Transwomen in womens sport: advice sought..

[TraumatisedinTwickenham]

I’ve name changed as this may be outing.

As a hobby I play a team sport. I play for a womens team in a womens league.
We played against a team recently which had two trans women in the tram. Both well over 6 ft and faster, stronger than the women on my team.

They were both in the ladies changing room before the game. I wasn’t changing as I had arrived already in my sports gear but there are open showers in there and I certainty wouldn’t have felt comfortable showering in knowing that there was a trans woman in the space.

I’m really quite traumatised about it. I thought a womens league was inherently a single sex league but this doesn’t seem to be the case here. I have thought about going to the governing body of the sport but noticed that their website has an interview with the club for which the team we played represents as part of LGBTQ+ history month.

Incidentally, both of the trans people were very pleasant friendly people, not that this is really relevant, why wouldn’t they be. But it doesn’t change the fact that anyone who has been through male puberty has an undeniable advantage over women. I just don’t think that they should be participating in a womens team in a womens league but don’t know what the actual legal position is.

I was really upset (unexpectedly so) during the game and now half my own team thinks I’m a bigot..

I just don’t know what to do.

When I spoke to FairPlay about this - her advice was to get someone on the committee onside. Don’t approach the young hip ones.

You do not sounds ridiculous OP. You sounds rational and sensible.
When we enter womens sport, we consent to playing with and against women. We do not consent to playing mixed sex sport.
You have a right to be upset about this.

Ultimately it’s an insurance issue too. Are the club insured for this? Also there is mixed sec hockey so inclusion and opportunities for all.

This is so hard as its all very well defending your right to play safe hockey but it sounds like there is a risk you could lose your much loved hobby.

I personally feel safety aspects whilst playing a match are easier to flag up than dignity or safety in the changing room aspects because people seem to misunderstand safeguarding isnt personal.

Are there any differences in a mixed match compared to a single sex match, in terms of rules or equipment or is it literally a consent thing that people just opt out of if tgey dont enjoy it so its assumed you consent to higher risks in a mixed match?

No, this is an adult team, no children. Although actually as I think of it, the goalie was a child (16) this week. Her father was one of the umpires.
No Muslims either or observant Jews on the team. It’s not the point but I can’t use it as an argument really.

There is a large junior section of which my child is a member and I raised it with the manager of my child’s team who said that the club has had no guidance from England Hockey. She definitely agreed with my POV. I haven’t yet contacted the head of the adult section, but I will. This only happened yesterday.

To the person who said about speaking to the umpire, maybe I should have. However the main umpire is a good friend of a friend of mine and I like and respect her a lot. But I don’t know her stance on trans women, I know some lesbians are very sympathetic to the plight of trans woman and suddenly she and our mutual friend might see me as some hateful person, which I’m really not. I didn’t have any real amount of time to think about any of this as the game was just starting etc.

Also I didn’t actually realise that they were in the changing rooms until afterwards because I didn’t realise until afterwards that there was a trans women (and highly possible that there were two) on the opposite team. But I do know their whole team was in there.

I find it much easier to speak up on behalf of other people. I’d frame it as a ‘do we need to talk about’ conversation and bring up pregnant women or those ttc, religious women, young teens, post menopausal with low bone density, victims of incidents who might find it hard to disclose their issue, women at elite level that will lose out on medals etc. It’s a matter of principle not a personal thing about these two people.

As someone said on the other thread - we’re not short of opportunities for males to play sport.

I’m sorry you’ve been put in this position (and by your own team). It’s hard going against the grain.

DH is a hockey umpire. I will ask him about this from the position of the responsibility of umpires to ensure safety of the players . I have discussed the issue with him in the past & I know he has concerns

Remind your friend that the department of education have recently updated their pshe policy to say that teachers must not teacher children that they can be born in the wrong body (because there’s no evidence base for it).

I would definitely be asking the club what the policy is and I would point out that there was a 16 yr old, in addition to any other adult women with prior trauma, who might have been exposed to male genitalia in what should be a safe female space.

Just the speed and strength differential is dangerous to you as a female too.

The info in this table may prove useful.

I feel really sorry that OP is having to deal with this, but I feel it is going to happen more and more.

The two transwomen chose to use the women's changing rooms. They didn't have to do that. That choice totally disregarded women's boundaries, just because they could. That isn't nice or friendly behaviour. That behaviour is behaviour far more consistent with behaviour exhibited by people of their natal sex. I presume other changing was available? This is not transphobic to know this. I strongly believe many/most transwomen would not have chosen to use the women's changing rooms in this instance.

@PurgatoryOfPotholes

The info in this table may prove useful.

Terrible that was removed for simply stating facts.

OP. I wouldn't be happy either and would pull out tbf. So concerned with keeping trans individuals happy and keeping them comfortable, no matter how many people, especially women, feel about it and that it may make them uncomfortable.

I don't think OP should leave the club. It's a woman's sport; why should she be pushed out by males?
OP you mentioned that there are no Muslim or Jewish players. That might just be down to geographical location, but having male bodies in the female changing rooms is an active barrier to this groups participation (and of course many other women and girls). Inclusion for women and girls is a big issue now. The benefits to health are proven. Males feelings should not trump this. Males can play with other males. Obviously you know all this; it just makes me so furious.

I'm not a lawyer, but this is based on previous discussions I've seen on the subject by those working in the field of equality law.

@TraumatisedinTwickenham you might want to take a look at Section 19 of the Gender Recognition Act. While it only says "may" rather than "must" in terms of restricting participation under their acquired gender, I think the rest of the wording might be of help in terms of enquiring of the governing body why they don't think the conditions to do so are satisfied. The phrase "indirect sex discrimination" springs to mind.

As well as contacting FPFW mentioned by a PP, you might want to get in touch with Sex Matters. Emma Hilton was also involved in the World Rugby consultation on trans inclusion, and has collaborated on a literature review study on the various performance differences between the sexes.

Hugs for you OP. I think the reason you were so upset is that you were being asked to pretend that a man was a woman. And compete against them despite it not being a fair competition. I would call that gaslighting.

Thank you all. I really appreciate the comments, recommendations and support. I felt a bit alone yesterday and today. It has given me even more appreciation for the likes of JKR and Kathleen Stock.
Even my husband is now telling me to “get over it” because I’ve been “down” since yesterday.
He just doesn’t understand.

I follow Emma on Twitter so might reach out to her. I also reached out to Fair Play for Women. But what I’m dreading most is the conversation with my club.
But it needs to be done, and not just for my sake.

Good luck OP.

This is an absolutely disgraceful situation, which will result in fewer women taking up sport. The Sean Ingle article accurately describes the comparisons between transwomen and women. He also shows the differences between top international women's football teams and 14/15 year old boys teams.

“However, an understanding of the gap between the two sexes can be recognised by results of practice matches between national senior women’s football teams against underage boys’ teams in recent years,” it says. “The national teams from Australia, USA and Brazil were beaten comprehensively (7-0, 5-2, 6-0 respectively) by club teams of 14- and 15-year-old boys.”

If you want to meet some like-minded women you could attend Standing for Women's meeting at the reformers tree in Hyde Park next Sunday. People there are very friendly and supportive.

"Incidentally, both of the trans people were very pleasant friendly people, not that this is really relevant, why wouldn’t they be."
I disagree, they impose themselves into spaces where they know they are not welcome and women would not dare say anything. I fail to see that as pleasant.

I’m also happy for you to dm me. I’ve been stamping my feet and pushing and pushing for policy at my hockey club. The key is to have someone with clout backing you up. Good luck. Please fight this, if not for yourself, for the next generation of girls who deserve to have the opportunity of the joy of sport and not be sidelined for these cheats.

Just to say, I love tennis, used to play as a kid till it was getting too expensive to continue.
I watched the Women's US Open this year. Can you imagine someone like Novak playing against Emma Raducanu or Leylah Fernandez? Serena Williams said she wouldn't play against male tennis players, she's aware there would be no women's tennis.
How do we square getting more girls into playing sports with this nonsense? I wonder what Judy Murray has to say about that.

Also, it's not just about testosterone when you play sports. A woman is not a man with low testosterone.

Hey @TraumatisedinTwickenham if you email [email protected] you'll get a fast reply. They're contacting all the NGBs to discuss the new guidance from the Sports Councils, and they're collecting evidence (which can be anonymous) of the effect of the current policies on women in sport.

When you say they were in the changing rooms do you mean they strip down naked?

If so, how do they other women not object to that?

#baffled