MOJ Prison Policy JR TODAY

[ChazsBrilliantAttitude]

Just seen on Twitter.

Will post links

@KeepPrisonsSingleSex

Did a post on Jones here.

www.keep-prisons-single-sex.org.uk/karen-jones

Jones brought a case which established legal sex (i.e. GRC) as criterion for being housed in female estate. Prior to this criterion was that prisoner had already had reassignment surgery. Jones changed this meaning that intact prisoners could be housed in women's prisons.

Thank you so much for your important work.

The Jones case needs to be raised with anyone who is under the incorrect impression that there were no issues until recently, that old-school transsexuals never caused a problem or that the GRC panel are too strict.
Jones was one of first with GRC despite being incarcerated at time and having convictions for manslaughter and attempted rape.

And in the early 1990s, other prisoners established the legal right to obtain reassignment surgery in prison (with subsequent transfer to female estate). It's all part of a long process, going back to at least the early 1980s.

"Ah, this person's problems (the small matter of committing violent sexual crime) are all caused by their great distress at having their delicate lady brain housed in a burly male body. We can fix all this by putting them in the women's prison. There, finally at peace, they will sit calmly with their sister prisoners, braiding each other's hair while awaiting a new life on the outside as a gentle librarian".

Perfect analysis @bourbonne .

@KeepPrisonsSingleSex

Paris Green had both 'consensual' sexual relations and sexually assaulted women.

Do you have any evidence she sexually assaulted anyone whilst in prison because I've never seen any.

Willfully blind, then? What do you think is going on in their heads?

I don't think we are allowed to say.

Yes, we must keep reminding people of this. It isn't the colourful-haired pronoun-badged youth driving this. Has been decades of influence on organisations insife and outside government.

I think part of why GRA passed with so little concern for women's safety and dignity was "Well we're already doing all this anyway. Let's just tidy things up".

Karen Jones case:

www.bailii.org/cgi-bin/format.cgi?doc=/ew/cases/EWHC/Admin/2009/2220.html

The Claimant was born male but has been diagnosed as suffering from gender dysphoria. Indeed, she has said in evidence that she was aware of the issue of her gender from an early age. There have been several stages to the Claimant's progress to being recognised as a female, all of which have happened during her current sentence. The first stage was in about March 2003 when she began taking feminising hormones and she has taken them continuously since then. After 12 months the Claimant was referred to the Gender Identity Clinic at Charing Cross Hospital, London and has been under their care since. The next stage was laser treatment to remove unwanted facial and genital hair and, as a result, the Claimant no longer shaves. Following this the Claimant obtained a gender recognition certificate which, as she says in her evidence, gave her legal recognition as a woman

The judgment says KJ obtained a GRC on 25.07.06

None of it is naive. It's all backed by hugely wealthy and influential people who wield an inordinate amount of power - otherwise how else would this all be happening so fast?
Women are being subjugated and relegated to second class, sorry THIRD class citizens now - to "put us back in our place", I have no doubt.
Maybe there is also the feeling that women deserve to be raped - certainly sentencing of rapists and assaulters seems to have been downgraded unless the victim is also killed - and if they're already in prison then they've obviously Done Wrong so whatevs.

That's the impression I'm getting from the whole fucking mess, anyway.

Thank you, KPSS, for all you are doing. I find it so sad that no politicians or anyone happy to flash their progressive credentials seem to have spared even a moment's thought for the faceless, nameless women who have to deal with the consequences of these decisions.

As an aside, the idea that lasering off 'unwanted' genital hair is part of the process of 'being recognised as female' is creepy as fuck isn't it?

• keep thinking of Penny Mordaunt yesterday sombrely chanting 'TWAW', like a righteous priest. This is the consequence, Penny, of your bloody inane mantra.

You can tell when there is a court case or something happening that doesn't agree with theTRA agrenda - the BBC posts pro-trans news articles. This time about a housing development exclusively for LBGT+ (funny how that sort of exclusion is ok), and another about a catholic school applying catholic principles to its RSHE.

KeepPrisonsSingleSex

More than that. You can only legally exclude males from spaces females because of the single-sex exceptions. If you determine that the single-sex exceptions do not apply to a space or service, then to exclude males is discriminatory and illegal.
Thus, if the single-sex exceptions do not apply to the female prison estate, surely it is discriminatory and illegal not to open this up at the very least to applications for allocation from all males?

MoJ did not say that single-sex exceptions do not apply in the case TW who want to be housed there. MoJ said exceptions do not apply to prisons.

Hopefully we will find out the thinking tomorrow...

Exactly. And this is why we regularly ask the question, why is one allegedly vulnerable subset of males allowed to be moved? Surely other vulnerable subsets could argue discrimination? Maybe elderly or disabled males would feel more comfortable surrounded by support sub-humans (previously known as women) too?

@LangClegsInSpace

As an aside, the idea that lasering off 'unwanted' genital hair is part of the process of 'being recognised as female' is creepy as fuck isn't it?

You have to have it done prior to surgery, although it was probably electrolysis not laser.

I echo the thank you to KPSS. A friend asked me why I was upset about this - I’m never likely to go to prison.

My thoughts - if we (on the outside) don’t - who will?

And - you never know. Miscarriages of justice happen - I do my best to be totally law abiding but it is not an impossibility for anyone.

Support subhumans. Depressingly accurate.

As for being law abiding - they're about to make some rather sweeping changes to the law in Scotland. I understand MBM suggested it might make the declaration that 'sex is immutable' a criminal act.

Let's not get side tracked! This case is v important.

What I keep coming back to. And can't comprehend. That our authorities thought it was the right thing to do to lock intact male sex offenders in with women in prison.

That fact is just so mind blowingly stupid and callous. And they did it. How could they? It's an absolute disgrace and everyone involved should be ashamed of themselves.

The point that I always raise but always seems to be overlooked is risk of pregnancy. Through consensual or non consensual sex. No one, not any one wants female inmates getting pregnant.

Where was this massive obvious risk in the thinking of the authorities?

'A friend asked me why I was upset about this - I’m never likely to go to prison.'

Who the fuck even thinks like that?

Fucking hell.

The answer is. So you're ok with female prisoners being raped then are you? I mean surely she wouldn't say yes?!

A friend asked me why I was upset about this - I’m never likely to go to prison

I have had similar said to me, when a colleague and I were walking past a hostel for youngsters with some intimidating young men outside, taking up all the space. I commented on how frightened I would have been as a young woman who had to live there, and got told that it would never have happened to me, so why the concern. But it could easily have happened to me. Girls I knew well, grew up and hung around with ended up in places like that during our teenage years.

Why the concern? It's soulless to not be concerned.

You have to have it done prior to surgery

What surgery?

@MaudTheInvincible

A friend asked me why I was upset about this - I’m never likely to go to prison

I have had similar said to me, when a colleague and I were walking past a hostel for youngsters with some intimidating young men outside, taking up all the space. I commented on how frightened I would have been as a young woman who had to live there, and got told that it would never have happened to me, so why the concern. But it could easily have happened to me. Girls I knew well, grew up and hung around with ended up in places like that during our teenage years.

Why the concern? It's soulless to not be concerned.

Just what the hell is wrong with people?

This thinking is partly why things are in such a sorry state. People (mainly men) saying 'not my problem. Doesn't affect me.' And turning the other way.

People posting on this thread are articulate, has access to the internet, is willing to contact MP’s etc. If we don’t stand up for vulnerable women; who will?

I'm glad Karon Monaghan is on this. She has an extremely clear understanding of the interaction between the EA and the GRA (as clear as it can be).

I remember her evidence in the EHRC inquiry and how she explained that when using a single sex exception, 'case by case' should mean per setting and not per individual wanting access. I'll see if I can find the quote ...

She seemed to very impressive even just from reading the live tweets.
It seemed like she had to hold the judges hands and carefully lead them through the law, which is very concerning.

Got the impression that neither of them had ever considered the issues re women in the interaction of GRA and EA before and still had trouble understanding even when clearly explained by Monaghan.
I hope I'm wrong about that.

Here we go - scroll down to 31 October:

old.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/commons-select/women-and-equalities-committee/inquiries/parliament-2017/enforcing-the-equality-act-17-19/publications/