Why are the trans community blaming women for the actions of men?

[ShirleyPhallus]

I’m reading everything I possibly can in light of JKR statement (which beautifully articulates everything I feel)

One thing I cannot see a clear answer to though is just why all the TRAs are just so angry at women. I have seen a serious of tweets linked on Facebook that talk about how dangerous JKR’s thinking is to the trans community as it makes “people” (I assume men?!) think that trans women are not real women.

Leaving aside the argument of whether they are or aren’t, does anyone know why TRAs aren’t more angry at the men who are actually doing the rape / murder / assault that also affects women and why they’re angry at women for standing up for themselves? This is more than just misogyny surely?

@Burgundy1844 I really don’t think that on this issue that’s a good thing. I didn’t appreciate how much my sex mattered until I had children. Most women (of the politically active class at least) don’t do that until they’re in their 30s these days. I don’t think they really understand.

Why are the trans community blaming women for the actions of men

Because the level of public discourse and informed debate is now incredibly low. In its place we have deeply partisan tribal politics, in which social media stands in for actual journalism and second hand reports are read as truth.

@emperorcovidula you’re right, young women should stick to what they know about

“Why are the trans community blaming women for the actions of men

Because the level of public discourse and informed debate is now incredibly low. In its place we have deeply partisan tribal politics, in which social media stands in for actual journalism and second hand reports are read as truth.”

This.

You're almost there burgendy, the problem isn't transpeople, the problem is men. We aren't afraid of transpeople, we're afraid of men. We aren't excluding transpeople, we're excluding men. Including men with the unprovable, unscientific, offensive, and illogical belief that being a woman is a feeling anyone can have in their head. We'd like those men to stay out of our spaces as well. Not because they're trans, but because they're men. Anyone who isn't a "cis" female? There's no such thing. A "cis" female is just a female, and anyone who isn't a female is a male. I can draw you a diagram if it would help?

Most women (of the politically active class at least) don’t do that until they’re in their 30s these days. I don’t think they really understand

young women these days are brought up in a society in which women are in a variety of roles and positions, in a way that they weren't as late as the 1970/80s. There is far more equality, in terms of opportunity and expectation.

But also, many young women are further away from the prospect of motherhood than they would once have been; and many do not even have their first child until they reach their 30's.....and increasingly many, for one reason or other, never have children.

Motherhood, and especially young motherhood, is seen as a restrictive negative: to many an educated young person who is trying to establish a career, travel the world and 'have fun'. A lot of what arises from specifically from being female; the consequences and feelings of motherhood has yet to happen.

Young women assume they'll want to get straight back to work once they have children, and will have ideals around shared childcare and housework etc. The lived reality happens.

Then lived reality happens

@ShirleyPhallus

I just think if you look you can find idiots from every viewpoint

Thanks v much for at least admitting it’s everyone who you don’t view as female that’ you hate. I think I can grasp that without the benefit of a diagram. Fact is that in trans people you’ve found a vulnerable group you can focus that rage on. You’re obviously entitled to your views. I feel sad that you and others on this thread seem shaped by such bitterness and rage. But I’ve no doubt it’s personal experience that has lead you there.

It's also about the inability of most people (men and women) to see the underlying structure of our society - to recognise the social structures in which we all live (sociologists would talk about ideology, I think, as opposed to day-to-day politics).

And to recognise that structure as fundamentally patriarchal.

It's not wilful ignorance: our whole political and education systems are oriented towards thinking about the individual, and ideas of free will and choice.

And it's hard recognising these structure, because it seems so big that it seems like you can do nothing to change it.

That's why "choice" feminism (or liberal feminism) has gained a lot of purchase - we can see the specific battles against specific inequalities: equal pay, maternity leave, and so on. And we need those specific equalities.

But when it comes down to it, all that does is try to squeeze women in man-shaped structures. And those structures are organised around the male body, the male life pattern, and masculinity.

And those don't work for women, whose bodies are different, whose life patterns are different, and for whom femininity is mostly a trap.

The trans community does not blame women for anything

A cursory dip into Twitter this morning threw up quite a few examples of exactly that.

One TRA recounted getting a contact from a young person saying "If JKR thinks I shouldn't exist, maybe I shouldn't?" for example.

Others referred to "t*rfs" refusal to call TW women as "literal violence" and there were any number of claims that it was exactly women's refusal to do this that had caused the death of a black transwoman and that of many others.

So yes, yes they do blame women.

It's unreal to think that all this hoo-ha has come about just because JKR said only women can menstruate.
That's a simple fact that I learned when I was about 10.

Also - the prefix 'cis' annoys me intensely and I find it offensive. The vile abuse levelled at JKR shows that misogyny is still alive and well.

Funny how it’s younger people who are leading on the environment, leading on BLM leading on trans rights and on so many other issues

You haven't been very observant if all you see is "young people" - do a google for bell hooks or Cornel West.

Are there as many young people leading women’s rights?

There is no rage being focused on trans people. There is rage from trans people on women, however. Men being statistically more dangerous, is not women hating men.
Women are human beings, there are so many unique things in the experience of being girls and women, both in the UK and across the globe. As human beings, we deserve dignity and privacy from males. Fairness in sports. It makes me sick, men are creating new women’s world records, taking women’s awards and places in political parties.

As Posie Parker/Kellie-Jay said, this entire thing only works if women aren’t human. Woman is not achieved by dresses, a feminine name or whatever other mystified sexist stereotypes are”living as a woman”, but the name for an adult human female.

The trans community does not blame women for anything

So who are all the people spewing vicious hate of the "Choke on my girl dick"* kind to J K Rowling?

• There are thousands of examples of this discourse: aimed at Ms Rowling, aimed at many women. I've experienced that onslaught myself - although I count myself lucky I never received death or rape threats. Just an attempt to get me sacked.

Looking forward to evidence of where I said I "hate" anyone who isn't female burgendy. Or did I actually say that I and most other women have reason to fear people who aren't female, to not want them in our sex segregated spaces, and to not centre them in our feminism. I know it's easier to address a straw man but is there any chance of you responding to what people have actually written?

Thanks v much for at least admitting it’s everyone who you don’t view as female that’ you hate

I'm not sure where you that that from? I haven't read the whole thread, but hatred is not what motivates most women who are critical of transgender ideology.

Hatred is what seems to be coming from the opposite direction, to be frank. Reams of it. Shouting and screaming outside of conferences of established professionals and others involved in women's organisations' foul on-line abuse and attempts to lose people their livelihoods and jobs. Targeting anyone who disagrees that TWAW.

There is a total lack of nuanced or informed discussion. Purely tribalistic oppositional politics of the sort that denies the possibility of disagreement.

Women want and need to retain their single sex spaces, services and sports for reasons of privacy, dignity, comfort as well as safety. Women require single sex sports too, i order to excel and have fair competition. that's about it.

Not sure what rights trans people don't already have. we all have equal civil rights under the law - certainly in Britain. what you seem to want is additional rights to others, and to centre trans rights ahead of women's rights.

I feel sad that you and others on this thread seem shaped by such bitterness and rage

You aren't really listening or understanding, are you. You seem to just want black and white certainty. I know it is motivated by some sort idealism. Most of us have been there. But your idealism is misguided and naive.

why don't you campaign for third spaces? Instead of seeking to colonise women's spaces, services and sports. If you did that then you would be no issue. Everyone could then get behind every person's right to a job, housing and freedom from violence and abuse.

But you cannot force your way in to another's space.

“ Women want and need to retain their single sex spaces, services and sports for reasons of privacy, dignity, comfort as well as safety.“

Some women. I for example do not believe this wrt trans people. But it’s my personal view and you have the right to yours.

Justhadathought I am listening but I don’t agree with you 🤷‍♀️

We appreciate it Burgundy. Freedom of speech is a very important thing and the right to express a personal opinion on every matter.

In this time of BLM, and attempts to examine colonial pasts, it seems ironic that the trans movement is seeking to colonise womanhood; re-define what a woman is; enforce language change; eradicate the indigenous language and freedom to discuss one's condition; de-centre the natives and impose violent repression on anyone who disagrees.

Quite astonishing this major blind spot, and inability to think and see laterally the equivalences of different types of colonisation and oppression.

Justhadathought I am listening but I don’t agree with you

What exactly do you disagree with? Rather than posting guns at dawn emojis try to engage in a more thoughtful way.

Ok Burgundy1844 - you don't feel that you need female only spaces. Nor do I although I prefer them.

But can you see that you shouldn't be giving them away when other women do need them? You aren't able to consent on behalf of others.