#AskRapeCrisisScotland

[MaudTheInvincible]

Is trending at number 1 in the UK at present. I haven't been around all day so I'm not sure what this has happened in response to and came here to find out, but there aren't any threads. Heart breaking reading these stories and the effects on rape victims who can't access support services because they've been excluded by male-centring policy.

Four points regarding this that I thought were particularly acute on Twitter today:

• Help with the caveat of moral judgement and correction, is not the type of help that should be left behind in the Victorian era where it belongs. Demanding lip-service to an ideology as a barrier to adequate care is appalling behavior.

• In the past women had to renounce their sins or accept religion to access mother and baby homes or to receive help. That this kind of thinking is making a come back in government funded services for women who are tax payers is appalling.

• Pushing a political view on to a woman at a time of profound trauma and crisis is inappropriate, unethical and unprofessional.

• No matter the views of the therapist, it is completely inappropriate to push religious, political or cultural views on to the client during sessions. Ever. This is basic training. This is a total failure of professional competence.

I think it's really important to look at what Mridul Wadhwa actually said, because it's actually very considered and compassionate. You're not going to be attacked or judged if your trauma response might seem to the uninformed as prejudice, but if you come in and you have prejudice that's not as a result of your trauma and you start to make this a place that isn't safe for other users, that's when you're going to be called out on it. Which is fair. Reframing trauma is also an accepted term, we reframe trauma so that we are able to relieve ourselves of feelings of guilt and shame. That's a good and healthy thing to do.

For Women Scotland have misrepresented what Wadhwa said, when you read what she's actually said there's honestly nothing wrong with it.

'But there are a group of survivors who will be watching and seeing what is being played out about spaces that they're potentially going to use. And be informed or misintormed about what actually happens here and be possibly be fearful. And I think if you're worried about these things, about inclusion and what trans inclusion means within women's organisations, and if your local women's organisation of Rape Crisis Centre or Women's Aid is openly trans inclusive, and you just don't understand, reach out to them and ask those questions. I think its important to know that we see you as an individual. And we come as survivors with experiences that often feel to the outside world as holding prejudice. So we might have foar of man of a certain ethnicity, we might have fear of sans people, and it could be linked to an experience of trauma. I think it is it is okay to hold those things as long as you are willing to acknowledge that, in support, we will accept that

But there is a difference also when, and I am not sure if I said this as clearly and transparently as I want to, but I'm trying. Apologies, it I havest done it wes. But I think the other thing is that sexual violence happens to bigoted people as well. And so you know, it is not discerning crime. But these spaces are also for you. But if you bring unacceptable beliefs that are discriminatory in nature, we will begin to work with you on your journey of recovery from trauma. But please also expect to be challenged on your prejudices, because how can you heal from trauma and build a now relationship with your trauma, because you can't forget, and you can't go back to Ble before traumatic incident or traumatic incidents. And some of us never, ever had a life before traumatic incidents. But if you have to retrame your trauma, I think it is important as part of that reframing, having a more positive relationship with it, where it becomes a story that empowers you and allows you to go and do other more beautiful things with your life you also have to rethink your relationship with prejudice. Otherwise, you can't really, in my view, recover from trauma and I think that's a very important message that I am often discussing with my colleagues that in various places Because you know, to me, therapy is political, and it isn't always seen as that.'

So I was deleted for stating a fact. Jesus Christ. What is wrong with this place?!

I think it's really important to look at what Mridul Wadhwa actually said, because it's actually very considered and compassionate.

No, it wasn't.

The positive thing we are hoping will come from this is that Rape Crisis Scotland will realise that what has been said is outrageous and will keep many, many vulnerable women from accessing their badly needed services and they will sack their CEO who made these indefensible comments and issue a statement to make it clear that they are a safe space for all vulnerable women, no matter what their political beliefs are.

I doubt that’s going to happen but that’s why what is happening now is really important - if we get this enough sunlight maybe it will lead to a rape service accessible by all rather than a rape crisis accessible to those with the correct ideology, from which many other vulnerable women will not only be turned away but will be shamed instead of supported.

Reframing trauma is also an accepted term

Reframing trauma is not about centring the feelings of the counsellor over those of the victim. Wadhwa's use of the term is gaslighting, as has been pointed out on Twitter multiple times.

@Loobylouu why do you think that people posting here haven't read or listened to the actual words said?? I certainly have and I disagree with you on every point.

If this was a female CEO, and it wasn't to do with trans issues, they'd be out the door already.

@ClaraMumsnet thank you for your reply and for flagging some of the issues I raised. I had also asked about the link to the moderation policy being wrongly worded 'trans rights moderation policy' rather than 'sex and gender moderation policy' - could you update me on that also please?

So we might have foar of man of a certain ethnicity, we might have fear of sans people, and it could be linked to an experience of trauma

This is disingenuous and sly phrasing. It's because they're male, not trans people.

Sorry, my above post was a response to CatherinaJTV, not sure why the quote wasn’t there.

@Loobylouu

I think it's really important to look at what Mridul Wadhwa actually said, because it's actually very considered and compassionate. You're not going to be attacked or judged if your trauma response might seem to the uninformed as prejudice, but if you come in and you have prejudice that's not as a result of your trauma and you start to make this a place that isn't safe for other users, that's when you're going to be called out on it. Which is fair. Reframing trauma is also an accepted term, we reframe trauma so that we are able to relieve ourselves of feelings of guilt and shame. That's a good and healthy thing to do.

For Women Scotland have misrepresented what Wadhwa said, when you read what she's actually said there's honestly nothing wrong with it.

'But there are a group of survivors who will be watching and seeing what is being played out about spaces that they're potentially going to use. And be informed or misintormed about what actually happens here and be possibly be fearful. And I think if you're worried about these things, about inclusion and what trans inclusion means within women's organisations, and if your local women's organisation of Rape Crisis Centre or Women's Aid is openly trans inclusive, and you just don't understand, reach out to them and ask those questions. I think its important to know that we see you as an individual. And we come as survivors with experiences that often feel to the outside world as holding prejudice. So we might have foar of man of a certain ethnicity, we might have fear of sans people, and it could be linked to an experience of trauma. I think it is it is okay to hold those things as long as you are willing to acknowledge that, in support, we will accept that

But there is a difference also when, and I am not sure if I said this as clearly and transparently as I want to, but I'm trying. Apologies, it I havest done it wes. But I think the other thing is that sexual violence happens to bigoted people as well. And so you know, it is not discerning crime. But these spaces are also for you. But if you bring unacceptable beliefs that are discriminatory in nature, we will begin to work with you on your journey of recovery from trauma. But please also expect to be challenged on your prejudices, because how can you heal from trauma and build a now relationship with your trauma, because you can't forget, and you can't go back to Ble before traumatic incident or traumatic incidents. And some of us never, ever had a life before traumatic incidents. But if you have to retrame your trauma, I think it is important as part of that reframing, having a more positive relationship with it, where it becomes a story that empowers you and allows you to go and do other more beautiful things with your life you also have to rethink your relationship with prejudice. Otherwise, you can't really, in my view, recover from trauma and I think that's a very important message that I am often discussing with my colleagues that in various places Because you know, to me, therapy is political, and it isn't always seen as that.'

Read this thread instead twitter.com/DrJessTaylor/status/1425009284614610949?s=19

MW is centring themself and their needs rather than the needs of rape survivors. That is not kind or compassionate.

This is what NHS Lanarkshire says about support for male victims. Acceptance no judgement and treated with respect. Shame women don't get the same, but instead have to reframe and be challenged

@Loobylouu, what Mridul is essentially saying is that counsellors will help traumatised women understand that they can’t get over their trauma until they agree that TWAW. Is you think that is compassionate then … I don’t know what to say really. It’s mind blowing. Counselling traumatised people should not be an opportunity to gaslight them into changing their political views. I can’t believe that needs to be said.

@Loobylouu

I think it's really important to look at what Mridul Wadhwa actually said, because it's actually very considered and compassionate. You're not going to be attacked or judged if your trauma response might seem to the uninformed as prejudice, but if you come in and you have prejudice that's not as a result of your trauma and you start to make this a place that isn't safe for other users, that's when you're going to be called out on it. Which is fair. Reframing trauma is also an accepted term, we reframe trauma so that we are able to relieve ourselves of feelings of guilt and shame. That's a good and healthy thing to do.

For Women Scotland have misrepresented what Wadhwa said, when you read what she's actually said there's honestly nothing wrong with it.

'But there are a group of survivors who will be watching and seeing what is being played out about spaces that they're potentially going to use. And be informed or misintormed about what actually happens here and be possibly be fearful. And I think if you're worried about these things, about inclusion and what trans inclusion means within women's organisations, and if your local women's organisation of Rape Crisis Centre or Women's Aid is openly trans inclusive, and you just don't understand, reach out to them and ask those questions. I think its important to know that we see you as an individual. And we come as survivors with experiences that often feel to the outside world as holding prejudice. So we might have foar of man of a certain ethnicity, we might have fear of sans people, and it could be linked to an experience of trauma. I think it is it is okay to hold those things as long as you are willing to acknowledge that, in support, we will accept that

But there is a difference also when, and I am not sure if I said this as clearly and transparently as I want to, but I'm trying. Apologies, it I havest done it wes. But I think the other thing is that sexual violence happens to bigoted people as well. And so you know, it is not discerning crime. But these spaces are also for you. But if you bring unacceptable beliefs that are discriminatory in nature, we will begin to work with you on your journey of recovery from trauma. But please also expect to be challenged on your prejudices, because how can you heal from trauma and build a now relationship with your trauma, because you can't forget, and you can't go back to Ble before traumatic incident or traumatic incidents. And some of us never, ever had a life before traumatic incidents. But if you have to retrame your trauma, I think it is important as part of that reframing, having a more positive relationship with it, where it becomes a story that empowers you and allows you to go and do other more beautiful things with your life you also have to rethink your relationship with prejudice. Otherwise, you can't really, in my view, recover from trauma and I think that's a very important message that I am often discussing with my colleagues that in various places Because you know, to me, therapy is political, and it isn't always seen as that.'

That doesn't read as considered or compassionate to me AT ALL. I'm surprised anyone could read that and see any compassion for victims in it to be honest. It's not compassionate - it's self-centred.

The positive thing we are hoping will come from this is that Rape Crisis Scotland will realise that what has been said is outrageous and will keep many, many vulnerable women from accessing their badly needed services and they will sack their CEO who made these indefensible comments and issue a statement to make it clear that they are a safe space for all vulnerable women, no matter what their political beliefs are.

They have backed themselves into a corner, they can't sack the CEO without being accused of transphobia. Their choice now is angry women bringing sunlight on twitter or TRA's on their doorstep. What a mess. It's disgraceful that they have characterised some of the questions they have received from women who are clearly and justifiably angry as abuse. If they sack the CEO they'll find out what abuse is.

I'm not on twitter but I have a question, #AskRapeCrisisScotland

If women saying no to men is bigotry then do you even believe rape should be prosecuted?

This is possibly going to sound strange but is anyone else struck by the parallels between the speech quoted above by a pp
to Umbridge's speech at the beginning of term in the Potter books, which is lengthy, wordy but with just a hint of a threat?

'....because some changes will be for the better, while others will come, in the fullness of time, to be recognised as errors of judgement. Meanwhile, some old habits will be retained, and rightly so, whereas others, outmoded and outworn, must be abandoned. Let us move forward, then, into a new era of openess, effectiveness, and accountability, intent on preserving what ought to be preserved, perfecting what needs to be perfected, and pruning wherever we find practices that ought to be prohibited.'

Unfortunately, what will be 'pruned' is traumatised women seeking help unless they agree to be 'educated'.

@SusannaM

m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=903135290557479&id=311654993038848

For Women Scotland have been posting on FB.
Apparently the aforementioned person lied in the job application, as it clearly stated women only in accordance with the equality act and that person applied anyway. He doesn't even have a GRC (not that, that makes much of a difference). Surely lying on a job application means instant dismissal if it's discovered after appointment.

A decent person wouldn't take a job that involves helping vulnerable people if they knew their appointment would make those vulnerable people uncomfortable. If you cared, you just wouldn't do this. I can't get my head round their motives and the motives if the people who appointed.

There was no lying involved. This is a persistent misconception, supported in no small part by the person it is about.

This is what actually happened:

In 2005, Wadhwa applied for a job as a training officer with Shakti Women's Aid, a specialist service for ethnic minority women.

This job was nothing to do with the women using the service, but with training outside agencies who might encounter these women in the course of their work (such as police, the courts, health care professionals etc). The job was not limited to women.

However, Wadhwa likes to tell a story of either "they didn't know I was trans and were totally astonished when I came out" or "they didn't ask and I didn't tell". Both stories are highly unlikely according to accounts from people who met Wadhwa back then. (Wadhwa was just transitioning at that point in time.)

Wadhwa then started working as a training officer for Rape Crisis Scotland, and was out as transgender prior to taking the job as manager at Forth Valley Rape Crisis.

So, no, Wadhwa did not lie to get the job. Especially since the women who decided who would get the job as CEO are Wadhwa's colleagues (and friends) of more than a decade.

There remains a question about applying for a job as a legal male that quotes Schedule 9 of the Equality Act which normally limits a job to applicants of one sex, but ultimately it is up to the organisation to decide who they employ.

However, if a man had wanted to apply for the job, but was turned down and referred to the Schedule 9 Genuine Occupational Requirement restriction, such a rejected male candidate could argue that he'd been unlawfully discriminated against by RCS accepting another legal male while rejecting him, but I do not believe any such potential candidates exist.

I mean unpack this.

This is a male person, who has been placed into a position of power and authority over essential services for females, and is quite openly 'reframing' the service to force traumatised females to centre the needs of males above their own. With a quite open political agenda and a personal stake in certain outcomes, and a really staggering abandonment of all the research, policy and usual principles of working with rape victims of any sex or gender.

How open does all this have to get before people manage to find some boundaries?

And thus we can enable male people to have their desire of all female refuges being opened to them, because any problems female people speak of is now viewed as all their fault'

This seems to sum it up. Some of the other bits reminded me of the Magdalen Laundries. as a previous poster mentioned - we will save you from your sins and shame if you embrace our religion. It didnt come across as compassionate at all.

Rather wonderfully, ForWomenScot have now raised their CJ target. I imagine the anger generated by Rape Crisis Scotland's betrayal of women caused many good people to feel the need to do some digging.

But I think the other thing is that sexual violence happens to bigoted people as well.

The CEO of a rape crisis center is as entitled to a personal opinion as much as anyone else but when they express those opinions in a professional capacity they reveal themselves as unfit for the job.

Another useful thread for you loobylouu

twitter.com/SebastianPott10/status/1424804169559461889?s=19

I genuinely don't care about the biological sex of this person. If they were born a woman I'd say the same thing.
Someone who actively disagrees with a survivor being able to choose the sex of their examiner or their counsellor after a rape shouldn't be working with people who have been raped.