Diva magazine exclusively for TRAs now

[SapphosRock]

I’m pretty hacked off about it truth be told, especially since I’ve supported Diva and bought pretty much every issue since I came out as a lesbian in the late 90s.

I’m a member of Diva’s online community and someone recently posted about Nicola Adams (Olympic world champion boxer, used to identify as bisexual, recently came out as a lesbian).

Nicola has made the suggestion of having a separate category in boxing for trans women to compete with one another as she doesn’t believe it is fair for them to compete in the female category. Thread on it here:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3834912-Olympic-Boxing-champ-Nicola-Adams-calls-for-transgender-athlete-categories-for-fairness#94290477

This seems completely fair enough, and there is an exception in the Equality Act for exactly this reason, to make women’s sport fair.

As Diva is (was?) mainly a place for lesbian women, quite a few in the online community spoke up in support of Nicola Adams.

A trans woman who is a prominent poster in the group wrote a long and detailed post to ‘educate’ everybody why it is completely fair for trans women to compete in female sport. Point 5 of her post states biological sex isn’t binary. Anyone who didn’t agree is a transphobe.

This was backed up by Linda Riley (Diva publisher) who compared debating the right of trans women to compete in female sport to debating ‘all lives matter’, not so subtly suggesting that questioning the fairness of trans women in sport is as bad as racism.

DIVA MAGAZINE IS OPENLY CLAIMING WOMEN ARE BIGOTED FOR QUESTIONING THE FAIRNESS OF A MALE BODIED PERSON HITTING AND PUNCHING A FEMALE BODIED PERSON IN SPORT.

I have absolutely no problem with Diva welcoming trans women into the community but centering trans activism like this is madness. I know I’ve posted here in defense of Diva before when other lesbians expressed concerns about the TRA / MRA ethos. Apologies I didn’t listen and feel free to tell me ‘I told you so’.

As a side note, the prominent TRA in Diva’s online community made Diva’s Pride Power list. Olympic world champion lesbian role model Nicola Adams did not.

www.pridepowerlist.com/the-list-2020.html

Poor brian 😩😩😩😩😩

Well he has been a naughty boy.

I don’t know anyone who believes this stuff

When I tell them they are like no no.

Gotta tell my dad about some men getting abortions and some men getting periods

I think he would call my mum and say littdog is on drugs

@DialSquare

Well he has been a naughty boy.

FFS! Very naughty boy! I give up.

Anyway. Back to the thread. Quaagers is going to be gutted!

I'm very done with trendy liberal Christians pretending not to be homophobic while having conversations about how lesbians and gay men are so wrong for not considering the opposite sex.

Oh Floral, stay away from the Christians. No good can come of it, especially considering the experiences you have shared on here previously.

I wish there was a lovely, lesbian space I could recommend to you but unfortunately I no longer know any.

Maybe you should write an open letter to Diva explaining your position Sapphos.

That's not a bad idea Escapeplanning. thanks I think I will. I've been messaging a couple of others from the group who have had their perfectly polite and reasonable comments deleted.

@SapphosRock

I'm very done with trendy liberal Christians pretending not to be homophobic while having conversations about how lesbians and gay men are so wrong for not considering the opposite sex.

Oh Floral, stay away from the Christians. No good can come of it, especially considering the experiences you have shared on here previously.

I wish there was a lovely, lesbian space I could recommend to you but unfortunately I no longer know any.

You are not wrong on any points there.

I expect a lot of women are baffled and upset at Linda's inTRANSigence. She's taken a hardline position that really doesn't have the support she believes it has. I've heard her on radio shows claiming to have never heard anyone disagreeing that trans women are women, no exceptions ever. It would be great to a see someone telling her they believe there are exceptions. In the Equality Act 2010 specifically for sports in fact.

I'm new here so don't know much of what has happened before with you but I just wanted to say that it took guts to come back and say what you have and that I really wish it wasn't you who were wrong

saphos 🙂

On a general note, I do think it is interesting ... we (collectively) have persuade Saphos of our argument. Intellectually, We won.

Yet all of us are saying, shit yeah, I REALLY wish it was you that was right, and that we had, perhaps been mistaken. None of us want to be where we are. Ignorance was bliss. In so many ways.

Glad they're being supportive of all women. That's good news!

Go strum your guitar in the void !!

@littlbrowndog

Go strum your guitar in the void !!

That's as existential a sending off as I've ever seen. Oi Oi littl! You're fab!

I think Sapphos has been very brave to admit she was wrong. I respect her for that.

@littlbrowndog

Go strum your guitar in the void !!

Brilliant!

Glad they're being supportive of all women. That's good news!

Have you read the thread? The point is Diva is not being supportive of all women. In particular Nicola Adams, a black lesbian woman.

Wanting to legitimatise any type of violent behaviour from biological males to biological females is a deeply problematic position for a women's publication to take.

I dislike the idea of "sides", and don't think Sappho herself has changed.

A lot of us recognised her honesty, even if we disagreed with her views.

What appears to have changed is a recognition that there is a conflict of rights. Men who identify as women still have male bodies. And in some circumstances: a boxing ring, a crisis shelter with vulnerable and traumatised women, social groups of same sex attracted women , etc there needs to be recognition of competing rights and proper debate. It is not sufficient to say that one groups rights ALWAYS takes precedence over anothers. It is odd that Linda Riley cannot see this, or perhaps chooses not to see this.

For my part, I take honesty over dishonesty any day. Even if I don't agree. The idea that there is a singe truth, and therefore there should be no debate is...well...dim.

I agree about sides needsmoresleep

It is odd that Linda Riley cannot see this, or perhaps chooses not to see this.

Again, she set up a company that ran ‘Diversity Award’ events which went bust having transferred £800k to her other company - a tourist attraction that exploited the stories of women murdered by a serial killer.

It doesn’t surprise me at all that her judgement is a bit off.

I'm late to the party aren't I?

We’ve saved you some cake.

And the games aren’t over yet, SapphosRock. Glad to have you with us.

We’ve saved you some cake

We haven’t

I blame dial

I made some pear cake if there is a need for further cake?

You lot have made me laugh this morning - I needed it after a heavy (emotional) weekend so I thank you for that. This will get better I’m sure.

Ooh nice garden

😀

Rufus is right. I can't be trusted around cake.

Or Brian’s with out forgetting them apparently. .......