Laurel Hubbard to go to Tokyo

[Biscuitsanddoombar]

Not a surprise and hopefully it’ll open some eyes about the utter ridiculousness of allowing someone who is male to compete against women in weightlifting

www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/may/05/trans-weightlifter-laurel-hubbard-set-to-make-history-at-tokyo-olympics

In some good news, CeCe Telfer will not be going to the Olympics. Full details here but basically CeCe has not been able to maintain T levels below 5 nmol/L as required by World Athletics.

twitter.com/boysvswomen/status/1407907908499787777?s=21

The IOC limit is 10 nmol/L so I’m guessing the WA limit overrides that?

Good. The right people will be in the event then.

However I think CeCe would have been as useful to our discussion as Laurel is. It’s so blindingly obvious watching them compete that it’s ridiculous and unfair.

www.necn.com/news/sports/testosterone-rule-keeps-transgender-runner-from-us-olympic-trials/2491659/

Having watched a couple of clips recently of past track races (one at elite competition level) I've been torn between rage at the blatant lunacy, and feeling that something like this needs to happen in front of the world's TV cameras to hammer the point home.

It really does concentrate the mind when one group of athletes is straining every single muscle and sinew to the absolute maximum, only for a single other person virtually to saunter past them all without a care in the world while not appearing to make any significant effort.

Anyone know anything about this group?

N=8

twitter.com/nequals8xy/status/1407573409786044419?s=21

They seem to be an international campaign group aimed specifically at changing the OIC regulations.

Telfer hasn’t qualified for the US Olympic trials - I doubt even if Telfer had qualified for the trials that Telfer would be fast enough to qualify for the Olympics. Telfer’s trials entry time is 57.53, the Olympic entry time is 55.40.

Just idly scrolling through Instagram and saw this by a high profile male personal trainer. He has an interesting take on the situation and it has had over 270k views

https://www.instagram.com/tv/CQbRsPzlYtb/?utmmedium=copyy_link

Also my (super fit runner) husband was ranting to me yesterday, about male puberty, about how testosterone isn't a decent measure, about LH being 43, and he was met with some weary but patient nodding. You wise women called it that sport would be the tipping point for a lot of men.

Ethics of Y chromosomes in female sport aside - how is it fair that CeCe Telfer is excluded by a WA rule that is different from the IOC rule?

I almost (almost) wanted Telfer to run in the Olympics.

Athletics draws a bigger audience than weightlifting and you can see the direct comparison between the competitors in a way you don’t see with weightlifting.

vivariumvivariumsvivaria

The limit is the one imposed by the IAAF, although it is clearly wrong that a male athlete is competing in the female category.

www.worldathletics.org/news/press-release/eligibility-regulations-for-female-classifica

@vivariumvivariumsvivaria

Ethics of Y chromosomes in female sport aside - how is it fair that CeCe Telfer is excluded by a WA rule that is different from the IOC rule?

To compete in Olympic track and field events, competitors have to qualify during competitions organised or approved by World Athletics. WA (formerly IAAF) has set its own regulations.

I think previously the IAAF did use the 10 nmol/l figure, but then revised it down because of the prevalence of DSD athletes in middle distance events, and because higher levels of testosterone enhance performance at those middle distance events.

Curious though, isn't it?

If the science is sound then the science is not limited to one sporting discipline. Why is it unfair for middle distance athletic events but not unfair for weightlifting?

(answer - because the science isn't sound)

@Helleofabore

Anyone know anything about this group?

N=8

twitter.com/nequals8xy/status/1407573409786044419?s=21

They seem to be an international campaign group aimed specifically at changing the OIC regulations.

Looks interesting, good simple message.

That’s good news about Telfer, too. I had been concerned about whether even the monitoring of trans athletes testosterone levels was at some point going to fall to cries of “it’s transphobic!”, so at least it does seem as if monitoring is being done, and the results are being used to appropriately exclude athletes who don’t meet the (irrelevant, unfair) required levels.

@vivariumvivariumsvivaria

Curious though, isn't it?

If the science is sound then the science is not limited to one sporting discipline. Why is it unfair for middle distance athletic events but not unfair for weightlifting?

(answer - because the science isn't sound)

Exactly.

Not sure if this graph has been posted on this thread yet, but it’s a great illustration of what a fudge this all is.

Even if testosterone level were a good proxy for “creating fairness” (it isn’t), it doesn’t even do that.

Thanks for that image - that's a belter.

It is also what bemuses me - the IOC has access to the smartest sports scientists in the world. So, how can they come up with such a shambles?

I'm not a sports scientist but I can read that graph.

Even if testosterone level were a good proxy for “creating fairness” (it isn’t), it doesn’t even do that.

Yes, there’s a lot of heavy lifting being done by relying on lowered testosterone to give a veneer of fairness.

Why do we “follow the science” as far as coronavirus policy is concerned, but “follow the feelings” in sport?

It is also what bemuses me - the IOC has access to the smartest sports scientists in the world. So, how can they come up with such a shambles?

Because science is the business of understanding and explaining reality, and reality (according the currently dominant construction of gender ideology) is transphobic.

I’ve mentioned this before, but the problem with an ideology that is in conflict with reality is that reality keeps poking through. So the ideological becomes more and more complex with more and more workarounds and special cases to deal with all the gaps between how it asserts the world is and how the world really is.

It’s only 9 years since all women were allowed to take part in the Olympic Games

@littlbrowndog

It’s only 9 years since all women were allowed to take part in the Olympic Games

This is so sad. It shows just what we are up against and why we have to be ever vigilant.

A whole 9 years.

9 years??

And I imagine those countries will ban the women again if they have to compete against men.

It's like we're riding a conveyor belt backwards and can't get off.

@McDuffy

Just idly scrolling through Instagram and saw this by a high profile male personal trainer. He has an interesting take on the situation and it has had over 270k views

[[https://www.instagram.com/tv/CQbRsPzlYtb/?utm]]medium=copyy_link

Yep, and he's had his account threatened with deletion. No idea if it was this, or his recent nude (ish) picture.

That chap puts across everything I want to say but better.

I couldn’t care if Mr Smith was dressed up in a pantomime horse costume with a duster up his arse.

His nakedness has not offended me.

Threatening to take away his voice because of his beliefs offends me greatly.