Why don't we centre women?

[yeahbutnaw]

This is a feminism board but 99% of the threads are about trans people or gender identity.

What about domestic violence, FGM, the gender pay gap, period poverty, and representation in the workplace?

It seems like this board believes the only threat to women is trans people.

Am I missing something?

Little bumpette as some of Hibo's t-shirts are still for sale

I got a large, hope it's roomy enough. Fingers crossed.

@yeahbutnaw

This is a feminism board but 99% of the threads are about trans people or gender identity.

What about domestic violence, FGM, the gender pay gap, period poverty, and representation in the workplace?

It seems like this board believes the only threat to women is trans people.

Am I missing something?

I haven't RTFT (it will probably go the same as they always do)but I need to say something. Let me first state this entire post is referring to the general OP of this kind of thread not the specific OP of this one (necessarily).

This kind of thread really pisses me off. OP makes a thread asking why there aren't threads about x, y or z (generally there are threads on x. y or z to be found but that doesn't seem to matter, they haven't looked).

OP worries to themselves about how feminism isn't being done properly because of alleged absence of these threads and the large amount of threads centered on (the very real and current) threat of gender ideology or women being silenced.

I'm guessing OP (general) feels quite good about bringing this up and taking the time to make this thread worrying about the state of feminism on this FWR board but at no point immediately after making the thread or at any point in the future do you see the OP actually create a thread discussing the issues they are concerned we aren't discussing enough. Frequently they don't even participate when those threads are made.

This kind of thread pops up every few months and I always think the same thing. If you are truly concerned about this then don't make this thread, create threads about the topics you want to see discussed instead.

Lol - I see thread went how I thought it would. I am thrilled to see discussion of Hibo and the t-shirts in it though. She is amazing and I hope it brings more people to following her and learning through her. She really cares about women.

OP worries to themselves about how feminism isn't being done properly because of alleged absence of these threads and the large amount of threads centered on (the very real and current) threat of gender ideology or women being silenced.

I'm guessing OP (general) feels quite good about bringing this up and taking the time to make this thread worrying about the state of feminism on this FWR board but at no point immediately after making the thread or at any point in the future do you see the OP actually create a thread discussing the issues they are concerned we aren't discussing enough. Frequently they don't even participate when those threads are made.

This kind of thread pops up every few months and I always think the same thing. If you are truly concerned about this then don't make this thread, create threads about the topics you want to see discussed instead.

Yes, quite.

Of course all those issues are hugely important. But if we can no longer determine what female actually is then all hard-earned protections in Law and society will be entirely obsolete. So this fight will absolutely need to be fought every single day of the rest of my life, and beyond, unless the landscape changes quite dramatically. It is not a minor concern, it is an absolutely vital fight.

Thanks for the T shirt link. have ordered one. I cant do much activism these day only way I can help is financially so hope this helps.

Excellent. I am off to get hibo’s shirt.

What about domestic violence, FGM, the gender pay gap, period poverty, and representation in the workplace?

I see no engagement from the OP.

So my thoughts on each.

DV. There is huge concern at the moment about the women’s refuge charities missing out on tenders that at going to organisations that also cater for males. Ie. They don’t necessarily have the focus on women and children’s needs. There were a few threads about this this week.

Of course, it is also true that there are threats to women’s refuges and DV charities for centring females. (Funding, forced policy, eviction (South London for instance), even physical threats) And being female only. Do you think that women’s refuges and charities should be forced to ignore women’s statements that they feel unsafe with males, however they identify, and allow access to males?

FGM

Others have covered this. Do you think the way FGM activists are being distracted, and impeded in their activities that actually help girls and women victims is ok?

And the US state that has had its FGM protections held up due to trans rights activists? That ok too?

Please tell us what you think should be happening while the very women who are working at the front to address this issue are being abused by activists from another group?

And also, please tell us exactly which trans rights activists are doing as much as Hibo and others like her to progress protections for women and girls? The ones working with women to protect women and girls? I would like to know because I will follow them on social media and see what they have to say.

gender pay gap

You mean SEX pay gap. The gap that has resulted because of women’s biology and the sexist discrimination over a millennia, don’t you? I hope so.

Yes. I would like to discuss this too. I would like to discuss the prevalence even today of sexist discrimination that starts in schools. I know that there are many attempts to get more girls into STEM. However, this is really a long play because, you know, it has been a millennia.

So, please tell us how we can trust that organizations such as tech giants are actually giving accurate information even so we can continue to assess the gap. Because, late transitioning males in senior positions do kind of skew the pay figures in some companies.

Again, if you cannot define it, how do you measure it accurately. Or do we settle for falsehoods?

Also, as someone who has experienced sexist discrimination all my employable life, why on earth would an organization hire a young woman who might get pregnant when you can hire one who doesn’t have the biology to get pregnant? Your numbers look great though!

Is this a very small issue in your mind? You don’t think it has impact considering women cannot simply do the reverse and identify as male to get the same job? What part does socialisation play in the gap between sexes do you think?

Last year, the British veterinarians did a bit of a research project and discovered that sexism is still well and truly alive, maybe you read it. It was on the BBC.

Can you assure me that by conflating sex and gender in the fight for progressing women and girl’s futures, that this conflation will NOT further harm the progress, I and many many other women have fought for?

period poverty

There has been threads about this issue recently too. Maybe search them out as others have suggested.

There are some great initiatives being done at my child’s school. Part of it involves discussion around period shaming.

Now, I am old enough to have been shamed by men, included doctors, most of my life about periods. So much that it was only recently, I felt some progress was made to make it ok to discuss them in the public sphere.

Well, fuck. That lasted about 5 years. Now, we are dehumanized again about the subject of periods. Imagine!!! Just beginning to be able to discuss it as one of the most normal and human things.... now... we are menstruators, we are people who menstruate. If you (general you) are privileged enough to not have been made to feel ashamed of periods, maybe I can understand you (general you) are quite happy to be reduced to a biological process.

Why have empathy for one part of society and not the other?

Are girls being taught with the language being used that they are now to accept being referred to by their biology?

And that is progress from me, in the past being shamed for talking about periods how?

It seems like this board believes the only threat to women is trans people.

No. Not at all. In fact, unlike the callous threatening-women-with-rape-and-death that some activists delight in, there is a clarity here about how the ideology is the problem. Not the people.

Reasonable people will see this.

10 t-shirts, thanks to this thread! Yes, I am obsessed with counting t-shirts.

Here's that link again. [hopeful face]

www.mercht.com/c/i-am-a-woman

representation in the workplace

This one is also excellent to discuss at the moment. And we have had threads recently on this too.

It is really important for people to feel represented in their workplace as it is in schools, and in parliament. This does include women too. Are you happy OP with the current trend of roles that have been set aside to ensure that female's needs are being adequately addressed and policies created and followed are now being taken by people who do not have the lived experience of a female?

There is quite a few of these roles that are quite prominent too. Are you satisfied completely that the person is fully focused on addressing the needs of females? And if they start addressing the needs of the group that they represent above female's needs, is that ok with you? I will point out that where there is a women's officer role, there is often a LGBT role also, so, there is good representation for the needs of trans people already being addressed.

And of course, this is also being played out with boards and panels. Where boards have been set up with roles set aside for women to either encourage women to apply for these roles where previously they will have not felt they had a chance, because of the discrimination that I discussed further up thread, or because there is a specific need for that role to be filled by a female, are you satisfied that males can take those roles?

There is at least one board that is supposed to be gender balanced that now has 75% male representation. Is this good representation?

There was recently a panel to inspire women to choose to enter a particular career. That panel of 6, iirc, had two males. One is very successful in their career and it could be argued that that success was assisted significantly because for a large proportion of it was as a male. And that person does seem to show a dominance of male socialisation.

Do you this that is achieving the goal of representing women in the work place? Is this giving proportionate representation for women? Should we accept this trend?

I am rather keen to know what people think about these topics too. However, I am not sure that any of the topics you raise can be discussed without addressing the issues I have suggested might have significant impact if left unaddressed.

Hi everyone, thought I’d have a quick read of Mumsnet this lunchtime.... and now I’ve got a new T-shirt ordered!

Thank you for posting the link and I’m so glad to support the brave and defiant Hibo Wardere. She’s an inspiration in her defence of girls and women against this hideous mutilation.

Over 300+ now sold!

When I first looked, there were around 279 sold.

Every penny helps.

Everyone for Hibo

Fantastic post winesalot

Love to wonderful Hibo

PurpleHoodie

I am not posting with the expectation that the OP will even read them. But I am sure with all the new readers there is a need to cover off the issues that OP raised.

Yes, yeahbutnaw. I do think you are missing something. Hopefully, though, you will start to consider the impacts on those exact issues you are seeking to address. The impact that is of one group seeking to access the established rights of another. The impact on women and girls.

Just had a peek.

315 sold so far

I don't know what you mean by "women", OP. I suspect it might be something very different from what I mean.

I'd ask you to explain so we can talk about 'women'. But then this would become a thread about the very subject you think shouldn't be discussed.

Dilemma.

More sold.

Like it

11 sold just thanks to this thread!

@yeahbutnaw, fancy making it a dozen?

@PotholeParadies

11 sold just thanks to this thread!

@yeahbutnaw, fancy making it a dozen?

Thanks for reminding me in time! I've just bought mine. I would have been sorry to miss the deadline.