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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Graham Linehan in the Times

179 replies

Igneococcus · 04/09/2021 07:38

I wish they'd put it in the main paper rather than the Scotland section:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/8c85b4ba-0d01-11ec-9503-f24d9e0411ae?shareToken=e1879f56c612595d4281520d6ea0821c

OP posts:
NecessaryScene · 04/09/2021 08:40

it's it worth such personal sacrifice?

I think at some point you have to be able to sleep at night.

Once you've seen this, you can't unsee it.

If you're in a position where you have a voice, and you think you could push the needle, to not do so would trigger guilt.

He's chosen to stand, rather than be silent and complicit. He wouldn't have planned this, but events have led him here.

And it's just the sort of person he is. I was looking for that quote - turns out to be Martin Luther - "Here I stand, I can do no other".

Like Helen Joyce, like JK Rowling. They have to do something, so they can live with themselves.

Helen Joyce said: "Somebody said to me, 'Do you want this to be the issue that defines you?' Like, well, fine, yeah! They're sterilising gay kids. Why would I not?"

rabbitwoman · 04/09/2021 08:49

@NutellaEllaElla

Oh gosh Graham it's cost you your marriage. While it's a noble cause, it's it worth such personal sacrifice?
..... When female athletes train and train for the Olympics they make huge personal sacrifices - relationships, social life, family life, it takes a physical toll. That needs to be protected.

Any woman getting pregnant makes huge personal sacrifices - her body becomes someone else's. Her body may never recover. Her life is dedicated to childcare - still not equally distributed throughout society, no matter what your personal anecdotes might be. That needs to be respected.

Any woman suffering infertility, endemetreosis, female cancers - these take huge toll on them, their bodies and their mental health, they deserve the appropriate space to deal and heal....

Any woman who is abused, raped.... The trauma that causes takes a huge toll. The energy and strength to recover and heal can be exhausting. Women deserve that.

So is it worth it? Well. Yes.

Thank you Graham.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 04/09/2021 08:53

That's a really good article.

Then something took him by surprise. “It was such an odd thing but I was in Dublin at a protest. Someone was going, ‘Women’s right to abortion!’ And we went, ‘Yeah!’ Then they said, ‘And trans people need to have their operations paid for by the state!’ And we went, ‘What?’

MrsOvertonsWindow · 04/09/2021 08:56

Lovely post rabbitwoman

He's a decent honourable man who genuinely cares. I shed a tear at that article - and all the comments underneath.

Cailin66 · 04/09/2021 09:01

Great article. Graham is such a hero. And he’s paid such a high price. All the abuse directed at him must have a toll. Imagine being banned from that cesspit Twitter for saying a biological that ‘trans women are not women.’

YetAnotherSpartacus · 04/09/2021 09:03

I am so sorry Glinner's marriage has ended.

I appreciate all that Glinner does - but I also urge him to practice 'self-care' - and if he wrapped it up tomorrow I would not blame him.

Just in case he is reading.

PatsArrow · 04/09/2021 09:03

The common insult to throw around on Twitter is to say his wife and children left him because he was a hateful bigot. I've also heard the lie that he's abandoned his kids.

For anyone who watches The Mess We're In will know the marriage ended in the main because of TRA harassment and attempts to 'cancel' his wife to get at him. He's also constantly darting off to pick up his kids.

It really upsets me, the sheer lies told about this man. He must feel utterly abandoned by people he has made careers for, old friends etc. He SATS plenty of well known people have contacted him and said they're scared to speak out. Well HE DID. It's heart breaking. But I agree, how can he not fight this?

I really hope there's happier and lighter things on the horizon for Glinner.

PatsArrow · 04/09/2021 09:04

SATS? = says

rabbitwoman · 04/09/2021 09:13

I figure he could have stayed silent, towed the line and kept those friendships, his career and status.

I would hope he takes comfort in a whole array of new friends and admirers. And we aren't famous, we cannot give him work, status; most of us are women. But the affection and admiration we have for him has been won with integrity and so much bravery.

Kind of shows us what a good guy he is when we can see plainly which he values most.

Shimmyshimmycocobop · 04/09/2021 09:21

@rabbitwoman

I figure he could have stayed silent, towed the line and kept those friendships, his career and status.

I would hope he takes comfort in a whole array of new friends and admirers. And we aren't famous, we cannot give him work, status; most of us are women. But the affection and admiration we have for him has been won with integrity and so much bravery.

Kind of shows us what a good guy he is when we can see plainly which he values most.

Well said 👏 wholeheartedly agree with this.
Phobiaphobic · 04/09/2021 09:25

I think that's a fucking horrible, patronising article. Nasty sneering tone. Okay, it airs some of the GC arguments, but the whole thing is pitched for them to be dismissed by 'reasonable' people. I'll bet Glinner is annoyed by it.

guinnessguzzler · 04/09/2021 09:26

Thanks for sharing, that's a great piece; nice and clear. Pique isn't peak, tho. Grin

IvyTwines2 · 04/09/2021 09:27

If you're young, you're a passionate and heroic 'activist', but if you're over 35, you're characterised as an obsessive.

OldTurtleNewShell · 04/09/2021 09:32

I think I want "The house is on fire" on a t shirt.

One of the reasons Linehan is seen as such a threat by trans activists is because he is such a talented writer.
He has an unerring sense of the absurd and puts across the nub of the issue with clarity and humour.
Being called out for their crap and getting people to laugh at it? No wonder TRAs hate him so much.

colouringindoors · 04/09/2021 09:33

I think he's an amazing man.

Eyesofdisarray · 04/09/2021 09:47

An honourable man- absolutely disgusting that his family were harassed.
The comments were great though.
Good posts @rabbitwoman and @NecessaryScene
The house is indeed on fire

Datun · 04/09/2021 09:49

@PatsArrow

The common insult to throw around on Twitter is to say his wife and children left him because he was a hateful bigot. I've also heard the lie that he's abandoned his kids.

For anyone who watches The Mess We're In will know the marriage ended in the main because of TRA harassment and attempts to 'cancel' his wife to get at him. He's also constantly darting off to pick up his kids.

It really upsets me, the sheer lies told about this man. He must feel utterly abandoned by people he has made careers for, old friends etc. He SATS plenty of well known people have contacted him and said they're scared to speak out. Well HE DID. It's heart breaking. But I agree, how can he not fight this?

I really hope there's happier and lighter things on the horizon for Glinner.

This.

To me, what comes across is his incredulity that soo many people aren't outraged. It's got to undermine your entire faith in humanity.

He realises that many people don't even see the terrible significance of what's happening, but that in itself indicates an apathy towards women, their status and their rights.

And many people do see it. You cant hear that violent rapists are in women's prisons without grasping the issue. But seeing the number who simply don't care has to have been a shock.

And I can't imagine the gut wrenching bile that he is sent by those who hate women and hate him for his advocacy.

It would be hard to find the gentleness and humour necessary to ever write something like Father Ted after your psyche has been exposed to such pointless hate.

I really hope there's happier and lighter things on the horizon for Glinner.

Me too.

BernardBlackMissesLangCleg · 04/09/2021 09:52

@ItsAllGoingToBeFine

That's a really good article.

Then something took him by surprise. “It was such an odd thing but I was in Dublin at a protest. Someone was going, ‘Women’s right to abortion!’ And we went, ‘Yeah!’ Then they said, ‘And trans people need to have their operations paid for by the state!’ And we went, ‘What?’

yeah, this really leapt out at me

It's like women can't ever campaign for something that's just for them

Notmydaughteryoubitch · 04/09/2021 09:59

Just wanted to added my voice to those expressing their thanks. Graham we appreciate you and what you do. It is tragic and ridiculous that to take this reasonable position costs you so much.
I am manager in child protection social work, my work is all about safeguarding children and vulnerable women. Yet if I were to publicly take a stand about protecting those very same women and children from this onslaught of women's rights I could be pulled in front of my regulatory body. It's a kafaesque nightmare and I'm not yet brave enough to come out but I am so thankful for your courage and voice.

Notmydaughteryoubitch · 04/09/2021 10:00

*Kafkaesque (!!)

orangejuicer · 04/09/2021 10:00

Would re watching IT crowd and Father Ted help in any way? Ratings etc?

NecessaryScene · 04/09/2021 10:05

Would re watching IT crowd and Father Ted help in any way? Ratings etc?

I think the most direct way to help is to subscribe to his Substack.

RoyalCorgi · 04/09/2021 10:07

@CloseYourEyesAndSee

They misunderstood his use of the word peak and turned it into pique. Peak Times.
Yes, that made me laugh too. You can tell the journalist isn't quite as familiar with this territory as we are.

Otherwise, a good piece. And broadly sympathetic. It is so revealing that other famous people - people you had previously thought were decent - don't seem to care about this issue. Or in many cases, actively support the erosion of women's rights.

orangejuicer · 04/09/2021 10:10

@NecessaryScene

Would re watching IT crowd and Father Ted help in any way? Ratings etc?

I think the most direct way to help is to subscribe to his Substack.

In terms of TV profile I was thinking but I don't know how it works and what he gets after all this time when eps are shown.
CloseYourEyesAndSee · 04/09/2021 10:10

@orangejuicer

Would re watching IT crowd and Father Ted help in any way? Ratings etc?
He has said no - he gets royalties from purchases of physical DVDs but nobody buys them! Patreon if he has one or substack