Need to vent work training- transgender talk

[AlwaysAWoman]

Today we had virtual training through work (Social Worker). We had some amazingly brilliant speakers, including a female doctor who raised very important issues relating to women and victim blame, mental health etc.

Following directly from this was a speaker on transgender issues. The speaker was listed as having female name and I was not surprised upon seeing them that they were, as they defined themselves, a 'transwoman'. (Although they did refer to themselves as woman as well).

This speaker consistently spoke about the rights of trans people, the importantance of being kind but it is protected by law etc. How NO ONE should feel scared to go in the toilet as trans people do.

Well, what the fuck about girls and womens rights to go to a toilet without a man in it? What about the girls and women who are survivors of rape and make violence and need female only spaces? Yet get called transphobic for calling this out?

What about OUR rights?

The speaker then went on to talk about how hormone intervention had been increased to 16 instead of 12 which was 'appalling' but 'luckily' it was back to being 12. Also little subtle sparky hints I imagine aimed at people who dislike the term 'cisgender'- 'it's Latin if you don't know'.

I can't really speak to my colleagues about this as have not yet identifies anyone like minded. I just feel angry.

Sorry please excuse typos- incredibly tired!

Latin is a dead language

I'm sure we wouldn't like to get into a situation where we decide how everyone identifies

Unless you share an office why are toilets relevant 🤔

Which law promotes trans rights above sex based rights?

Listen to all of Stephen Nolan's podcasts on bbc sounds called Stonewall, very cheering.

I have only been on mumsnet about 6 months, but I becoming aware that there seems to be an increasing amount of anti trans posts. This is very sad and I don't understand why?

Sympathies OP. I wonder what their qualifications in social work are? Or safeguarding? Or child development? Or anything apart from themselves?

It's a massive earner for a number of people who go and give talks essentially about themselves, their preferred ideology and how they wish society to involve children in their ideology.

But it's not professional training - in fact it appears to be professionally dangerous. Mr Justice Hayden was not impressed when trans ideology took precedence over social worker's professional knowledge and expertise and a child was emotionally abused as a result. His judgement is well worth reading:

www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Fam/2016/2430.html

@FitAt50

I have only been on mumsnet about 6 months, but I becoming aware that there seems to be an increasing amount of anti trans posts. This is very sad and I don't understand why?

You see defending women's safe spaces as ''anti trans''. It's not.

@FitAt50

I've been on Mumsnet for years and have not, as yet, identified any posts that are anti-trans. I have, however, seen HUNDREDS of posts from women concerned about the erosion of women's sex based rights. IMO they have valid concerns.

@FitAt50

I have only been on mumsnet about 6 months, but I becoming aware that there seems to be an increasing amount of anti trans posts. This is very sad and I don't understand why?

Not anti-trans, pro women.

Women need, want and fucking deserve spaces and services that are free from males and that's all males however they identify, whatever they are wearing and whatever changes they have made to their bodies.

@FitAt50

I have only been on mumsnet about 6 months, but I becoming aware that there seems to be an increasing amount of anti trans posts. This is very sad and I don't understand why?

You don’t understand why women don’t want to use toilets, changing rooms, dormitories and hospital wards that people with penises also use?

Really?

Or are you just here for a bit of name-calling and virtue-signalling?

GCAcademic - FitAt50 clearly just dismissed this bit of the OP's post (as they all do):

Well, what the fuck about girls and women's rights to go to a toilet without a man in it? What about the girls and women who are survivors of rape and male violence and need female only spaces? Yet get called transphobic for calling this out?

Thank you. Will be listening to the podcast and reading that link 👍

I have defined myself as being radfem for a few years now, but I think it was hearing it in a professional setting that shocked me. The whole thing came across as inappropriate but there were people praising them for being informative etc.

People who know me very much understand stance on womens rights and my passion for this, with closer friends also knowing my views towards transgender issues. Yet I have to tread very carefully professionally. This infuriates me as how can being concerned about womens rights and safe spaces make me bigoted?

This infuriates me as how can being concerned about womens rights and safe spaces make me bigoted?

It doesn't but of course that is what will be thrown at you and those doing it can be utterly vicious and unrelenting.

However, gender critical beliefs - thanks to Maya Forstarter - are protected and you cannot be discriminated against in the workplace for holding them. It is tough though.

@FitAt50

I have only been on mumsnet about 6 months, but I becoming aware that there seems to be an increasing amount of anti trans posts. This is very sad and I don't understand why?

This will help.

janeclarejones.com/2018/11/13/the-annals-of-the-terf-wars/

FitAt50 are you really stating that it is anti-trans for a social worker to be concerned about the impact of a male in a designated female-space, on a girl who may have been subjected to perhaps a life-time of rape and sexual abuse. Do you think that a social worker should just ignore the impact on the girl or should she perhaps challenge the girl for her trauma-related responses?

@MamsellMarie

Listen to all of Stephen Nolan's podcasts on bbc sounds called Stonewall, very cheering.

For anyone who doesn't have the time to listen to all of them, FPFW has produced condensed transcripts of all 10 episodes.

fairplayforwomen.com/stonewall-transcripts/

The thing is presumably the only thing the transwoman was qualified to talk about was being a transwoman. Unless I missed something, they are just a trans talking head. And this is fair enough. We almost can't expect them to talk about the rights of women and girls because that is almost offensive. Like getting a white person in to talk about the experience of racism in the POC community.
I think this training is only worthwhile if you then have a woman talking about women and a POC talking about POC.

Posted too soon,
So what else are we expecting them to do? Quite a lot of trans people have made a career out of talking about themselves. They are one trick ponies.
The thing is this light of specialness will dim soon enough (it already is) and then no one will see them anymore. Which is surely what they should be aiming for - full invisibility and integration into society. I can't wait for that day.
When everyone is special, no one is.

Looks like this trans woman referred to the Keira Bell case - interesting to see her take on it. That now 12 year old CAN get hormones....

..... Hmmmm..... I would be very surprised if any GP, endocrinologist, clinician or ANYONE prescribed puberty blockers at the same rate as before now knowing they are taking personal responsibility for obtaining proper consent? Does anyone know if giving out these drugs has gone back to the rate it was previously at?

I read more of these online testimonials, and I myself have seen misinformation given out at school assemblies - although I think we have someone at least tentatively GC on our SLT because I saw one slide say 'gender reassignment' was the protected characteristics, not 'gender identity' and sex was up there too, so they hadn't just googled Stonewall's advice, at least :-)

I feel part of the problem is when this is presented as fact, and as though anyone and everyone would be in agreement, and there is no opportunity to challenge it... Then everyone starts thinking, oh, it must be correct, then.

The speaker does a lot of work in schools and with young people apparently and they have a lead role within an equality group or similar.

The frustrating aspect for me was the assumption around transgender people being the only people afraid to go to the loo in public. Girls and women feel this too in wanting/needing female only spaces. And the eye roll when talking about people intervening in the hormonal age limit.

There was a jolly picture of a gender unicorn though so that was fun.

This speaker has also stated 'feminism should include all women... and I am a woman, just with a different experience' which I refute. You do not have a lived experience as a woman. You have grown up in a society as a boy/man where male privilege is prevalent. Your experience is not the same as mine or any woman's.

@FitAt50 if stay away from the feminism boards sadly. You’ll soon find yourself being convinced that pro women isn’t anti trans and that these views are acceptable rather than clearly being intolerant.

Don’t bother slating this reply, I won’t be reading the thread!

[quote Stellaris22]@FitAt50 if stay away from the feminism boards sadly. You’ll soon find yourself being convinced that pro women isn’t anti trans and that these views are acceptable rather than clearly being intolerant.

Don’t bother slating this reply, I won’t be reading the thread![/quote]
This is hilarious! “Don’t look; they’ll convince you’ as well as the explicit statement that Stella’s only means of being pro-trans is to be anti-woman. Quiet bit out loud again, Stella??

"Don't bother slating this reply. I don't have a coherent argument in response!"

[quote Stellaris22]@FitAt50 if stay away from the feminism boards sadly. You’ll soon find yourself being convinced that pro women isn’t anti trans and that these views are acceptable rather than clearly being intolerant.

Don’t bother slating this reply, I won’t be reading the thread![/quote]
The only reason people plop into a thread, throw out the transphobe accusation, then say not to reply is that they don't have an argument other than insults.

If you were so secure in your position, you'd be able to tell everyone exactly why fully intact males should be allowed in women's spaces, such as prisons, refuges and hospital wards.

Not everything deserves tolerance.