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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What do you think of Andy Ngo?

316 replies

ThroughTheBarsOfARhyme · 10/03/2021 21:12

This is a bit of a tenuous link to feminism, it’s probably more about free speech, but I saw that a member of Mumford & Sons was criticised for praising his book (about antifa) and that his book had previously been banned from Amazon. It seems a bit like TRA tactics and a similar response to Abigail Shrier’s book. I’ve just bought his book to read but I was interested in other’s opinions of him and/or the book. Is he speaking the truth and people are trying to suppress it (similar with feminists) or is he exaggerating and not someone to praise?
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/mumford-sons-winston-marshall-taking-time-to-examine-blindspots-after-praising-andy-ngos-unmasked-book-12241592

I appreciate this really isn’t feminism so I will ask for it to be moved if people think it should be.

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LangClegsInSpace · 12/03/2021 21:54

Even the author of that dishonest jacobinmag article had the momentary decency to say 'To be clear, the attack on Ngo should be condemned', which is more than the antifa fans on this thread can apparently manage.

I say he had the 'momentary' decency because I also had a look at Arun Gupta's twitter stream and it's really unpleasant.

twitter.com/arunindy

Most of it seems to be a boring stream of snark, labelling people as far right lunatics, fascists, white supremacists, fascist collaborators, fascist bootlickers, nazis, kkk, nazi bootlickers etc.

The monotony is relieved by the occasional celebration of someone's death and a bit of back-and-forth about whether it's OK or not to say NYC mayoral candidate Andrew Yang should be pushed into traffic.

He really is quite obsessed with Andy Ngo, who he hilariously calls 'milkshake andy'.

Gupta says 'he is dumb enough to justify someone taking him out with a Mack truck'

He says, 'I was told by sources you included feces-stained rubble with your book to boost sales since it tested well among your demographic'

He says, 'Since you admit you were brain damaged by a vegan milkshake, you are cognitively incapable of grasping ...'

He says Ngo's parents 'were collaborators in the mass murder of their own people'

Then there were these tweets in the screenshots which are not aimed at Ngo. He doubles down on the revolting 'kapo' slur a few more times until Aaron Mate blocks him and then Gupta tweets 'achievement unlocked' with a screenshot of Mate's 'you are blocked' page.

These are apparently the tweets of a grown man.

What do you think of Andy Ngo?
What do you think of Andy Ngo?
Hibari · 12/03/2021 22:03

@andyoldlabour

Hibari

"But she's talking about anti-white racism and how great Parler is. Gonna take her anti-left comments with a bag or two of salt."

I think your moral compass needs recalibrating.

Someone who finds good company with antifeminists and white supremacists it probably not going to be a particularly good judge of character.

If you take that as a moral position, you do you. But you have people in this thread defending racism as a minor booboo.

If they have to be marching people into the gas chamber before you take notice, it's already too late.

Zinco · 13/03/2021 02:01

Black Lives Matter don't need to worry about their protests being attacked by the far right, because the boys in blue are there to protect them? You seem somewhat naive about the role, intent and capabilities of the police in these situations.

It's not impossible that a BLM event could be attacked by the far-right, and of course they would have every right to defend themselves in that situation.

But you seem somewhat naive here yourself... there was far more of a problem of parts of BLM being violent and rioting, than of the far-right turning up to attack completely peaceful BLM events.

In fact by your logic, why shouldn't people "physically confront" BLM when they turn up in a menacing way? That's what you are supporting yes?

7Days · 13/03/2021 02:01

You keep throwing smeary stuff like anti feminist and racist and nazi around.

Explain yourself.

Zinco · 13/03/2021 03:11

"Or the time a car deliberately ploughed into a group of peaceful protesters dragging one of them 30 foot down the road... There is a clear pattern here of dishonest reporting..."

"He drives at the crowd, almost hitting someone, then turns pushing the guy who got in front of him down the road. I've been part of a protest when a driver does something dickish like that, it doesn't matter if they aren't going very fast, it's frightening and dangerous."

So to be clear, it wasn't a deliberate attempt to run into anyone; the car was moving slowly, and no one got "dragged 30 foot down the road".

So your own reporting is highly misleading in this case.

LangClegsInSpace · 13/03/2021 03:55

What I see going on here is basically a bunch of testosterone-fuelled gangs, street-fighting and claiming territory. Same as it ever was.

There's an antifa gang and a proud boys gang and a BLM gang and a patriot prayer gang and bla bla bla and none of them really give a shit about the people they identify as representing. It's all just willy waving and kicking each other's heads in and getting one over on the other lot.

This is not OK:

I am so fucking sick of male violence.

Zinco · 13/03/2021 05:18

I don't know much about this guy Chris Elston, but apparently he was just peacefully displaying some signs against trans ideology. Attacked by trans activists. Video in link.

twitter.com/christophelston/status/1370550679606018050

Hibari · 13/03/2021 06:54

[quote Zinco]I don't know much about this guy Chris Elston, but apparently he was just peacefully displaying some signs against trans ideology. Attacked by trans activists. Video in link.

twitter.com/christophelston/status/1370550679606018050[/quote]
Elston is a serial instigator looking for attention. Provoke conflict, get attention, either by being arrested for incitement or receiving conflict, repeat.

He was arrested last year for harassing a Canadian politician.

He's the type of idiot who holds a "make me a sandwich" sign at a women's march.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 13/03/2021 08:29

There's an antifa gang and a proud boys gang and a BLM gang and a patriot prayer gang and bla bla bla and none of them really give a shit about the people they identify as representing. It's all just willy waving and kicking each other's heads in and getting one over on the other lot.

YY. Thus it ever was.

PurpleHoodie · 13/03/2021 08:32

Antifa/Momentum et al = cancer.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 13/03/2021 08:32

I've not rtft yet but already I'm going to bet we've got the usual Marcusian radical left/SJW arsewash where any even vaguely conservative position let alone a right wing one, or indeed anyone that they don't agree with, is seen as but a bawhair away from all out total fascism and must be righteously fought against (including with actual violence) by those on the side of the angels because they know they are the "good guys"....where's an MN eye roll emoji when you need it?

I just have and I would say that's a pretty accurate summing up!

PurpleHoodie · 13/03/2021 08:35

They ALWAYS attack (physically, or otherwise) minority, organic, grassroots protection groups.

PurpleHoodie · 13/03/2021 08:36

I second Eresh's response.

PurpleHoodie · 13/03/2021 08:48

So.

Andy Ngo.

Have hardly heard of him outside of this thread.

Sounds like an old school investigative journalist*
(This is a GOOD THING)

Will do some due diligence on him before buying his works/showing social media support.

As touched upon upthread (I think by Sunset)
killings/attacks/racist abuse of Asian Americans are not just on the rise, but astronomically so: in the Northern America's (especially the U.S.A)

Hibari · 13/03/2021 08:56

@PurpleHoodie

So.

Andy Ngo.

Have hardly heard of him outside of this thread.

Sounds like an old school investigative journalist*
(This is a GOOD THING)

Will do some due diligence on him before buying his works/showing social media support.

As touched upon upthread (I think by Sunset)
killings/attacks/racist abuse of Asian Americans are not just on the rise, but astronomically so: in the Northern America's (especially the U.S.A)

Next you'll be joining the heritage foundation because they look like good old fashioned politics.
PurpleHoodie · 13/03/2021 09:04

Who let this muppet crash the bar? Grin

Jog on babe.

Meet you at Speaker's Grin

Zinco · 13/03/2021 09:40

Elston is a serial instigator looking for attention.

Even if correct, it wouldn't justify an attack on him right?

He's the type of idiot who holds a "make me a sandwich" sign at a women's march.

In this case, I don't think he went anywhere near a trans event (?). But even if he went to a trans event with some provocative signs, it's still not a justification for violence.

UsedUpUsername · 13/03/2021 09:46

Next you'll be joining the heritage foundation because they look like good old fashioned politic

And what’s wrong with the Heritage Foundation? I’m not into them, but it’s a legit organization that normal people join.

Or it’s a conservative group so that automatically means you hate them?

Why are you so full of hate?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 13/03/2021 11:22

In this case, I don't think he went anywhere near a trans event (?). But even if he went to a trans event with some provocative signs, it's still not a justification for violence.

Quite. And I remember the excuses and justifications and outright lies when male transactivists assaulted 60 year old Maria McLachlan at Speakers Corner.

jj1968 · 13/03/2021 11:32

@UsedUpUsername

Next you'll be joining the heritage foundation because they look like good old fashioned politic

And what’s wrong with the Heritage Foundation? I’m not into them, but it’s a legit organization that normal people join.

Or it’s a conservative group so that automatically means you hate them?

Why are you so full of hate?

Perhaps if you're straight, a non migrant, reasonably financially secure and not likely to want an abortion or get divorced in the near future then you might not see anything wrong with the Heritage Foundation. However those whose lives would be devastated by the kind of society they wish to see are likely to have somewhat stronger feelings.
jj1968 · 13/03/2021 11:40

In fact by your logic, why shouldn't people "physically confront" BLM when they turn up in a menacing way? That's what you are supporting yes?

Do BLM have the same aims of fascists and organised racists? Do BLM have a history of lynching white people? There is a very different dynamic at play, and BLM's anger has largely been targetted at the police and the state institutions which support them. It's completely different to a rabble of klansmen, alt right provocateurs, organised neo-nazis and misogynist fratboys turning up heavily armed and looking for a fight in towns known for being liberal like Portland.

nauticant · 13/03/2021 11:42

Our violent mob = good
Your violent mob = bad

A more nuanced approach might be to view violent mobs as bad whichever identity banner they march under.

jj1968 · 13/03/2021 11:50

What I see going on here is basically a bunch of testosterone-fuelled gangs, street-fighting and claiming territory. Same as it ever was.

That's what I used to think when in the days of Anti-nazi League protests and others in the 70s/80s. That was before I learned that the key stategy of the British fascist movement since Cable Street was to establish a violent street movement that was strong enough to march into minority areas to cause intimidation and fear in those communities. And that everytime they got close to achieving that aim they escalated to violent attacks on minority owned businesses and individuals, which in fact is how fascism became established in Germany. The anti-fascist movement did not appear out of nowhere but out of a need to prevent this, not least because the police wouldn't and at the time many police were supportive of the far right - and I suspect many still are. As I said upthread it wasn't always perfect and it wasn't pretty but if it takes a bunch of testosterone fuelled blokes to prevent something like the Blackshirts emerging then I'll take it. Violence is inherent to Fascism, and it is a luxury those who are the victims of that violence don't have to pretend that it's growth will be prevented either by state forces, or reasonable debate in the marketplace of ideas.

jj1968 · 13/03/2021 11:51

@nauticant

Our violent mob = good Your violent mob = bad

A more nuanced approach might be to view violent mobs as bad whichever identity banner they march under.

Would you have criticised the Suffragettes on the same grounds as many did at the time?
Ereshkigalangcleg · 13/03/2021 11:51

Our violent mob = good
Your violent mob = bad

A more nuanced approach might be to view violent mobs as bad whichever identity banner they march under.

Indeed.

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