Trans Widows Escape Committee 5: And so it continues...

[TinselAngel]

Welcome to thread 5. A virtual prize for anyone who can guess the geeky sci fi reference in the thread title.

This is a support area for women who are, or have been, in unhappy relationships with male partners who are transitioning, or exploring their "gender identity"

If you are in that position-

1. You are not alone
2. It is not a situation that you should be expected to tolerate, let alone celebrate.
3. There is always a way out, if you want it. The thread is called Escape Committee for that reason

Remember: women talking to each other is a powerful weapon!

In four years we have gone from starting the first thread, to launching a website, to be invited to give evidence to a government inquiry, which is pretty spectacular when you think about it.

Thanks to all the women who have told their stories and particularly to those who have stuck around to help others. Thanks also to @socialworker222 who remains nice cop, to my stern cop.

Do say hello to start the thread off!

@margaretatwoodslefteyebrow Yes. @TinselAngelis right. Don't underestimate the pressure which you are under. The worst time was after my now dead Trans then-H left: 18 mths after he left to be precise. He was gradually closing down communication (would not respond to my emails, blocked my mobile phone), and I was frantic with worry: would he continue to pay school fees for our eldest as previously agreed and executed for 9 years? Would he go to Court to obtain an order for access? I could confide in no one as I only have a brother who had his own problems, and my neighbours and friends just thought that I would cope, I would cope with everything. I got brief support from a consultant psychiatrist who told me that his problems stemmed from "immaturity". I started having panic attacks for the first and last time in my life. I found a wonderful psychotherapist and she really helped me over approx 5 months. I began to feel stronger inside. I just kept thinking: "What a shmuk you are Paul! Leaving such lovely, healthy, intelligent children to indulge your selfish delusion. Leaving me in the lurch financially in years to come". It took 10 years after he left for the pain in my chest to subside. It isn't easy. Big hugs!

Happy Mothers' Day to all you women carrying on and supporting your children through the storm. Mothers are amazing and your children will always know you put them first and kept all the plates spinning through the hardest of times ❤

Happy mothers day to all those on the thread. My spouse has agreed to couples therapy. Communication has become little more than transactional and he has been very curt with me whilst I have tried to remain upbeat. He obviously feels that I should be being more positive about everything and is resentful when I try to address possible issues eg my parents being supportive but requesting that he doesn't turn up on their drive in a skirt so they don't get drawn into difficult discussions with their neighbours which I don't think is an unfair compromise given how tolerant they have been of the situation. He sees this as us all trying to suppress who he is and compared it to racism and homophobia. He seems buoyed by the suggestion of joint therapy, however for me this is also possible preparation for as amicable a separation and coparenting situation as possible. I am obviously keen to avoid being drawn into a gender affirming coercive conversation, this is about understanding each other position and finding a way forward. Is RELATE a non starter?

Some of these fellas use joint therapy as an opportunity to force others to participate in seeing them dressed. Just saying.

Yes I appreciate that but he is already presenting as a woman so he gets plenty of that. He doesn't seem to find that hugely thrilling as part of it to be honest.

I think his response is more because he hopes someone will 'fix my feelings about it so we can stay 'happily married'. That's why I want to make sure RELATE don't have a gender affirmative blanket policy similar to the NHS as that is not what I want to be on the end of. I will support his transition to keep the peace and I want a constructive co parenting relationship when we split as is my eventual plan. At the moment he would simply say I hadnt tried everything and that I was turning the kids against him and that a split would be more detrimental to them (as my abject unhappiness is unreasonable in itself you see 🙄)

It sounds like he's looking forward to using couples therapy to pressure you in to accepting things you aren't happy with.

This is also worth considering:

www.thehotline.org/resources/should-i-go-to-couples-therapy-with-my-abusive-partner/

Thanks @TinselAngel - i do think its more hope than anything on his part but I know I need to be cautious. I guess Im hoping that by having a mediated conversation he will be able to understand better why I feel the way I do about things. Trying to be the bigger person, but I know it may get me nowhere. Has anyone any experience of couples therapy as part of preparation for divorce/separation in this scenario?

I guess I'm hoping that by having a mediated conversation he will be able to understand better why I feel the way I do about things.

he hopes someone will 'fix my feelings about it so we can stay 'happily married'.

While you want to give him information to him to understand, he wants information about you to change your mind.
All you need to do is assert your boundaries. You don't have to explain why you put them there, and its not in your best interests to discuss that with him.

I'm not a TW @margaretatwoodslefteyebrow , I don't usually post here as I don't feel it's my place to do so but I really wanted to offer words of support and advice about the councilling. All through your marriage your H has pushed for what he wants and you've let him erode your boundaries out of love for him, but he really hasn't appreciated that, has he? Just as you gave in before if he asked over and over, he still thinks that if he finds the magic words you'll accept him "being a woman" and you'll live happily ever after. Considering how very stressed and disconnected from him you are it's amazing he can't see that you're unhappy and that this marriage is doomed.
Please be very careful with the marriage councilling, don't let him pick the therapist because he'll find someone who will be totally on his side, someone who will try to guilt you into staying. His only interest is in him and his needs and wants, he will shamelessly try to manipulate you if he can, after all, he's done that all your married life. I really hope you can find the drive to leave and start your life afresh.

The only stories I've heard from trans widows about couples counselling involve them being pressured by the counsellor and/ or told they must be a lesbian.

MargaretAtwoodsLeftEyebrow:

I am a transwidow. I didn't go through counseling with my now-ex. But I can tell you that from what you're saying what you're experiencing is the wounded narcissism of an entitled man who thinks he has the right to your continued support for him, regardless of how he's changed the terms of your marriage. I doubt he will hear what you are saying to him; what he will "hear" is that you are "attacking" him because you refuse to validate his transition by staying with him and changing your own sense of who you are to accommodate him and his sense of who he is. That is, in his mind his transition requires yours, so if you refuse to go along with it, you are "rejecting" or "denying" his "existence. "

It's ok to want to be able later to tell yourself you did all you absolutely could, so you can have no doubts about leaving. I certainly did. But doing so comes at a price to you later.

You can still support his transition as his friend. He is trying to make you feel guilty for not wanting to be with him. He needs to find someone new who he can feel happy with. You also deserve happiness, and your children deserve two adults to make the right decisions for themselves and them. If you're not happy leave your husband. I was the child in the middle of a relationship like that I run as far as could from both of them.

You can still support his transition as his friend

No. She's under no obligation to be his support human.

TinselAngel She has chosen to support him through his transition that's what she said. All I am saying is she doesn't have to do it as his wife she has a choice. You can't pretend around children they can see what's going on. I was brought up in the same dynamics and it was dysfunctional. I cut both my parents off because of the dysfunction and poor choices they made.

My thoughts are with any trans widows in New Zealand today, who must be feeling very isolated following such a naked display of where the power lies in their country

I've come here to kind of think out loud about a situation in my circles. I know three women in their early 50s who are going through transwidowhood. I am not close to them, anymore, and I mostly "see" them on social media.

Each of them has been posting about a separation, moving out, building a new life, very sad posts about how life takes you to unexpected places etc. I didn't think much of it but then I've noticed their husbands now have profile pictures with makeup, wig, age-inappropriate girly clothing, you know the deal. The husbands are all your regular 50+ STEM masculine balding blokes, you all know the deal. I don't know what's going on with that, midlife crisis?

Now.. these women don't know each other although I know all of them. And I don't think they have that much support. They're probably being told to celebrate their brave spouses. I'd like to kind of steer them toward each other or toward any supportive sites BUT all of them are still also posting trans-positive stuff on their socials. So I am very wary of ... well, doing anything. You know the current climate.

On the other hand all of them have taken the most important step which is to leave.

You could contact all 3 women individually and say that you know someone in a similar situation - would they like you to introduce them? They can just say no if they don't want to. You can also offer your own support if appropriate.

Yes totally agree @ZeldaFighter these women may feel entirely alone at the moment, the others could be a huge support. Reaching out in this way could be so good potentially

I posted on these threads a while ago, probably around 18 months. I didn't think I was a trans widow but my husband was showing signs and although a committed lefty and had been for over 40 years, had become a full on TRA. Even just advocating for TWAW was too much for me and I ended my marriage around that time. He moved out a year ago when I was 60 and he was 63. I've now had it confirmed that my gut instincts were correct and he's doing the dressing up etc and now trawling sites for hook ups. I don't really have anything much to say because I can't talk about it in real life. I'm glad I listened to my gut, I'm glad I ended the marriage before I was dragged down too far and, although I don't like it, I'm glad I've been proved right. It's been really hard starting again in my 60's but even when you don't have much in the way of money, it is possible. Luckily, we didn't have children together as this was both our second marriages. Listen to your gut and don't let anyone tell you you're being sensitive or difficult or unkind. You only have one life and it's too precious to waste trying to accept something that's unacceptable. It'll drive you mad.

Hello @talkingdeadscot May I be the first to offer sympathy and support to you for the terrible time which you are going through: this is appalling! What a waste of HIS declining years! I could use much, much stronger words. I am so, so sorry. Can I suggest that you contact other Transwidows through this thread and also through Transwidowsvoices.org? As you get to know us you will find emotional support and practical help.
In the longer term your experience will help others to recognise the insanity and to motivate you to help related campaigns. Not everyone wants to do this, of course, But I have become a "gender-critical" campaigner with feminist groups like A Woman's Place UK, Standing For Women, Fair Play for Women, Graham Linehan with his substack, Sex-Matters and others. They are all pursuing different aims which are linked to "gender" and "trans". You will learn, if you want, the history of the "Gender" "Recognition" Act 2004 and all the insanity which it is promoting, for example in "drag queen story time" for toddlers and RSE lessons in schools. "Gender identity" ideology "pops" up in women's prisons, women's supposedly single-sex NHS hospital wards. But at least YOU know what this is, whereas the general public doesn't link them together.
If you want to contact me directly please do.

Do you have other family members that you can turn to? It is so important to find someone to share this with. That is why I found the feminists. They were wonderful to me: hugging and offering me a drink in pubs after meetings! I hope that your finances will be OK. Big hugs. 😭💔

Hi Talking dead. Whether you get involved in wider campaigns and groups, or just connect with other people in this position, well done for trusting your instincts. Many women don't have the time or energy to do more than connect, and for some the exposure of involvement in wider groups is too worrying (my job makes it very hard for me to go in any way public). But the personal journey of leaving and starting again particularly in middle age when this seems to strike men, is important and frankly far braver than dressing up in miniskirts in the current climate. You are quite right that you can start again. It can take years to in any way recover but we are remarkably strong. Did you have support from friends and family?

Listen to your gut and don't let anyone tell you you're being sensitive or difficult or unkind. You only have one life and it's too precious to waste trying to accept something that's unacceptable. It'll drive you mad.

This is very good advice.

On a different note, do keep posting everyone because I've just decided on the title for the sixth thread

Me and my friend from Children of Transitioners did our first ever feminist speaking engagement at the International Women's Declaration conference at the weekend. It was a really good session, and showed women are definitely interested in hearing about us.