Allison Bailey to sue Stonewall -thread 2

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Previous thread www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3950877-Allison-Bailey-to-sue-Stonewall

Allison's website allisonbailey.co.uk

Statement

First and foremost, I hope that my legal action will bring me justice. I also hope that it can stop Stonewall from policing free speech via its Diversity Champions scheme.

Stonewall have signed up many companies, public bodies, voluntary sector organisations and government departments to their manifesto and their value system regarding trans rights. What is called Stonewall Law. Without most of the public realising it, a large swathe of British employers have signed up to the Stonewall value system. It has done this by trying to silence and vilify women like me who have genuine concerns about how its approach to trans inclusivity conflicts with the protections, safety and dignity of women, girls, children and LGB people.

We cannot achieve a just outcome for everyone while Stonewall are free to threaten women like me with the loss of our livelihoods and reputations. Stonewall must be held to account. I intend to do just that.

Stonewall are a small LGBT charity

Odd use of the word 'small' to describe a charity which has embedded itself in so many workplaces, schools, Government depts and many other institutions.

Is this wording the usual trans activist attempt at a victim narrative?

The result of a consistent and total substitution of lies for factual truth is not that the lie will now be accepted as truth and truth be defamed as a lie, but that the sense by which we take our bearings in the real world—and the category of truth versus falsehood is among the mental means to this end—is being destroyed
Hannah Arendt

This is what the constant twisting is about. To destroy the very fabric of the concept of the truth.

This is why the truth must be repeated no matter what.

Just because someone says they identify as something does not and never will mean they are something. Regardless of what their documents might say, what others might call them or the law will compell us to say. Under all that we still know.

@Impatiens

Stonewall are a small LGBT charity

Odd use of the word 'small' to describe a charity which has embedded itself in so many workplaces, schools, Government depts and many other institutions.

Is this wording the usual trans activist attempt at a victim narrative?

8 million through the books. 150 employees, 9 trustees and 40 volunteers.

This in no way meets the criteria in the law in this country for a 'small' organisation.

It punches massively above its weight for an organisation of its size too.

And are trans activists etc tackling the porn industry about this stuff?

The category that you referenced JJ. The name of it is grim. I'd have thought it's a very transpobic name? Are trans activists targeting the porn industry on this?

I'm sure there are groups etc on Reddit about this category, do they get people coming and calling them bigots and threatening them?

Porn sites have men. Women. And a host of awful sub categories. Racist, mysoginist etc etc. But when people look for. I dunno. Barely legal teen gets bang banged. If they're not in the gay section. They expect a very young looking person with a vagina with a group of penis owners. If they are in the gay section they expect a very young looking penis haver with a group of other penis havers.

All of this is transpobic. I haven't heard of them being criticised for transpobia though. Why is that?

8 million through the books. 150 employees, 9 trustees and 40 volunteers. This in no way meets the criteria in the law in this country for a 'small' organisation.

That's what I thought. Thanks for putting figures on it.

"All of this is transpobic. I haven't heard of them being criticised for transpobia though. Why is that?*

Because you haven't looked. Many people have criticised the dehumanising terms used by the sex industry to describe trans women, it's even made Pink News

www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/04/19/shemale/

@Impatiens

8 million through the books. 150 employees, 9 trustees and 40 volunteers. This in no way meets the criteria in the law in this country for a 'small' organisation.

That's what I thought. Thanks for putting figures on it.

Small to medium enterprises are defined by the EU as those with a turnover of less than €50m a year.

More info here, Companies House says 6.5m for a sma l business, the EU 10m, so I don't think it's unreasonable to call them a small organisation.

www.thecompanywarehouse.co.uk/blog/what-is-an-sme

The point stands jj1968 despite your desperate stretching. Stonewall's infiltration into all areas of our society makes a nonsense of your claim that it is a 'small' charity.

[quote jj1968]More info here, Companies House says 6.5m for a sma l business, the EU 10m, so I don't think it's unreasonable to call them a small organisation.

www.thecompanywarehouse.co.uk/blog/what-is-an-sme[/quote]
More misinformation from jj.

From the link:

Companies House defines a small business as employing less than 50 people and a turnover under £6.5 million and a medium business as less than 250 employees and a turnover under £25.9 million.

EU definition
Small Business = less than 50 employees & turnover under £10 million
Medium Business = Less than 250 employees & turnover under £50 million

So with 150 employees and turnover of £8 million that definitely puts them in the medium business category according to Companies house, and probably in the same category according to the EU, especially as the EU figure is actually €10. (I checked that because it seemed odd to have an EU figure given in £ rather than €).

ec.europa.eu/growth/smes/sme-definition_en

I said I wasn't going to waste any more time researching facts for jj (because it's never enough), but here I am

And now we're not in the EU, definitions which apply to the EU are no longer relevant here anyway.

@Impatiens

The point stands jj1968 despite your desperate stretching. Stonewall's infiltration into all areas of our society makes a nonsense of your claim that it is a 'small' charity.

Stonewall have signed up more than 850 companies, charities, government departments and public authorities to be “Stonewall Diversity Champions.”

legalfeminist.org.uk/2021/02/01/submission-and-compliance/

Stonewall are hardly small and insignificant when they have input into how over 850 organisations are run. And this doesn't include those which are members of their other schemes like the workplace equality index and the Schools Champions.

How is shemale porn lesbian sex?

It was a ridiculous claim to make @OldCrone and even more pointless to double-clown on it - thanks for the further info on the reach of Stonewall.

double-clown

Awesome as a typo or on purpose

@Impatiens

It was a ridiculous claim to make *@OldCrone* and even more pointless to double-clown on it - thanks for the further info on the reach of Stonewall.

Hardly ridiculous, compared to the big charities like Oxfam and Cancer Research, Stonewall are miniscule so I feel quite comfortable describing them as a small charity and will continue to do so.

Best typo

Stonewall are a small LGBT charity

A donkey sanctuary is a small charity. Stonewall is not. Hope that helps.

Hardly ridiculous, compared to the big charities like Oxfam and Cancer Research, Stonewall are miniscule so I feel quite comfortable describing them as a small charity and will continue to do so.

Do these charities have input into organisations with schemes similar to the Stonewall diversity champions? Do any other charities?

Stonewall have signed up more than 850 companies, charities, government departments and public authorities to be “Stonewall Diversity Champions.”

https://legalfeminist.org.uk/2021/02/01/submission-and-compliance/

Stonewall are hardly small and insignificant when they have input into how over 850 organisations are run. And this doesn't include those which are members of their other schemes like the workplace equality index and the Schools Champions.

Quite. It's utterly nonsensical to call them a "small charity" like something being run at a person's kitchen table.

Why should people have Stonewall's views forced upon them through their employment? Why should people who didn't actually chose to sign up to their scheme be forced to play along?

This is the crux of the matter.

"compared to the big charities like Oxfam and Cancer Research, Stonewall are miniscule so I feel quite comfortable describing them as a small charity and will continue to do so."

Do they identify as such...? I was not aware we were allowed to use our common sense to decide how we felt comfortable describing anything, in relation to this issue.

I read the article in pink news.

This part was interesting

' Petruzalek, an activist on trans issues, says: “The term shemale is a term coined by the sexual industry to profit on the social vulnerability of pre-op transgender women.

“The problem arises from the fact that transgender people are often disowned by their families and friends.”

Petruzalek argues that the word is used to brand “us as lower class citizens,” meaning that “we are seen mostly as sex workers – no matter what we really are'

I thought sex work was work and a job like any other?

Anyway.

It is about individuals not using the term. It does not address the porn industry use of this at all.

And men who watch that genre have searched it. They know what it is.

If they search lesbian sex, or just legal girl gets destroyed etc. They are not expecting cocks. In the first. In the second they are, and it's the cocks doing the destroying.

JJ why do you do this? I mean, pretending that men who search porn don't mind if it's cocks or cunts, because the people's bodies don't matter, it's what they feel on the inside.

You know that's ridiculous.

Stonewall is the UK’s largest lesbian, gay, bisexual and trans charity, and we’re here to let all LGBT people, here and abroad, know they’re not alone.

We believe we’re stronger united, so we partner with organisations that help us create real change for the better, including employers of all sizes and sectors (via proudemployers.org.uk)

Yeah, such a tiny LBGT charity ...