s Top Shop - yes, I admit they were a bit awkward)

Exactly- although I'm 62. I expect this will be dismissed as a sample of 2.

M&S apparently had one trans woman bra fitter in one London store and that now equates to all bra shops being unsafe for women.

you know it would help to actually read the thread.

Exactly- although I'm 62. I expect this will be dismissed as a sample of 2.

So if three of us post about our unpleasant experiences in changing rooms that will cancel yours out, will it? I'm very happy for you.

Again - the fact that some women are ok with men in their changing rooms does not mean that the rest of us have to be as well.

If you feel comfortable with men in that environment, ok. I’m certainly not telling you that you’re not allowed to feel that way, or that you shouldn’t be allowed to use those changing rooms.

Maybe you could extend me the same courtesy? Accept that some of us do want women-only changing rooms and want to discuss where we can find them?

@Svara

This gives you a clue to the fact that the bra intervention method quoted above just doesn't work, at least for smaller sizes. It does for me, a 30 back isn't too small on me at all, I start at the middle hooks with a new bra. I last measured at 29.5 underbust. A 32B doesn't fit nearly as well.

Same. I'm a 34B in 'old sizing' but a 30F fits so much better.

@GoldenGorilla

Again - the fact that some women are ok with men in their changing rooms does not mean that the rest of us have to be as well.

If you feel comfortable with men in that environment, ok. I’m certainly not telling you that you’re not allowed to feel that way, or that you shouldn’t be allowed to use those changing rooms.

Maybe you could extend me the same courtesy? Accept that some of us do want women-only changing rooms and want to discuss where we can find them?

I don't think you can though. I don't know of a single shop that will actively refuse or remove a transwomen from a changing room, even if they don't have a policy actively advising they allow it.

I don't think you can though. I don't know of a single shop that will actively refuse or remove a transwomen from a changing room, even if they don't have a policy actively advising they allow it

I should hope they can or its forced sexual harassment of the staff who should be able to refuse to intimately touch or be in a closed space with a half dressed male.

I agree with the poster who said the best fitters can judge by eye as well as their measuring tape. I bought a batch of Rigby & Peller bras in a closing down sale which were perfect and are still going strong after 15 years so you do get your money's worth. I'd even buy them (slightly) second hand because the quality is so good.

Bearing in mind that shops can decide who to serve, they can absolutely tell a man that he is not allowed in and needs to leave. It used to be that of course they would do so.

Now, a lot of them won’t say that because they have been captured by the twaw crowd. That’s why I’m looking for recommendations on places that are more likely to provide single sex spaces.

@GoldenGorilla

Again - the fact that some women are ok with men in their changing rooms does not mean that the rest of us have to be as well.

If you feel comfortable with men in that environment, ok. I’m certainly not telling you that you’re not allowed to feel that way, or that you shouldn’t be allowed to use those changing rooms.

Maybe you could extend me the same courtesy? Accept that some of us do want women-only changing rooms and want to discuss where we can find them?

No one is denying you that. I'm sure the vast majority of bra fitting and changing rooms are exactly that.