Hungary votes to end legal recognition of transgender people

[Lamahaha]

nationalfile.com/hungary-votes-134-56-to-end-legal-recognition-of-trans-people/?fbclid=IwAR2XMJp7yzVMt9sh4QDOX69znivEA43eJhcSDVlm-zsMaikbANtXxnhd_uo

The amendment would recognize “sex at birth,” making it impossible to change ones gender throughout the course of their life.

On the proposed draft law, Human Rights Watch wrote:

The proposed amendment to the Registry Act would include a clarification regarding the word “nem,” which in Hungarian can mean both “sex” and “gender,” to specifically refer to the sex at birth (“szuletesi nem”) as “biological sex based on primary sex characteristics and chromosomes.” According to the draft bill, the birth sex, once recorded, cannot be amended.

It's the correct vote, but this government is otherwise authoritarian, neo-fascist, against minorities, pretty awful.

Apparently the TRA's are already planning a legal challenge in the European Court of Human Rights on the basis that the new law violates European human rights case law...

Why do we have sex-segregated spaces in the first place?

Have those reasons now ceased to exist?

Who benefits most from making spaces mixed sex?

If you’re happy to have transwomen in female spaces, why not just have them open to anyone?

How do you tell the difference between the transwomen who are a threat and those who aren’t?

A man who has had estrogen treatment (of which has sterilised him, one the things gender critical feminists are always quick to mention when it comes to kids) who have also had genital surgery, ARE NOT ABOUT TO RAPE YOU.

Men on estrogen are much less likely to get an erection, for sure, however ...
"Lawson forced a lemon into the woman’s mouth, punched her in the face and held her by the hair in a back room of the Transformations shop (a shop for men who wish to buy and wear stereotypical female clothing and accessories). The attempted rape was so terrifying the woman told the police she thought she was going to die; the attack only ended when Lawson failed to get an erection."
transcrimeuk.com/2017/10/30/karen-lawson/

I agree it thankfully hasn't happened yet, but you're still seemingly wilfully missing the point that if some minorities rights get rolled back (OK, one you may agree with should be rolled back) what's to say they're not coming for other rights next?

This has already happened. Despite protection laid out in law, women's rights have been rolled back, they can and will come for other groups next as soon as they stop being useful.

As for the comments about assault, they are at best naive. If you had a background in women's services you;d know that men who cannot get an erection will use an object instead.

what

What about medical records. How can patients be called for screening when their sex is no longer accurate on the drs records?

And sex could be all that stands between a dx of a pulled muscle in the arm and catching an ectopic pregnancy before it ruptures and the patient dies.

Can you not see a problem?

the majority of trans women are not rapists

Neither are the majority of men but we still retain sex-segregated spaces. Why?

Sorry posted too soon

the majority of trans women are not rapists

The majority of men aren't rapists. But the law gives us some protections from those who are.
You can't allow some males but not others as this is sex discrimination. We don't know which males are rapists so we keep them all out.

Mixed sex changing rooms and toilets increase the risk of attack on women and children. This is proven. So why don't those female victims matter? Why is it our job to protect the males?
Why can't they have the 3rd mixed sex option and leave the single sex provision alone?

NotBadConsidering

I was quoting another poster but pressed post too soon.

it’s just as possible for a woman to sexually assault another woman, possibly even more likely. The risk is very low.

It's not more likely for a woman to commit a sexual assault than a male. Males commit 98% of sex crime. If you think there is something different about MTF trans people that happens just because they say the words "I identify as a woman", then you need to evidence it. The burden of proof is on you.

A person who doesn't like their own penis doesn't want to be in a room where they are with other penis owners.
But refuses to see that non penis owners do not want a penis of over a certain age in their room.

Yes, but I would add that many MTF trans people seem quite comfortable with their penises. You don't have to have body dysphoria to identify as trans in the stunning and brave new world.

.. you have to start off with a belief that as a woman all males are a danger..

Pathetic.

...you have to start off with a belief that as a woman you cannot tell which males are a danger...

There you go - fixed it for you.

You're welcome.

Yeah sorry, makes sense now!

..And changing your name to Tiffany while wearing frilly knickers from Marks doesn't make any difference. At all.

Pathetic
...you have to start off with a belief that as a woman you cannot tell which males are a danger...There you go - fixed it for you.

Pathetic.
For having a different opinion?
You fixed it to YOUR view - not mine.
I am allowed to see things differently.

Hungary didn’t vote to end the legal recognition of transpeople. They voted to stop the falsification of a legal document.

..you have to start off with a belief that as a woman you cannot tell which males are a danger...

Which is basically saying what I just said anyway!
You say you can't tell which males are a danger, so doesn't that mean we should view them all as a threat because as you say we can't tell which ones are nice?
I don't start off viewing them all as a threat.

That’s nice lemonade you crack on with that & feel free to insert yourself into as many Male spaces as you like given as you don’t regard men as a threat.

However I continue to base my risk assessments on men being responsible for 98% sexual assaults.

'it’s just as possible for a woman to sexually assault another woman, possibly even more likely. The risk is very low.'

The statistics hugely disagree.

This suggestion that there is a massive problem with female on female sex offending is a lubricious claim made frequently by those who seek to justify a ludicrous position. Thing is, all women and girls in the world, more or less, simply know the truth.

"Lawson forced a lemon into the woman’s mouth, punched her in the face and held her by the hair in a back room of the Transformations shop (a shop for men who wish to buy and wear stereotypical female clothing and accessories). The attempted rape was so terrifying the woman told the police she thought she was going to die; the attack only ended when Lawson failed to get an erection."

What's so awful about this is they were tying this woman up and shoving stuff in her mouth, in order to get aroused. It didn't work on the physical side, but that's what they were doing. Violently assaulting her to turn themselves on.

The person in had also killed their own boyfriend.

And then they were invited to speak at the House of Lords to tell politicians how to better accommodate trans people.

I take it LemonadeAndDaisyChains uses the men's toilets, men's changing room and, if ever needing hospital treatment, would use the male ward. Leave the female spaces for women who want their single-sex spaces to be respected.

If any woman is not bothered by mixed sex spaces, then she should stop being a hypocrite by using facilities for females. Go share with the men. Men are not a threat anyway, right? Plus you will be supporting all those transwomen you claim to love and care about so much. Surely they will feel much better when more women who support them start using the men's facilities. It will be lovely to have all those supportive women around them. So go on - Be an ally! Show transwomen you care. Use the men's from now on. Actions speak louder than words.

You say you can't tell which males are a danger, so doesn't that mean we should view them all as a threat because as you say we can't tell which ones are nice?

No. We know that any of them might be a potential threat.

I don't want to wait until a man attacks me to find out that he is a threat. If men are kept out of certain spaces, the threat from the minority of men who are there to attack women completely disappears.

Do you assume that all people are "nice" and will do you no harm? You sound very naive, and someone who must have led a very sheltered life.

Some people seem to struggle with the difference between 'any' and 'all'.

I take it LemonadeAndDaisyChains uses the men's toilets, men's changing room and, if ever needing hospital treatment, would use the male ward. Leave the female spaces for women who want their single-sex spaces to be respected

No, because I'm entitled to use the woman's spaces.

Some people seem to struggle with the difference between 'any' and 'all'.

Nope, no struggling here - some seem to really struggle with the idea we don't have to agree with each other though.

Why is it ok for trans women to say they want access to female spaces because they fear attack from males, ( so by your logic Lemonade they must fear all men) yet females aren't allowed to retain female only spaces for the same reason? Especially as females are at far greater risk than trans women.

No, because I'm entitled to use the woman's spaces.

You are not entitled to expect other women to give up their single-sex spaces though.
If you have no issue with sharing facilities with men, it should be you that uses mixed-sex facilities. Not other women. Plus you will be showing solidarity with transgender people.