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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Bunbury's guide to community disruptors part 5

983 replies

ItsLateHumpty · 20/06/2020 15:04

The useful Bunbury Guide to Spotting Community Disruptors is constantly evolving.

The best research and advice is not to engage with community disruptors and trolls. As ever, if you suspect troll activity, report it to MNHQ.

Remember our monitors would like to silence us by fair means or foul.

This is a continuation of the Public Service Announcement thread:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3691023-Bunburys-guide-to-community-disruptors-part-4

If and when you see threads plopped into FWR, especially a curious repeat of well worn topics, maybe check for poster history before engaging. AS is your friend.

There are a number of posts/posters/threads that are reproduced on Twitter or Facebook to foment controversy using screen shots & flagging to either MNHQ to have threads or posters deleted.. Sometimes, it’s used to approach commissioning editors with ideas for articles. It’s a tiresome tactic that we always have community disruptor posters who themselves post the comments that they then highlight elsewhere as purported evidence of racism, religious intolerance, anti-men sentiments, or transphobia.

Some helpful links can be found in the ‘Break it Down for me’ and ‘It never happens’ threads but in essence FermatsTheorem recommended “that in the absence of a block/hide poster button, I suggest the following strategy (given that you're talking to the lurkers).

Do not name check the sealion. Instead, respond to a depersonalised paraphrase:

"It is sometimes erroneously suggested that blah. Blah is wrong for the following reasons (short and pithy). If you need more information re. debunking blah, here's a link."

Then (this next step is important to combat derailment) go back up thread to the last useful contribution to the discussion, make sure you do name check that contributor, and pick up the discussion from that point.”

Go well Witches Gin

OP posts:
Thread gallery
12
nachthexe · 23/08/2020 16:31

@ArabellaScott

Sorry about the roof. And the branston. Would a chutney recipe help?!
Ooo g’wan then. Or save it for a thread where a recipe might be useful and tag me Grin. I’m already feeling stressed about Christmas lol (we always have family visitors from around the world and due to the whole pandemic saga we might be on our own for the first time in 25 years). A good chutney might see me through!
OhHolyJesus · 23/08/2020 16:36

Oh thanks Humpty I really appreciated your comments (and also Georgina's who posted in much more reasonable language than I did!)

There was something about that thread that didn't ring true overall and the language was rather cheerful but that could have been forced, perhaps she was simply looking for lots of congratulatory messages and was sadly disappointed. All those damned ethical questions getting in the way!

Funny how the Law Commission stuff came out at the end. Oddly a couple of old threads got some visitors as well, around the same time as that new poster appeared...just off to check if they haven't been pulled.

EchoCardioGran · 23/08/2020 16:37

I think we need to start a FWR chutney crowdfunder.
I can see it's going to be a long hard winter for nachthexe
( Do your visitors swoop in with their engines switched off in the dead of night, so that you can't hear them arriving Wink )

OhHolyJesus · 23/08/2020 16:37

Bold fail sorry and the Ukraine thread has been deleted. Not sure what happened there.

SocialMedea · 23/08/2020 16:50

chutney crowdfunder

That's beautiful. Something cellar doorish about it.

Winesalot · 23/08/2020 16:52

I think the poster for the success thread may be a poster who has not thought about several sticky points and frankly does not want to because they then will not get the second child they obviously desperately want... above all else. I think there really is a dulling of people’s sense of right and wrong around this issue because they feel everyone is doing it and that they cannot process the grey areas for fear they want get that child.

I get the feeling that the tshirt loving poster will never see anything outside getting that second child so they will not be back. They didn’t get the congratulatory support they expected. Even some congratulatory posts were a bit ‘well, I don’t think I personally could deal with giving away a child I carried for nine months...’. So no, really did not go towards getting the positive response they wanted.

nachthexe · 23/08/2020 17:10

@EchoCardioGran

I think we need to start a FWR chutney crowdfunder. I can see it's going to be a long hard winter for nachthexe ( Do your visitors swoop in with their engines switched off in the dead of night, so that you can't hear them arriving Wink )
No but that’s TOTALLY how I arrive back in Europe Grin
OhHolyJesus · 23/08/2020 17:16

I think there really is a dulling of people’s sense of right and wrong around this issue because they feel everyone is doing it

I blame the media personally, the surrogacy agencies and support groups are still pretty niche although growing in popularity, most people would only hear about surrogacy because of Lance Black or a mum having her daughter's babies in Woman Magazine - until about 4 years ago that was where I formed my perspective on it too (my mum used to buy it).

We're hearing a bit more now about your average gay male couple doing it, obvs Ricky Martin and Elton John stories have been around for years but it's becoming more common and for people to talk about it in general (more infertility, more treatments available, more likely to happen) so more in public consciousness.

She said she was on MN before but left so maybe it wasn't the smoothest re-entry.

OhHolyJesus · 23/08/2020 18:16

Just found the AMA that was posted last night - bloody brilliant posts! Now I get what the only deleting OP posts was about. I agree it would be best left and just locked, would liked to have seen OPs posts on that one!

Pertella · 23/08/2020 18:38

What's the difference between chutney and relish?

OhHolyJesus · 23/08/2020 18:40

The Drewit-Barlows www.mumsnet.com/Talk/surrogacy/3814566-the-drewit-barlows

ArabellaScott · 23/08/2020 18:42

nachthexe

Okay, seeing as you mentioned Xmas -

Cranberry and Mandarin chutney

punnet cranberries – about 350g(?)
2 tbsp red wine vinegar –
2/3 cup sugar (I use brown/muscovado)
half tsp cinnamon
half tsp ginger – ground
quarter tsp allspice
pinch ground cloves
chopped & peeled apple
zest of a mandarin, chopped finely, and a squeeze of juice.

Boil it all up for about 20 minutes or so. Check for balance of sweet/sharp, adjust sugar/vinegar to taste.

I'm very vague with quantities, do check and adjust to taste. This goes (at the risk of getting certain MNers overexcited) very well with cheese, especially Wensleydale.

KnowingYou · 23/08/2020 18:43

Chowder?
Chunder?

EchoCardioGran · 23/08/2020 19:40

I'm minded to try that recipe Arabella. It must smell heavenly.

ArabellaScott · 23/08/2020 20:03

It's lush! Bit early, mind you. It's more apple chutney time of year, I'd say. Unless you're a saddo like me organised and buy marked down cranberries in January and freeze them til late autumn.

ChattyLion · 24/08/2020 04:15

Oh no OhHolyJesus which Ukraine thread has gone? Your threads are really important as resources for updates on media reports, open discussion, all of it.

ChattyLion · 24/08/2020 04:28

So, we know generalisations aren't ok - I have no argument with that, clearly it's wrong to associate trans people in general with something that only pertains to a subset of a heterogenous group under a wide umbrella. It also seems that being specific about individuals isn't ok either. How are women supposed to navigate the space between - the subsection of people identifying as TW who appear to have this trait? It's certainly not ok to have a situation where women feel they can't risk having a discussion for fear of strikes if they overstep the invisible and variable line.

Errol you hit the nail on the head exactly with these points, totally agree with you.

Angryresister · 24/08/2020 10:20

Weird postings in the toilet thread...

OhHolyJesus · 24/08/2020 11:45

It was a fairly recent one Chatty on the Surrogacy board. A poster looking for a cheap deal and it got reignited by a genuine poster also looking around shortly after.

The OP on the AMA thread sprung up on the Ukraine thread Sat late night saying how good an experience she had in Ukraine and how it was better regulated than U.K. Confused but after I posted the news story of the fleeing, doxxed surrogate mothers it was deleted. Then the OP started the AMA thread at that time and got handed her arse.

The AIBU threads about the abandoned babies in Kiev remain, think there were 3 the weekend the story broke.

ChattyLion · 24/08/2020 12:29

OhHoly oh I see. I don’t go on the Surrogacy board so I missed that. I’m glad the AIBU threads are still with us.

Have we got a ‘break it down for me’ on surrogacy type of thread anywhere? I saw some posters had suggested that and I feel like that would be a useful place to park news items or other relevant stuff. i would happily post links to other threads that there have been historically on there. Maybe a thread like that exists already back from Rumplestiltskin thread days, or earlier, I don’t know. But your doxxing and fleeing story sounds both horrific and important to include on a thread like that. It does worry me how many voices are excluded from mainstream media coverage on this issue.

OhHolyJesus · 24/08/2020 13:08

Oh yes, here it is - a good reminder for me to add to it actually.

Surrogacy Resource thread : please post your links here www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3782983-surrogacy-resource-thread-please-post-your-links-here

OhHolyJesus · 24/08/2020 13:10

Oh sorry is that what your meant Chatty - it's a resources thread so sort of like a break it down for me thread. Maybe that's something I need to build up. Been working on something else which is 'coming soon' so maybe once complete I can come back to this.

ItsLateHumpty · 24/08/2020 14:36

AMA / surrogacy thread had been deleted - OP has real life concerns.

OP posts:
OhHolyJesus · 24/08/2020 14:38

Oh bugger.

Winesalot · 24/08/2020 18:18

Real life concerns.... you betcha.