Pushback at Wi Spa in Los Angeles

[FannyCann]

Well it's all kicking off at the spa. An amazing woman behind the desk standing up for women and telling a man where to take his penis. I fear she will lose her job over this but it's a glorious way to go.

twitter.com/stillgray/status/1408997169344909313?s=21

OK so someone called 'Precious Child' was alleged to be the penis flasher, but has now denied.

Also, some are denying it even happened at all! (But if it did, it would be fine.) They are trying to smear and discredit the black woman complainer as a vexatious evangelical liar. Nice. So much for #believewomen and #blacklivesmatter. Turns out that white trans penises trump them both...

twitter.com/Chican3ry/status/1410257106196967424?s=20

Another testimonial of it happening last year. So sad, women and children are collateral damage.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

It’s quite incredible that the position finally taken is “little girls must be conditioned to accept male genitals in women only spaces”.

Isn't it.

Yes. Incredible. Literally.

Someone is seriously suggesting the woman should have filmed the penis owner in the act, thus also filming the naked girl and all the naked women in the spa without consent from any of them, in an environment where I am 100% certain phones will be banned?

What kind of people struggle to believe women? What sort of crusader for social justice would demand that a woman of colour is held to an impossible standard of evidence? Are they seriously suggesting that the woman made up this entire event, because a trans person doesn’t make themselves vulnerable to all this purported violence from feminists by outing themself? Why did the spa staff agree that the person was allowed to use the women’s area if the person didn’t exist?

If the woman complaining had filmed the person naked in the spa, of course, she would probably be on social media trial for outing a trans person,and probably arrested for indecent exposure, the way things are going.

This is completely insane. No logic at all.

I take it that some people posting here also believe that girls should be taught to be accepting of seeing male genitalia when it makes them uncomfortable.

The children should be taught to over ride their discomfort when someone crosses their boundaries, that children's boundaries should be lowered for a particular group of people.

Wasn't there a large settlement announced in the past days for a class action involving 60,000 children who had their boundaries lowered for a particular group of people? Still think making exceptions for a particular group of people is ok?

Or is safeguarding practices to be applied to each and every person, regardless of how they identity.

And yes, celebrities should be reinforcing safeguarding principles every time.

I wouldn't teach my daughter to accept something like this: she would be horrified and as someone with additional needs, she'd very likely be traumatised.
I am honestly incredulous that people can defend this
Boundaries???????
Safeguarding??
If this happened in the street, I'd report it not tell my daughter that its rude to look at genitals!!! Bloody madness

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9756165/Woman-says-person-beard-penis-got-hot-tub-daughter-6-LA-spa.html

The language used in this article makes me want to smash my head against the wall. This is collective insanity on a mass scale.

The mother mentioned in the above article also made a video with her story.

I'm very troubled about this case. It's not just about indecent exposure or lewd conduct, but also about a male who has demanded the right to be in an environment where they can view the naked bodies of little girls.

To my mind, that constitutes child abuse and child sexual exploitation. And Wi Spa has facilitated that.

What is it that makes these men transgender? We seem to be moving into a time where any man in a women-only space is automatically defined as transgender by the very fact of his being there. And transgender is the magic word that disappears the crime of indecent exposure and voyeurism. It's like those countries that have no domestic violence and hardly any rape because it's legal for the male head of the family to beat his wife, sisters and children, and any woman who reports a rape risks being imprisoned or flogged herself. And then we get told that these countries are much safer for women.

As the, 'It's rude to look at a flasher's penis,' thing is being reiterated, I just want to reiterate that voyeurism is the equal issue. It's as bad for a man to enter a space where women and girls have consented to be naked on the understanding that no men will be present. It's just a complete violation.

Yes it is abusive. Has the White House enacted legislation, at a federal level, which forces establishments to permit this sexual indecency (I agree it is abusive), or have the individual states a choice?

Today 11:09 Packingsoapandwater

I'm very troubled about this case. It's not just about indecent exposure or lewd conduct, but also about a male who has demanded the right to be in an environment where they can view the naked bodies of little girls.

Exactly. The fact he got his penis out is additional.

He, and the spa, absolutely think he's got the right to pay to look at naked children on their premises.

And we have seen from the mother of the 6 year old daughter posted upthread that women don't know what to do anymore. She thought that it was the new modern way, but felt she simply could not ignore it for her daughter's sake.

And even now she has posted a video without any markers to maintain her privacy because it is dangerous for her to speak out and tell people that it was not alright. She, herself, was incredibly discomforted by seeing this person's penis enter the hot tub. And was still battling with that for days after.

Yet, we are being told that women who don't want penises in single sex spaces are the minority and extremists at that.

The language used in this article makes me want to smash my head against the wall. This is collective insanity on a mass scale.

Agreed Ova. The woman quoted in the article is tying herself in knots to avoid accusations of misgendering etc.

"We were just uncomfortable, I was trying to block my daughter from seeing the penis on the person with the five-o-clock shadow who was not trying to look like a woman at all,' she recalled."

So those who use the facilities don’t want mixed sex. Those who don’t dive in, attack those not wanting mixed sex and want to ‘make them’.

Funny old world isn’t it?

. Wi Spa said in a statement that California's anti-discrimination law protects transgender people but said it would not tolerate 'lewd conduct' by customers.

I think exposing a penis to a nine year old girl would generally be considered lewd conduct by most people.

So such a person could not be accused of lewd behaviour or exposure then? What, ever?

RAAIN the rape victim advocacy group say 1 in 6 women will suffer a rape or sexual assault during their lifetime. Next time you are walking down the street or step into a lift,see if you can spot them. Of course you wont be able to as most of these women are left with a strange superpower.
That superpower is that they manage to walk amongst us, unrecognisable as rape victims. You can't tell who has been raped and who hasn't as they look like any other woman. I dont know how they manage to not be gibbering wrecks when socially around men for the rest of their lives. I know I would be.
That these women (1 in 6 remember, that's millions of them) are now expected to shower next to a transwoman with their penis on show, be that at a gym or in prison, and if they complain about it they are a bigot is all you need to know about how far down the road we have gone of losing women's rights to safe spaces. The rights of millions of traumatised women are being put behind the feelings of a tiny number of "transwomen".

Stripping away women and girls right to safety, privacy, comfort and dignity is just so progressive, isn't it?

One would venture to say that for some all their Christmases have come at once.

Those defending, deflecting and minimising this, well I have no words that would adequately express the sheer disgust I feel for them.

@Quaggars

You have more of a problem with women and wee girls being in a foyer with their clothes on, than a fucking man without any clothes in a women’s space!!!!

What was "he" actually doing though? I watched the clip, from what I could gleam was somebody repeatedly shouting testicles at the receptionist.
Never any sign of the person who was probably just quietly getting changed.
I've been to swimming and spas lots and in my experience you may have mixed sex villages but you're all cubicled off. You don't all go wandering around with your knob or minge on parade

Sat nude in a jacuzzi next to a nine year old. Has it taken two dozen pages for you still not to realise that it is customary in this spa to be nude within the single sex spaces?

I think the men (and women) who are supporting the man in the spa are not truly supporting him.

If they battle those magnificent women’s arguments (woman in the spa and pink top hat lady) with their own hateful agenda, they are cunningly diluting the very valid concerns that women actually have.

They drown them out in their own wall of hate.

Because they ain’t coming from a place of love and acceptance. Who are they trying to kid?

Black ‘military type’ apparel and hoiking up face masks don’t hide who you are.

Sat nude in a jacuzzi next to a nine year old. Has it taken two dozen pages for you still not to realise that it is customary in this spa to be nude within the single sex spaces?

DdraigGoch - Quaggars refuses point blank to accept the facts of this incident, deny, minimise, whatabouttery, you name it they've tried it. The only reasonable conclusion to draw from what Quaggars is doing is that they are in full agreement with fully intact men who say the magic words "I am a woman" behaving exactly as they did in this Spa. Naked nine year old girls and younger must accept a fully intact naked male sitting next to them in a hot tub, it's progressive don't you know, safeguarding is so last century as is women and girls right to single sex male free spaces and their safety, comfort, privacy and dignity.

I’m inclined to agree with your appraisal RedDodsBeg but I do with Quaggars would have the courage of their conviction and just come out and say it, rather than leading us all round the houses. It’s so tiresome.

@Datun

Today 11:09 Packingsoapandwater

I'm very troubled about this case. It's not just about indecent exposure or lewd conduct, but also about a male who has demanded the right to be in an environment where they can view the naked bodies of little girls.

Exactly. The fact he got his penis out is additional.

He, and the spa, absolutely think he's got the right to pay to look at naked children on their premises.

Yes, even if this male had been wearing shorts, it would still have be a violation of the females' right to privacy.

The females present did not consent to be viewed naked by a member of the opposite sex, nor did they consent to have their children viewed naked by a member of the opposite sex.

The angle I notice from certain public commentators is to "not look at the penis". There is no recognition that "the penis" is looking at the female genitalia without consent.

To my mind, creating an environment where males can view female genitalia without consent is a sexual offence. The State of California appears to be complicit in this, which poses some very awkward questions.

I do not see how this particular gender legislation does not void a significant range of sexual offences and human rights law in the US, or make them fundamentally impossible to prosecute.

I also think there are elements of elder abuse in the scenario as well, considering there are often elderly grandmas in the female section of the spa.

I also find it curious that this situation has occurred in an environment that is a product of a specific cultural context: namely, that of Korean spa culture. It reminds me of the Brooklyn mosque situation.

Both incidents had the odour of cultural imperialism targeting an ethnic minority culture.

Come on everyone. We all know that Quaggars "just has a different opinion" to us.

She thinks it's perfectly fine for a Male bodied person to show their genitalia to unconsenting women and children and we don't.

Lol.