Munroe Bergdorf

[ripples101]

I am trans.

I was a follower of Munroe Bergdorf’s Instagram.

Munroe wrote a post about JK Rowling, calling her a dangerous woman to the trans community. Munroe stayed something along the lines of

“JKR is a dangerous cisgendered, white woman who is causing harm”

I replied to this post, asking why Munroe felt it necessary to mention JK Rowing’s racial identity.

I wasn’t Abusive. I just felt that it wasn’t necessary, in regards to what Munroe was being critical of, to mention JK Rowling’s ethnicity.

Within minutes my post was deleted and I was blocked.

I am trans, and Munroe has silenced me.

So it seems nothing can be questioned. Any intent to ask a question, or to strike up debate, will be met with being silenced.

This is fast turning into propaganda. This is fast turning into thought crime. This is fast turning into silencing. This is fast turning into something it should never have been.

When a trans person isn’t even able to question another trans person, what chance do “people who belong to sex that menstruate”* have?

• Christ, I don’t even feel like I can use the word women here without being controversial.

I am so sorry for people to whom I thought I identified alongside (trans people) who are doing this to you. I feel sick and ashamed of what I am, because of people who are representing me.

I feel like I literally have no space left. And I can’t help but feel that a lot of biological woman are feeling the same way. And you have so much more to lose than I ever will, so I simply can’t imagine how this is making you all feel.

I’ve been baking, got Madeira cake (Nigella) and ginger muffins (experimental).

34 pages before it hit recipe and cake idea swapping, that's pretty impressive going, it's usually a lot sooner if anyone disagrees or offers an opinion separate to the Borg.
Wonder weetabix hasn't been mentioned yet.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/loreal-paris-labour-party-transgender-munroe-bergdorf-dawn-butler-racist-charlottesville-a8230891.html

For people that don't know much about Bergdorfs prior claims here is an earlier story of wild claims. That time it was much broader than just Emma Nicholson and JKR. So the newbie posters that have explained they have no knowledge of Bergdorfs history of accusations maybe we do seem a little cynical about them. It's for good reason.

It's a shame the OP hasn't been back as I would be interested to hear their thoughts on whether trans women are more or less privileged than biological women.

Anyway, enjoy your cakes.

do birds having flying privilege then?" was a particular low low point.

You just can't stop yourself putting your own dubious spin on everything, can you? At no point was it said that white privilege doesn't exist. The point of that conversation was because there was a clear misunderstanding about structural oppression. Males who cannot get pregnant are not structurally oppressed.

@TornadoOfSouls

do birds having flying privilege then?" was a particular low low point.

Did you think so? I enjoyed that one. One of the things I like about this board is that no matter how frustrating or depressing the subject matter, there is always levity, wit and humour.

It might even be funny if a significant number of contributors had actually, honestly understood the serious, pertinent point being made about white privilege and how it blindly perpetuates oppression. Being blind isn't immoral, closing your eyes is.

In this case humour was just another mechanism of denial. OP and others will continue to make the same mistakes and blame it on the wrong things.

Anyway, enjoy your cakes

I haven’t GOT any cake

Ive just seen a cake room...and i know its my fault it derailed for a handful of posts but seriously....a cake room!

Did you think so? I enjoyed that one. One of the things I like about this board is that no matter how frustrating or depressing the subject matter, there is always levity, wit and humour.

TheProdigalKittensReturn has always had the best analogies.

Anyway, enjoy your cakes.

Thanks Sappho, I'm sure we will.

@LemonadeAndDaisyChains

To a POC or their allies, JKR being white means she is a member of the oppressing class

I'd say this
Also yes, she's a woman, so of course speaking on women's rights fine - but if you're a biological, white woman, and then there's a black trans woman, of course said black trans woman is probably going to think "you have white, biological privilege, talking about trans issues"
I'd think it'd seem like talking about something that doesn't affect you/couldn't understand but doing it anyway and riding roughshod over people's rights.
(Yes, I know was talking about women's rights, but this is where it gets conflated)

OPs take sits comfortably alongside "I don't see colour, why should you?" or "Surely all lives matter?" Sentiments like these mark you out as part of the problem, not the solution. Getting blocked was fair dinkum. This thread should have been 1 page long
Agree

As a person of colour, I don’t think JKR speaking about women’s rights means that she’s oppressing me. Funnily enough, her being white has no bearing on this particular discussion, or do you think women’s rights are only the preserve of white women and us black women have no skin in the game?

And again, because this isn't twitter, and it's easy for people to check what was said:

At no point was it said that white privilege doesn't exist. The point of that conversation was because there was a clear misunderstanding about structural oppression. Males who cannot get pregnant are not structurally oppressed.

Oat cakes are not cakes.

Just saying. Even with cheese they are disappointing not cakes.

Oat cakes ARE CAKES

It might even be funny if a significant number of contributors had actually, honestly understood the serious, pertinent point being made about white privilege and how it blindly perpetuates oppression.

Just again to repeat for the benefit of any latecomers to this thread: this poster is lying and is equating "pregnancy privilege" that they contend women have over males with white privilege.

This is of course a laughably unserious treatment of white privilege, comparing it to a joke privilege that doesn't exist and isn't a privilege. They should of course cancel themselves and hang their head in shame for being a liar who treats white privilege like a joke. They won't though.

I've just read that article linked now.. I'm white, and can see what she's saying there.
At first you think "hang on a minute, I'm not like that thank you very much!"
This though, taken from the article - I’m half-white. My mum thought I was lumping her in with everyone, but this isn’t about individuals
“To understand my point, you have to take yourself out of the conversation – it’s not about you – and truly think about society, structurally, economically, as a whole.”

Exactly, if you think about it, it's not about you personally, it's the structure and privilege at play.
You just need to look at this thread to see the amount of privilege denying that goes on.

It's a shame the OP hasn't been back as I would be interested to hear their thoughts on whether trans women are more or less privileged than biological women.

I think OP made their feelings really quite clear that they don't think women have privilege over them:

I am so sorry for people to whom I thought I identified alongside (trans people) who are doing this to you. I feel sick and ashamed of what I am, because of people who are representing me.

I feel like I literally have no space left. And I can’t help but feel that a lot of biological woman are feeling the same way. And you have so much more to lose than I ever will, so I simply can’t imagine how this is making you all feel.

Males who cannot get pregnant are not structurally oppressed.

OMG - it has actually come to this, hasn't it?!

It would appear so, Datun.

Mad no ones is denying white privilege.

What many of us are saying is that Munroe Bergdof knows nothing about the women's issues JKR referred to. It matters not one iota that JKR is white, she had every right to say this.

The arrogance of MB pointing out every difference between them and JK as some sort of gotcha whilst ignoring the fact that they themselves are biologically male.

I just said that I don't have any cake...

Are fishcakes cakes?

At no point was it said that white privilege doesn't exist

Erm...
Why would you assume that because someone is white they have privilege? Thats actually racist

Here's one denial of it for starters

@Datun

You shouldn't speak if you have white privilege. So what about Allison Bailey? Her crowd funder was reported, removed and censored.

Seems like you can't speak if you have white privilege, neither can you speak if you don't have white privilege.

So let's see, if you disagree with the TRA narrative, you can't speak if you're white, you can't speak if you're black, you can't speak if you're trans, and you can't speak without checking the timetable first.

Got it.

#NoDebate

This!!

It might even be funny if a significant number of contributors had actually, honestly understood the serious, pertinent point being made about white privilege and how it blindly perpetuates oppression.

Don’t worry, we understood ... you seem to have got in a bit of a pickle over it though.

Ok dude you got me there. The VAST BLOODY MAJORITY are not saying that.

But when the fuck has Munroe ever taken themselves out of a conversation