#AskRapeCrisisScotland

[MaudTheInvincible]

Is trending at number 1 in the UK at present. I haven't been around all day so I'm not sure what this has happened in response to and came here to find out, but there aren't any threads. Heart breaking reading these stories and the effects on rape victims who can't access support services because they've been excluded by male-centring policy.

CatherinaJTV 21:04:46
"In any case - I've gone and donated to Edinburgh Rape Crisis and I see that many others have too, so maybe there's something good yet to come from your preoccupation with a trans woman's GRC."

It is known that Mridhul Wadhwa does not have a GRC. When the lying on the job application was made public, we saw Wadhwa is an Indian citizen and the UK government does not, seemingly, grant GRCs to foreign nationals. I imagine this would cause all sorts of admin mayhem if they did so. Anyway, Wadhwa is legally and physiologically male and should never have been given the jobs in this sector in the first place. What we are seeing now confirms that in spades. Maybe this could be a reason, Catherina, for our 'preoccupation'?

And how many of these traumatised women are going to be in the position, emotionally, financially, to respond as someone badly needs to here, and say 'this service is directly discriminating against me and this is not acceptable behaviour or practice, and take it to court.

This relies on these women being in no position to defend themselves, and to either shut up and put up, or to self exclude. There are no expensive, government funded lobbies for them. There's nothing. As the woman on the radio last week said: two women she is supporting won't access any resources because they cannot come into mixed sex environments. This is going to end inevitably in female people dying in situations they have stayed in, because enforcing political purity mattered more than compassion, inclusion, diversity and female lives.

More sunlight on this appalling situation the better. That person has no right to be in that job, they haven’t the qualifications, skills or mindset which is clear from interviews, and that’s apart from the great big elephant in the room!

How odd, the # is no longer showing up as 'trending', despite having more tweets than several of the other subjects that are still trending.

For Women Scotland have misrepresented what Wadhwa said, when you read what she's actually said there's honestly nothing wrong with it.

FWS quoted MW's own words. No misrepresentation. In a discussion about male transgender people being included in a female-only service, and in response to the female survivors objecting to this inclusion because of their trauma, both presenters and MW agreed that female victims of male violence who objected to the inclusion of male transgender people were bigoted and prejudiced and that their trauma needed to be reframed to remove their objection.

I think it's really important to look at what Mridul Wadhwa actually said, because it's actually very considered and compassionate.

It's offensive, obnoxious, abusive, cold as fuck, selfish, entitled and a prime display of toxic masculinity to frame the involuntary trauma responses of female victims of male violence to the presence of males in a female-only service as bigoted, prejudiced and exclusionary.

MW and the presenters sounded exactly like the men who object to the entire VAWAG sector on principle. Because it uses a structural analysis of male violence and men's rights activists say this gives men a bad name and shouldn't be allowed.

You're not going to be attacked or judged if your trauma response might seem to the uninformed as prejudice, but if you come in and you have prejudice that's not as a result of your trauma and you start to make this a place that isn't safe for other users, that's when you're going to be called out on it.

You're inventing something here that wasn't said about the effect on other service users, but please enlighten me on your other claim: In what way is an involuntary trauma response to all males not a result of trauma when some of those males identify as trans?

I genuinely want to know how you parse that.

Which is fair. Reframing trauma is also an accepted term, we reframe trauma so that we are able to relieve ourselves of feelings of guilt and shame. That's a good and healthy thing to do.

No.

We reframe trauma to allow a victim to forgive herself for what she thinks she did wrong, so that she will eventually come to understand that she did nothing wrong, that she is not to blame, that is wasn't her fault. We reframe trauma to help the woman heal. To help her understand her immediate actions and reactions better, and to teach her not to judge herself for what happened to her.

Not to educate her out of perceived prejudices against others.

I'm astonished you cannot see the difference.

Are there any single sex rape crisis charities in Scotland? I feel like doing some digging for charities that provide single sex support for female rape victims north of the Border. Sounds like they need it :(

Because you know, to me, therapy is political, and it isn't always seen as that.'

Thank you for posting the full remarks. This statement in particular is chilling. Therapy actually was always seen as political - particularly when it came to therapy for women. PND, the refrigerator mother, responses to rape, inability to treat minor sexual assaults as nothing much - all of these have been traditionally politicised by a male-centered society and government to minimise women's actual experience.

It is sad and alarming that the director of a rape crisis centre has explicitly said that therapy is political rather than patient-centered.

And rather begs the question - which politics? Who decides on them?

The resemblance to traditional religion is breath-taking. Missionaries/taking the soup/repentence in exchange for a refuge. There really is nothing new under the sun.

@Pallisers

Because you know, to me, therapy is political, and it isn't always seen as that.'

Thank you for posting the full remarks. This statement in particular is chilling. Therapy actually was always seen as political - particularly when it came to therapy for women. PND, the refrigerator mother, responses to rape, inability to treat minor sexual assaults as nothing much - all of these have been traditionally politicised by a male-centered society and government to minimise women's actual experience.

It is sad and alarming that the director of a rape crisis centre has explicitly said that therapy is political rather than patient-centered.

And rather begs the question - which politics? Who decides on them?

The resemblance to traditional religion is breath-taking. Missionaries/taking the soup/repentence in exchange for a refuge. There really is nothing new under the sun.

Quite.

Those darn hysterical, neurotic women.

@DazzlePaintedBattlePants

Are there any single sex rape crisis charities in Scotland? I feel like doing some digging for charities that provide single sex support for female rape victims north of the Border. Sounds like they need it :(

Very few, see Women & Girls In Scotland's thread here

mobile.twitter.com/WG_Scotland/status/1424334290586849281

Personally my spare pennies are going to For Women Scotland because their fight to stop the bastard Scotgov redefining woman could be pivotal.

[quote Waitwhat23]**@ClaraMumsnet can I ask why your post says 'trans rights moderation policy' when the title of the document you linked to is 'Mumsnet moderation principles for discussions around gender identity and sex'? If there is a 'trans rights' moderation policy, where is the corresponding 'women's rights' policy?

Also, a poster on this thread has used the word 'cultish' to refer to GC beliefs. I have seen many women's posts deleted for using the word cult or cultish in respect to gender ideology. Why has this apparent breach of the rules been allowed to stand?[/quote]
Yes, @ClaraMumsnet , I was also deleted for using the word cult. It was said to be 'unkind' in the answer to my query as to why it had been deleted. As GC 'beliefs' are based on science, calling them 'cultish' is not just the low bar of 'unkind' , but anti science. So, contrary to evidence based reality. That could be construed as misinformation. It would be dreadful to let deliberate misinformation and misrepresentation of scientific, biological reality stand.

Having to interact with a male at such a traumatic time, irrespective of how they personally identify, would be the reason I would avoid that service too. Hoping that there is a service which is female run at such a vulnerable time for any woman who has been sexually assaulted.

How often have you ever seen a TW told that the answer to their trauma and fear of male spaces is to get over their prejudices?

Indeed. Given that statistics show that transwomen are rather less statistically likely (in the UK) to be victims of violence than women are, why aren't transwomen generally being told that their fears are unjustified, they are safer than they think in the mens' loos, and anyway, NAMALT?

Why is the approved narrative "transwomen just want to pee in peace because they are incredibly frightened of male violence and must feel safe"; but somehow also "female rape victims who are in fear of male violence after an actual sexual attack DON'T have the right to feel safe if someone else doesn't approve of that"?

The disparity between transpeople wah wah wahing about 'LITERAL' violence when someone uses a 'wrong' word, yet raped, abused, genuinely traumatised and terrified women need to stfu and 'be educated'...its indefensibly baffling, and sick.

In the words of another poster on here, regarding Nicola Sturgeon -

'Feminist? Are ye, aye?'

@Waitwhat23

In the words of another poster on here, regarding Nicola Sturgeon -

'Feminist? Are ye, aye?'

Wee Jimmy Crankie. Cannae stand the woman. Feminist my fucking arse.

@CatherinaJTV

A trans woman is a woman, a man is a man.

Sorry, I'm an atheist.

Good thread started by Rachel Moran

mobile.twitter.com/RachelRMoran/status/1425170605440126984

’Because you know, to me, therapy is political, and it isn't always seen as that.'

I haven’t seen anyone else comment on this last line in Wadhwa’s speech. There’s a reason why therapy isn’t always seen as political and that’s because therapy should never be political.

Also thank you to CharleyParley for another interesting post:

There remains a question about applying for a job as a legal male that quotes Schedule 9 of the Equality Act which normally limits a job to applicants of one sex, but ultimately it is up to the organisation to decide who they employ.

However, if a man had wanted to apply for the job, but was turned down and referred to the Schedule 9 Genuine Occupational Requirement restriction, such a rejected male candidate could argue that he'd been unlawfully discriminated against by RCS accepting another legal male while rejecting him, but I do not believe any such potential candidates exist.

Here is a clear demonstration of a situation where the framework of the Equality Act lets women down. It ought to be possible to legally challenge the decision taken by RCS. Women who are unable to use this service ought to have some kind of legal redress, but I can’t see any way the law could be applied to protect those women.

And so the only people protected here are men who applied alongside Wadhwa, but were rejected because of their sex. And of course no other man applied because the advert was specific about the requirement to be a woman. The only theoretical challenge I can imagine is a man who was otherwise well qualified for this job, but chose not to apply, because the wording of the advertisement suggested men were excluded, when in fact that proved not to be the case.

Either way, the women who should be protected by the law, the women who need that protection most, appear not to be covered, unless someone who understands the law better than me can clarifiy?

When the legitimate belief (proven in law) that people can't change sex is reframed as bigotry, given the specific circumstances of this situation, it's not just gaslighting, surely it's borderline hate?

I am concerned about what the new CEO is saying.

Therapy should NEVER be political I do not understand that as a statement. Very strange.

Not sure they are the right person for the job at all.

That being said - some of the comments on here citing MAN and ridiculing pictures of this human. Well to be honest . I’m shocked at this. Why ? Doesn’t really make you any better to be so cruel and SO vindictive.

In summary - I don’t agree with lots of things the CEO has said, I’m not really a fan of them being CEO as they do not seem up for the task.

But to to see women be so cruel, such bully’s on here- REALLY quite sad.. no wonder we have such issues we can’t resolve between different communities. Cruelty is never a helpful Way forward . Have we not Learned this?

@lurkermum

I am concerned about what the new CEO is saying.

Therapy should NEVER be political I do not understand that as a statement. Very strange.

Not sure they are the right person for the job at all.

That being said - some of the comments on here citing MAN and ridiculing pictures of this human. Well to be honest . I’m shocked at this. Why ? Doesn’t really make you any better to be so cruel and SO vindictive.

In summary - I don’t agree with lots of things the CEO has said, I’m not really a fan of them being CEO as they do not seem up for the task.

But to to see women be so cruel, such bully’s on here- REALLY quite sad.. no wonder we have such issues we can’t resolve between different communities. Cruelty is never a helpful Way forward . Have we not Learned this?

Are you telling women to be kind?