Woman's Hour 20 October: Has Mumnset become too politicised?

[nauticant]

I assume this is about the the audacity to criticise the gender identity ideology. I wonder if they'll have a proper discussion. Remember that Jenni Murray only felt free to talk only as she was walking out of the door.

BrassicaRabbit
I no longer trust the BBC as a broadcaster though, after reading the continual misrepresentation of feminists (such as JKR) whilst every other day there is the steady drip drip drip to promote transition of children with no discussion of the medical realities or recognition of the often sexist and homophobic backgrounds. Ditto the many articles on "sex work", focusing on the privileged middle class few and conveniently ignoring trafficking, poverty and addiction. Not to mention the victim blaming stance they seem to take when men kill their partners.

I feel the same about the BBC.

Great piece on WH.

MN provides the space and sense of community that all other demographics can readily find in political settings, in academia, on MSM and social media, and in society generally.

Women have been driven out of those spaces unless they accept a lie and offer up their sex-based rights. MN isn't just a safe space, it's a glorious edifice of intelligence, evidence, understanding, support, debate, reflection, wit and cackling.

Thanks to all of you that have made it so.

I haven't been able to tune in, but can't wait to listen later, sounds great

GlomOfNit I think it was the way Jane immediately jumped in with the transphobia accusation that really pissed me off. I thought it was jarring and totally unnecessary.

By the way, for those who haven't heard the interview yet, I should have put 'called names' in quotation marks as this was the actual phrase used to avoid broadcasting some of the offensive language used to describe women posting on Feminism Chat.

Good work by JG.
Excellent work by Prof Pedersen. A brilliant swerve of the "transphobic" accusation.

A point to note. If you want to debate, the BBC wants 'balance' and will invite the other side to turn up (which they are finally doing). However, if you've got a book to plug then the stage is all yours ...

I'm sure that Prof. Pederson will be checking this out, so an enormous 'well done' for handling it so well.
Unlike others, I don't get any feeling that JG is particularly GC.

There's a sample chapter available on the publisher's website.

Was going to say it's going on my Christmas list but honestly, I don't think I can wait that long!

books.emeraldinsight.com/resources/pdfs/chapters/9781839094712-TYPE23-NR2.pdf

jg talked of this board's symbiotic relationship with wpuk, filia & fpfw and that some people think that's tranphobic - I thought pederson answered that really well, by just saying well they absultely love to do their research & present evidence, documents & proper findings. (paraphrasing obvs).

The whole movement's answer to the accusations of transphobia is to move past it & keep presenting the information.

Yes - huge appreciative shout out to Sarah Pedersen! I wish we knew who she was on here so when she next appears we could give her a big standing ovation. The book sounds like a brilliant read.

(I am particularly impressed that she managed to find a way of making hanging out on MN into actual work )

I thought pederson answered that really well, by just saying well they absolutely love to do their research & present evidence, documents & proper findings.
Precisely. Didn't fall for the trap and make the obvious answer i.e. "no, MN isn't XXX" (which, in politics, somehow always comes across to the public ear as the exact opposite to what you just said!) but said "MN researches and thinks and comes to conclusions".

I also thought it was good.
Inevitably sad that JG has to tiptoe round putting the alternative view that some see Mumsnet, FILIA etc as transphobic. But that's the upside down unreal world we live in. Stating that 12 year old girls should not have to undress in front of a middle aged man self identifying as a woman or women being reluctant to be renamed as cervix havers / menstruators is now considered (by the powerful woke) to be bigotry.

@Destinysdaughter

GlomOfNit I think it was the way Jane immediately jumped in with the transphobia accusation that really pissed me off. I thought it was jarring and totally unnecessary.

Same here. It's not like every time they mention Stonewall they preface it with "sooome people have called it homophobic..." Whereas it IS at least true that Stonewall is homophobic (same sex attraction is wrong, same gender attraction is hunky-dory) and it is NOT true that these organisations are transphobic.

Good on the whole -Pederson was excellent, and I definitely want the book now.

Is it just me? When JG delivered her compulsory " some people say these groups are transphobic" I heard it very much in the tone of voice of "I can see the producer out the corner of my eye with th P45 in his hand, I know you as listeners can see this in your mind's eye as I say it ..."

I heard it very much in the tone of voice of ...
That's the way I heard it, too.
I didn't know that JG was leaving at the end of the year. I suppose that that proves how little I listen to WH these days. Shake yourself up, WH, you're becoming irrelevant.

Pederson was excellent and gave very clear signposting to FWR for any interested listeners. I hope MN sees a rise in figures in the next day or two.

I take back almost all I've said about Jane Garvey possibly not being onside. She sent the message loud and clear that it's the BBC and not her personally who's dodging this.

Does there need, now, to be an organised campaign directed at the BBC and prepared to go to the highest level, taking on their censorship of women. They have very clearly taken a side — the transgender side —against 50% of the population. They really do need to be required to account for their position. It's scandalous that a minuscule minority of the population can silence the media in the way they have.

I heard the same cara

I forced myself to listen as I can no longer tolerate JG (her snippy interview with Susie McMurray, the sculptor irritated the hell out of me), but was pleased to hear that she was successfully swerved.

It's not like every time they mention Stonewall they preface it with "sooome people have called it homophobic..."

What a good point.

No, they don't have to "present the other side of the argument" everytime they mention Stonewall, exactly!

Another one here sending much appreciation to Sarah Pederson. A fantastic interview in a clear accessible style. Lots of points raised that will hopefully be engaging to lots of WH listeners. If I wasn't already on here I think I would be checking out Mumsnet after that.

I have bought the book but not yet had a chance to start it. It looks great and I have been a bit surprised by the lack of discussion about it on here (unless I've missed something?)

I'll be listening to this later and have just downloaded the book from Amazon.

www.amazon.co.uk/Politicization-Mumsnet-SocietyNow-Sarah-Pedersen-ebook/dp/B086JPPXRC/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&tag=mumsnetforu03-21&qid=1603188462&sr=1-4

No reviews yet, so get writing them, you erudite lot!

And look, LOOK, at the 'sponsored product' Amazon has chosen to link with the book! If you click on the 'i' underneath, you can tell them what you think about it

@nauticant

OK everyone, it's about to start so get ready for the singing nuns.

It looks like I've started a (mildly) controversial thread. I feel like, finally, I've arrived.

Never doubted you Nauticant, but JG did say that yesterday, "singing nuns, that's all I have at the moment".

Look forward to listening to this later.

I got "Customers who bought this item also bought 'Troubled Blood' (Galbraith) and 'Invisible Women' (Criado-Perez)

grin

Ha! that should have been