DIANE ABBOTT AND SEX WORK ARTICLE IN THE TIMES

[Mollyollydolly]

Diane tweeted about sex work
'Horrific that Durham University is offering training to students who want to be sex workers part-time. Sex work is degrading, dangerous and exploitative. Uni should have nothing to do with it'.
If you really want to depress yourself look at the responses to her tweet. I really don't understand what went wrong on the left, how is prostitution progressive? I just don't get it, some of the replies from the likes of Femi and blue tick Independent journalists make me feel sick. They sound like pimps.

Saddest of all are the young women who have been gaslight into thinking this is a good career choice. So depressing.

@MargaritaPie

*"Around 88 per cent are women

prostitutescollective.net/facts-about-sex-work-sheet"*

Results will vary depending on what criteria you use. I did a test just now on the active (logged in within the past 2 weeks) escorts on adultwork for the UK.

Female: 13,294
Male 3,325

That means as of now just over 25% of active escorts for a sample of 16,619 are male. That's 1 in 4.

A website isn't indicative of the number of sex workers. There are many who would never put their profiles online for lots of reasons- I'd say to assume 1 in 4 sex workers are male is not founded in reality.

Meanwhile the guardian cool girls keep on keeping on!!
twitter.com/zoesqwilliams/status/1459458834284617734?s=21

If sex work is work it must be subject to the same employment laws including health and safety that all other work is

Strangely No one seems keen on that though

'Sex work is work' being repeated by many on that twitter thread sounds like a similar line that is not true not matter how many times they type it. Hmm.

"I'd say to assume 1 in 4 sex workers are male is not founded in reality"

I know sex work is a spectrum, it ranges from the streets to brothels to escorting.

But 16.6k is IMO a decent sample size to get a rough idea for the M/F ratio for escorting at least in the UK.

All I can say is that it is really sad. I imagine a day when one of these girls is sitting in the office whilst her colleague's sit sniggering behind her looking at one of the many photos from her 'only fans' account that are now freely available on the Internet.

If you really want to depress yourself look at the responses to her tweet. I really don't understand what went wrong on the left, how is prostitution progressive?

OP it's like we're seeing a capsule of everything wrong with the left. Faux feminists, mens rights activists, men comparing prostitution to working in a fast food chain, men mocking and worse all to silence women, cancel culture, tone deaf beardy bros. The analysis of Billy Bragg has been really illuminating - they don't research because they don't care.

Female: 13,294
Male 3,325

That means as of now just over 25% of active escorts for a sample of 16,619 are male. That's 1 in 4.

3,325 out of 16,619 is 20%. That's 1 in 5.

@MargaritaPie

"I'd say to assume 1 in 4 sex workers are male is not founded in reality"

I know sex work is a spectrum, it ranges from the streets to brothels to escorting.

But 16.6k is IMO a decent sample size to get a rough idea for the M/F ratio for escorting at least in the UK.

No it isn't, it literally just shows the split of people on that site. I don't want to click the link, but are the men on there looking for business from men or women out of interest?

All the more reason for being open and talking about it, preferably in an appropriate manner without vulgar language.

Do you mean sanitising what 'sex work' involves so that an increasing number of young women are tempted to give it a whirl? Let's face it, a lot of the things that men pay women to do in this industry are pretty vulgar, why sugar coat it? Who benefits from that?

I don't see that giving something a different name i.e. calling it sex work when it's prostitution is making the work any better. It's still someone having some sort of sexual dealings with another in exchange for money. As we are all grown ups we need to acknowledge that, and if the people doing it can't face that fact then they really are too vulnerable to be doing it.

"are the men on there looking for business from men or women out of interest"

Depends on the escort. I clicked on a few random ones and some (of the men escorts) state on their profile they will only provide services to women and some state they will provide services to either women or M+F couples.

“MargaritaPie
Using potentially demeaning terms like "prostitution/prostitute" increase stigma, and stigma tends to increase risk of harm. That is the opposite of what the aims are here.“

Causing shame and stigma to someone involved in this sort of prostitution would only make matters worse I agree.

But doing the opposite, framing prostitution in positive terms as just another job, is heinously misleading and harmful, and will trick people into thinking of it as a normal option when they are vulnerable, and also allow men to feel vindicated in buying girls or their images.

“Sex work is just work” is an ad basically.

There must be a way of offering help and warnings in a neutral way.

“Jezziej
I do see the point that "sex worker" is a bit more humanising.“

While I do understand why you say that “, “sex worker” comes across as anything but humanising imo. It sounds like a term for
a factory worker on a production line.

I will never call it sex work like it's a normal job. It is and always will be prostitution and I would like to see it eradicated off the face of the planet. We should be addressing the causes of vulnerable people ending up in prostitution (poverty, trauma etc) - not normalising an incredibly damaging practice because a few middle age women get off on some relatively harmless only fans rubbish.

I also don't give a shit if its 50/50 young men and young women doing prostitution (it isn't) - as the mother of boys I don't want people buying and abusing their bodies either.

@AdamRyan

I'm totally confused as to what is going on. Durham say they want to support students providing sex services to do it safely. Some (not all) media outlets say they are training students to be sex workers, based on something another MP (Michele Donelan) said. Its all very confusing. I think safety messages are important so I'm not too het up but as usualthe tone directed at Diane Abbott is laced with racism ("aunty") , ageism and misogyny

What's going on is that the media outlets are releasing untrue sensationalised bollocks. And a whole lot of people on Mumsnet are fuming because the outrage is more important than the truth. Well there's a first . . .

www.palatinate.org.uk/we-make-no-apologies-durham-responds-to-sex-worker-training-criticism/

Jonah Graham, the DSU’s Welfare and Liberation Officer, has since commented on this issue. He said that “much of the media response to the University’s training has been misrepresentative of reality.

“The Minister of State for HE and FE’s comments show that she fundamentally misunderstands the training. It is an attempt to support students in a difficulty arising from the reality of their lives outside of their studies. Ultimately, any suggestion that this training aims to facilitate sex work is ludicrous. As I have attended both levels of this training, which is more than any of those writing for the national press, I know these criticisms are made in bad faith and are wildly untrue.

“We agree that ‘it is right that vital support to women is offered’, which is why the training was created. The training’s target audience is those who support students, so they understand the legal, safety, and wellbeing concerns of students and how to respond to disclosures sensitively.

I do think that teaching young people how to do it safely is normalisation of something that they are most likely to regret when older , something that leaves most women traumatised , something inherently dangerous

Far better to teach them other skills that could help with temporary employment

@bordermidgebite

I do think that teaching young people how to do it safely is normalisation of something that they are most likely to regret when older , something that leaves most women traumatised , something inherently dangerous

Far better to teach them other skills that could help with temporary employment

Yes I agree, or addressing the underlying reasons for going into it.

Perhaps the university should give advice on why prostitution is NOT a good idea.

@Theeyeballsinthesky

Meanwhile the guardian cool girls keep on keeping on!! twitter.com/zoesqwilliams/status/1459458834284617734?s=21

If sex work is work it must be subject to the same employment laws including health and safety that all other work is

Strangely No one seems keen on that though

Oh good, the "you're just prudes" attack.

She really is an idiot. The only consolation is there appear to be a fair number of men responding to her idiotic post who get the point.

@Thefartingsofaofdenmarkstreet

Do people honestly think that calling it 'sex work' rather than 'prostitution' is going to make men start seeing the women they have purchased for sex as human beings?

That that is what is going to stop women being harmed?

Please.....

I wish there was a like button- not just your post but everyone else who has responded to MargaritaPie's lobbying for punters.

Calling it anything will not detract from what it fundamentally is - men will not develop a new found respect for women who they are purchasing. However it will go some way into giving those women some form of protection. I'm not too fussed about what it's called - a whore, a prostitute, a call girl, a sex worker, whatever. But I am worried about their wellbeing. For many women sex work is the line between survival or not, whilst I try to do what I can to support better working conditions for the most precariously placed in our society the least I can do is ensure their safety in the mean time; so if that be partnering up with a woman in a buddy system - so she tells me where she's going / will be and what time she expects to be back or a welfare call or whatever then I'm willing to do that. We can't pretend that this isn't reality and wish for a better future without doing what we can now.

@VladmirsPoutine 'Within certain African or Caribbean communities the term 'Auntie' is a term of respect. It is not shorthand for misogyny or racism or ageism. Please be aware of what it is you speak so confidently about without having a clue.'

Auntie, when used out of context, like other terms of endearment, say for instance by a white beardy woke bloke mansplaining feminism to the first black british woman MP, most definatly is racist, misognyist and agest.

Oh god, I was still on page four. And here you are still justifying paid rape.

@dyslek

Oh god, I was still on page four. And here you are still justifying paid rape.

Yes. You call it justifying 'paid rape'. I call it making sure my friend got home safe. Swings/Roundabouts