Trying to understand the hate trans people get on here.

[Kelcat9494]

Hello,

Firstly I want to say I am not attacking anyone on this forum and I expect the same respect as we are all entitled to an opinion and I am genuinely interested in the reasons why transgender people get so much hate on here:

Firstly I see a lot about not wanting to share bathrooms with trans women as it's a women's safe space - I don't really understand this because to be honest when I'm sat in the cubicle doing my business, I don't think about the persons genitals next to me, it's all very private as you know. The only thing we'd share is the sinks and I don't see a problem with that really. I did read a post about a abuse survivor not wanting to the share the bathroom with someone with a penis (I'm really sorry that the person went through the abuse but that isn't trans people's fault, the fault is with the abuser alone) but in reality a trans person is more at risk in the bathroom and you have no idea whether they are pre op or post op as again in the bathrooms I've been in we don't show each other our genitalia. They are genuinely just doing their human business in the same room as you so don't understand the problem, actually I suppose people are afraid some odd men would use being transgender as an excuse to use the woman's bathroom but that's not trans women's fault also by this logic if we don't want trans women in the bathroom then we should have transmen in there (either pre op or post op), I've posted some pictures below of transmen and woman, would you really want the trans women in men's bathroom and the transmen in the womens?? (I can only post three but you get my point).

I know JKRowling posted about periods and a lot of people jumped on it to say only women have periods and whatever, this isn't true though is it? Some biological women aren't able to have periods or carry a pregnancy or be able to give birth so if we don't see that as a problem as we recognise it's a biological issue then why is trans-men having a period a problem and trans women not having one an issue? And who actually cares? There's enough tampax to go around, maybe let's focus on making them free for women and transmen as I for one is sick of paying for a "luxury item" I need every month due to no fault of my own.

I can't think of anymore off the top of my head that's been posted but anything in the comments I'm happy to reply to but I genuinely think this forum needs to consider what transgender people actually go through, imagine not feeling like you're in the right body, being attacked and hated for who you are and it's obviously not for fun and games because transgender people actually commit suicide over the issues they face remember #bekind and really think how sharing a bathroom or sharing a tampax would affect you? I don't think you'd kill yourself over it.

Also please mind some spelling mistakes in previous post, I don't know why autocorrect sometimes corrects the right words - I mean smugness and knotting

@HandsOffMyRights

Did you mean the Mermaids/Tesco Boycott thread in AIBU? It hasn't been deleted, just got to 1000 posts so finished.

Mascotte
Is the Op a she?

Yes, unless she is a total and consistent liar, which seems improbable, and which I don't believe going by all her posts rather than just fixating on the first one. -- In which she did say on the subject of tampax I for one is sick of paying for a "luxury item" I need every month due to no fault of my own, which seems like a woman's complaint about the matter to me.

Not to mention the most recent! Good luck with it all, Kelcat.

OP, why do you keep calling public toilets "bathrooms"?

@StripeyBananas

OP, why do you keep calling public toilets "bathrooms"?

It's just what I call them, I've always said "I'm going to the bathroom" and I've never thought anything of it, after all these comments though I am feeling a bit self conscious about it now haha

It sounds like you’ve been going through a really stressful time OP, but I’m so glad things seem to be picking up for you and your husband.

Also, well done for staying on the thread as so many OPs slink off into the night, when they get their arse handed to them. I used to wonder why the GC feminists couldn’t just be ‘kind’ too, but once your eyes are opened to what is really going on, you’ll understand the risks.

Be warned, with that realisation, you might end up feeling very emotional because some of the stuff you will learn, might horrify you. If it gets too much, take a break, but don’t leave for good and ignore what is happening. Good luck.

@Fearandsurprise

I was posting before your latest message appeared.

Yeah I saw the time of posting but when people are reading through it’s easy to miss that and look like random attacks. Bad timing on my part!

In fact that might not have been to me. Sorry. Ignore me. I’m tired.

OP - I’m glad things are going better for you now.
Your latest post about cutting your hair off has me worrying about you but I see that you’ve asked for help on other Mumsnet boards. I hope you are getting the support you need.

@Deliriumoftheendless

In fact that might not have been to me. Sorry. Ignore me. I’m tired.

No worries! It was to the OP, but I hadn’t make that clear.

Ironically, there are numerous transpeople who very much disagree with the current orthodoxy, take women‘s concerns seriously and are great allies. (Miranda Yardley comes to mind). But instead of hearing them or hearing anyone at least ready to listen to women‘s concerns, those who are amplified basically act like women with an opinion are the personified Holocaust and need to be battered into Submission in ‚Self Defense.‘ (remember the ‚Girls‘ with the baseball bats?) And some blokes on the left celebrate this misogynyst shit. It is quite the eye opening dynamic.

What I don't understand is why you in the UK call them toilets instead of water closets the way we USians were told you did. We say bathroom and you say water closet, except you don't.

KelCat9494 I'm hugely impressed with you sticking with this thread. Most of us started from a similar position, I wince a bit at how naive I was when I was a trans ally.

Hope things get less stressful for you and all goes well with the baby.

Nothing to say but good on ya OP. You're a real sport and it takes some character to react to the chorus of voices disagreeing with your original post the way you have on this thread. I'm impressed! Please stick around, you're a good egg.

@TehBewilderness

What I don't understand is why you in the UK call them toilets instead of water closets the way we USians were told you did. We say bathroom and you say water closet, except you don't.

"W.C." (always abbreviated) is fairly common on UK public signage (so worth knowing - I know an American who came here and had no idea what it meant) (in fact I've seen it in a number of other European countries too so its usefulness goes beyond Britain).

But it's rare in conversation.

@Xiaoxiong if you’re still on the frugal foodies thread please say hi to everyone from me and give my best wishes to all. Have been busy packing up our home for a very big move, and also been consumed with all matters feminist/FWR over the past couple of months, which has meant I’ve let that one slip (can only keep so many things going in my head at once).

@TehBewilderness

What I don't understand is why you in the UK call them toilets instead of water closets the way we USians were told you did. We say bathroom and you say water closet, except you don't.

I think that would have been true a long time ago :)

I think if you start of as framing a disagreement or a conflict as hate, then that will shape your understanding that passes going forward.
in order to genuinely understand , you have to cast aside your prejudicial mind-set and hear what is being said.

Yes, in fact, I started from the same position as OP, possibly more ‚woke‘: I even remember telling my 2 1/2 year old boy that, no, he won‘t become a woman when growing up (he had asked and I hadn‘t given my answer any thought in that moment) and then flagellating myself about it for weeks. Had I limited him? Damaged him? Denied his true self? Next time I would tell him that it was a matter of who he felt he was! (He never raised it again, for him it was settled).

And I am a scientist ffs. That‘s how brainwashed I was. (Not denying gender confusion or dysphoria can be a thing in kids and this is surely difficult to navigate. But I was ready to start a confusion where there was none, even by ‚woke‘ standards). And then Miranda Yardley burst my bubble. Haha.

Looking forward to seeing your future updates kelcat. You are right that there is so much to consider. But once you see the breadth of the impact (potential and actual) you cannot unsee it.

W.C. Definitely Works in all German speaking countries. It is even the most common wording to ask for the ‚W. C.‘ (pronounced we ce).

"W.C." (always abbreviated) is fairly common on UK public signage (so worth knowing - I know an American who came here and had no idea what it meant) (in fact I've seen it in a number of other European countries too so its usefulness goes beyond Britain).

"Toilet" used to be considered "non U" (vulgar, common). I used to have a Barbara Cartland etiquette manual and the polite term according to her is "lavatory". I seem to recall she rejected WC.

Going back to your original post, OP

“We are all entitled to an opinion...”

does that mean JKR be an post her opinions without fear of death or rape threats?

Good luck with the move Nink and come back to us foodies when you have the headspace! Xx