Jordan Peterson

[Wilsonwilson]

What do people make of him? Watched the triggernometry interview with him yesterday. I have previously seen bits and bobs of his but not taken much notice. In the interview he pointed out that out that his greatest criticism has been because he was lecturing people whilst being a benzo addict, tbh this was my criticism.

I don't know, to me he just seems disingenuous somehow, could be my bias like he says.

From what I have heard him say is that men need to grow up, “tidy their room” and act like the man they wished their fathers were. Stop talking about their rights but act on their responsibilities to yourself and others. To do so will give men meaning in life, some of the comments you read on YT from men thanking him from saving them from spiralling further into hatred has convinced me he is not all bad.

He seems very culturally conservative and has taken a lot of flak for his freedom of speech and pointing out the narcissistic behaviours in some TWAW.

He also is a big fan of equality of opportunity over equality of outcome. I don’t necessarily agree with all he says.

I actually liked some of his bible lectures explaining the psychology of the Old Testament. How these books are metaphors etc, explaining them from a different POV I’d never even thought of. Again just to get a POV not to always agree with him.

He clearly has a large male following and very successful author. I believe he understands his own sex very well, I think he fairs less well understanding women. I don’t think of him as an ally Of feminism an i don’t think he does either.

I’m very wary of demonising someone because of their personal demons.

Sorry posted too soon...

His drug addiction is a personal matter, and the same with anyone really, people are allowed to have personal demons it doesn’t make them less of a person.

It’s not a stick with which we should beat anyone with. On the flip side it doesn’t make a person brave or stunning just because they have/had addiction issues. As long as he doesn’t seek to capitalise on it then let him sort it out alone. But maybe he has tried to capitalise on it, I haven’t really looked him up in a while so don’t know.

He's a man, speaking to men, mostly. I don't have a problem with what he says, which is mostly advocating personal responsibility.

If everyone, or every man, behaved themselves like he suggests, the world would be a better place

If any man stops blaming women and takes ownership of himself as a result of JP, well that is a good days work.

I don't agree on all his religious views but was a really good advoccate of free speech in 2016 in Canada, when prefered pronouns and TRA took over the campuses there:

Wasn't he the dude that said enforced monogamy was the solution to terrorism? Because all those scary violent men are just frustrated incels.

Basic "self help book," psychology.
Hardline conservative.
MRA "father figure"/patriarchy enforcer.
Lobster enthusiast as he admires their hierarchal nature.
A lot of bollocks hidden behind a veneer of common sense such as thinking incels should be given wives - enforced monogamy.
Hates the trans.

@Doona

Wasn't he the dude that said enforced monogamy was the solution to terrorism? Because all those scary violent men are just frustrated incels.

This has always been taken out of context. It’s an academic concept. I think it refers to humans being socially monogamous rather than genetically programmed for it like some animals.

But some very patriarchal cultures are polygamous and the argument is that they are more violent because of leftover men that can never hope to find a partner. I am not educated enough to tell you whether it’s true or not (patriarchal polygamy doesn’t seem great however you shake it).

“The people who hold that our culture is an oppressive patriarchy, they don’t want to admit that the current hierarchy might be predicated on competence."

J. P.

He's a competent writer and he seems to be expressing ideas that some people need to hear. But as a person, he seems to be a self-important whiny narcissist bully, and I find that hard to respect.

When he disappeared for a few years, I actually forgot why I'd disliked him. I thought maybe the Woke had successfully prejudiced me against him. But then I saw this and all my dislike resurfaced twitter.com/jordanbpeterson/status/1367102473429807110
Why do you hate me so much @helenlewis? I have tried to be a good man.

Ugh. If you read the link it's to a very interesting and well-balanced article that evinces no "hate" whatsoever. I really wonder how he'd deal with a clinical client who claimed to be "hated" based on similar evidence.

Furthermore, presuming he read the article, he KNOWS he's sticking his troll army on Helen Lewis by tweeting that. The article talks about that and Helen's prior experience of it. It's inexcusable.

I'm absolutely done with self-important narcissistic men playing the victim to bully women. Fuck that shit.

He is indeed a man mainly writing about personal responsibility in a way that seems to appeal to predominantly men.

I believe that he is very compassionate (was a clinical psychologist for years) and that he has seen the best and worst of human nature.

He is familiar with a lot of research and history but uses easily accessible comparisons and explains concepts in an easy way.

He also talks a lot about what things are ( based on existing empirical evidence) as opposed to what they should be.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=aMcjxSThD54

The video is an interview with Cathy Newman. They are discussing gender pay gap, men and women and a bit of compelled pronouns.

sticking
s.b. siccing.

Stop talking about their rights but act on their responsibilities to yourself and others.

I think this gets to the core of why he's so controversial.

There's a kind of visceral response to "self-improvement" in some circles - it's akin to "victim blaming".

A sort of binary thinking or at least ascribing bad faith - anyone suggesting people work on themselves is saying that to try to get out of also working on society.

You need both - personal responsibility, and a society that rewards that. We seem to be failing on both counts - society (even more in the US) has been failing to reward workers well, and I think that's led to more hopelessness - people failing to reach their potential.

I've always objected to Conservatives positing self-improvement as an answer to society's problems - it's like musical chairs - not everyone can be a CEO. Someone has to be at the bottom and to clean the streets, and they should be rewarded for their work, not punished for failure.

But self-improvement for individuals is fine, and as far as I can see that's what Peterson does. The stuff I've heard from him on broader politics is liberalism, not "trickle-down economics" conservative crap.

And at this point, left-v-right on economics is really not the issue. It's liberalism versus authoritarianism. We need everyone on board to fight the Woke stuff, and he seems solid, and with broad popular appeal.

I keep posting this article, because I don't see anyone else doing so, and I love Louise Perry.

The feminist case for Jordan Peterson - I came to mock the Canadian guru but stayed to respect the depth of his thought

I find him interesting although I don't agree with a lot of what he says (and wouldn't life be boring if we only surrounded ourselves with people who agreed with us!) I also feel that he doesn't really get women. Hasn't been married for a long time? (Nothing wrong with that but I don't think he has much understanding of women in general). I listened to his audio book. He read it and it was like being harangued for hours - I think he doesn't realise how off putting he sounds and this sometimes colours people's impressions of his work. Suzanne Moore recently wrote a brilliant piece on him in her subscriber emails - well worth signing up to those!

I listened to his audio book. He read it and it was like being harangued for hours - I think he doesn't realise how off putting he sounds and this sometimes colours people's impressions of his work.

I find him quite annoying too - I've read/heard far more about him than I've actually listened to him. I gave up halfway through an interview with him the other day. I'm not really his target audience, I guess - the self-improvement stuff doesn't grab me. I just know he's really annoying the people that I want to see annoyed.

And he's certainly abrasive. But I know I am too. I do respect people who are blunt and to the point, if I feel it's with broadly good motives, and not intent to bully or be vindictive.

I'd never actually read any of his stuff until this essay the other day, which I didn't know was him until I'd finished - I had to go back and check "who the hell was that?" He can certainly write.

He's had a massive breakdown recently and ended up being put in a coma in a Russian hospital. He's been diagnosed with schizophrenia and BPD I believe. There is an unbelievable article in the Times about the whole experience (paywall sorry).

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/jordan-peterson-depression-drug-dependency-daughter-mikhaila-rehab-russia-0xtz2ph32

He is an intelligent man with some very conservative views who has been adopted by the alt-right and is very much on the edge.

Bookmarking for later. DS13 has discovered JP on YouTube so we’ve been discussing JP recently. Some of his stuff seems sensible but there’s a side to his work I don’t like and I need to understand better to critique it.

There have been some really balanced responses today, which have been a joy to read. He's usually dismissed and trashed, here!

I like what he says about men and society. He isn't great about women- he should stop talking about us .

I think JP thinks he is so intelligent and that because he’s pretty much got male behaviour sorted he can extrapolate that to women.

He needs to spend more time listening to women of different socio-economic backgrounds and cultures instead of assuming he knows it all because he is married to his childhood sweetheart and has a good relationship with his daughter. He is Naive and too simplistic when it comes to women.

He is probably a good role model for young men looking for meaning in their lives so in that respect he is ok.

He did an interview with Russell Brand and that is how I came to find out more about him.

He is probably a good role model for young men looking for meaning in their lives so in that respect he is ok.

I'd disagree on this on the basis that he's basically just playing the 1950s dad and enforcing the same toxic masculinity and patriarchal hierarchy that has men so bloody useless to begin with.

I like him. I think he's a good role model for men and encourages them to take responsibility for themselves and their own behaviour.

He needs to spend more time listening to women of different socio-economic backgrounds and cultures instead of assuming he knows it all because he is married to his childhood sweetheart and has a good relationship with his daughter. He is Naive and too simplistic when it comes to women

His daughter seems like a nutcase, honestly speaking

I'd disagree on this on the basis that he's basically just playing the 1950s dad and enforcing the same toxic masculinity and patriarchal hierarchy that has men so bloody useless to begin with

Disagree. They are generally more useful after they are influenced by JP. He seems to motivate them to actually DO something instead of sitting around and whining about the unfairness of life.

He's not an ally.
There's a reason his writings and words attract MRAs, incels etc. He thinks women should know their place.

@BilboBercow

He's not an ally. There's a reason his writings and words attract MRAs, incels etc. He thinks women should know their place.

Yes, this is my initial impression.