Police officer posts that 1 in 12 transwomen get murdered

[jadefinch]

Cliff Goodwin, who is an engagement officer at the College of Policing, seems to be using the pandemic to post wholly untrue statistics about trans people.

He's said that 1 in 12 transwomen get murdered (no mention of transmen) and that the figure rises to 1 in 8 if they're of colour. He also said 41% of trans people have tried to commit suicide.

In actual fact 7 transwomen have been murdered in the last decade (all by men and none for being trans. One was of colour. The number of women murdered by men in that time is well over 1,300).

The 41% figure has been debunked even by trans organisations like GIDS, who say the figure is actually less than 1%.

When it was pointed out to him that these stats were untrue he said they were international figures (they aren't - they're just made up) and he won't delete them because he wants to highlight the plight of trans people so they are visible (which makes no sense). He's an engagement advisor - but then started blocking ex police officers who said he shouldn't be lying - and noone was positively engaging with him.

What has happened to our police?

twitter.com/cliff_goodwin/status/1244882805483540481?s=19

Hello, I am the author of the email complaint. I am a lawyer, but I am complaining as a private citizen. I was the one of apparently 200 'hateful' 'uneducated' 'trolls' who pointed out that the statistics relied upon were either false or misleading or both.

I was both astonished and angry to see the response to these reasonable complaints by two people publicly identified as working with or for the College of Policing.

I note the 'inventor' of the 1 in 12 statistic has posted to complain - I assume about my use - of the phrase 'sex workers'. That is where I understood high statisitcal rates of murder of trqnswomen occurred in South America.

There seems for that poster to be yet more attempts to derail this by criticising other's use of language and assuming bad faith. If 'sex worker' is a phrase that causes offence then I am sorry. Tell me what to say instead.

But - and I can't quite believe I still have to keep saying this over, and over and over again - asking for accurate dissemination of information upon which law and policy is built, upon which people may be facing criminal trial and possibly imprisonment IS NOT HATE

The 'transactivists' have overplayed their hand. they have relied on male entitlement and male aggression to push this through. And to a large extent they have succeeded! Because women like me, who display possibly atypical traits of aggression, were not aware it was happening until relatively recently.

Well. Now we ARE.

I hope whatever the response of the CoP to my complaint it will help the Fair Cop case in the Supreme Court. This madness has gone more than far enough. I would urge everyone as worried and afraid as I am to email the complaints department of the CoP and set out your disgust that their organisation would behave in this way.

That happens even if that transwoman was NOT a "sex worker"

I don’t remember anyone saying anything different

No one as far as i can see has said that every murdered transwoman Was a sex worker, just that it includes sex workers

Incredibly, other police officers have joined the thread - seemingly stating that they don't care that he lied because the issue is so important and that the people who are bothered about the misinformation are bigots:

twitter.com/DCStubbs1/status/1245317859619807233?s=19

twitter.com/CoPMaria9/status/1244987705240571904?s=19

Thank you Spero!

Thanks for that jade finch. Have responded.
twitter.com/SVPhillimore/status/1245634851459350528?s=20

PLEASE WILL YOU ALL COMPLAIN

This kind of shit relies on women being timid, compliant and afraid to make a fuss.

Yes thanks spero. Hate crime for challenging a statistic. Fffffffs.

But - and I can't quite believe I still have to keep saying this over, and over and over again - asking for accurate dissemination of information upon which law and policy is built, upon which people may be facing criminal trial and possibly imprisonment IS NOT HATE

Spero
Thank you for challenging this. As you eloquently state, it is not only absurd, but chilling that questioning flawed statistics, broadcast by the police, is being denounced as 'hate.' There is something profoundly wrong with the current situation. I wish you every success and it is because of people such as you and Harry Miller that this unhinged state of affairs is being exposed to much needed legal and public scrutiny.

👏💪💪💪 Spero. You and fair cop

The police have no place in political lobbying

Cliff you should be apologising for your inaccurate and bullying tweets.

Calling people trolls for pointing out your false statistics

🤦‍♀️

That's the usual defence thought isn't it - attack and name call (then hold your breath until your face turns blue/threaten to hurt yourself, then). And this person works for the justice system?

It's Cruella Braverman who's in charge of Justice, gawd help us.

It's deceitful practice, it's pure political propaganda,

Yes, but what I've noticed is that there are a lot of people who pass this stuff around who aren't attempting propaganda, they simply aren't savvy enough to really get that it's not applicable. I nice lady I know who sings in my choir has sometimes shared some of these kinds of things, she's smart, university educated and in facts works in a university, and young enough that you'd think she's realise from her own experience that there have been demographic changes. But she's just kind of taken it for granted that these lobby groups and concerned people are being totally honest and straightforward.

But she's just kind of taken it for granted that these lobby groups and concerned people are being totally honest and straightforward.

Quite.

They've been taken as the equivalent of the National Trust and the British Heart Foundation. And oh boy have they exploited that one to the last decimal place.

Important to repeat as often as possible: political lobby group. With extremist views. Highly biased. Issues around tolerance to other minority groups, in particular some concerning attitudes and policies towards women, LGB, cultural differences, faiths, safeguarding of children.

A further tweet today from a self-described "front line detective and fed rep" in support of colleagues caught out posting misleading stastists

"Being impartial doesn't mean you don't raise awareness of serious issues. Some responses Cliff has had show exactly why awareness is needed. Funny how these same people don't protest when police raise awareness of drink driving or domestic violence. I wonder why that is?"

Another who thinks its okay to get uppity and throw insults when caught doing something they shouldn't be doing.

Wtf is wrong with your police force? I am utterly shocked that police officers and their representatives are allowed to act like this publicly. This bloke is, apparently a "Advanced Misconduct and health & safety Rep" as well.

Sorry I've posted that not realising it had already been picked up! That's what I get for starting it then going for coffee inbetween.

Seriously though people, this is shocking, I've never seen the police in N Ireland act like this publicly let alone privately. This is outrageous behaviour. Is questioning police misconduct 'hateful' now? The police have and should be held responsible for their actions, they are not above the law. The tone and language being used here is very concerning.

The more the merrier! I probably wouldn't have seen that tweet unless it had been highlighted here. And that's how they get away with it - it takes real time and effort to join the dots. I note a lot of people have responded to point out what utter rubbish he is spouting and he hasn't responded to any as far as I can see.

Is lying about drink driving a good thing now then?

"25 billion people died in drink driving incidents last night in Watford"

if it serves the emotional purpose does that make the fact it's barefaced lying irrelevant? This is faulty thinking associated with specific pathology of people who are not healthy. Or functioning well. This isn't something to promote as a 'good thing'.

Parallels

I suppose 'Reefer Madness' and the suggestion that one puff of weed and you'd be gnawing your own arm off craving heroin.

Not a notably sucessful public information campaign.

"Being impartial doesn't mean you don't raise awareness of serious issues. Some responses Cliff has had show exactly why awareness is needed. Funny how these same people don't protest when police raise awareness of drink driving or domestic violence. I wonder why that is?"

That's so fucking stupid, isn't it? As Michelle points out, is it therefore OK to tell lies about domestic violence and drink driving in furtherance of raising awareness? How does telling lies about stuff raise awareness anyway? Doesn't it actually lower awareness when people realise you're lying?

Why are these people so utterly dim?

Just shared this with a poster trying to escape abuse, and found myself thinking...…… mm, sounds familiar! 'Dysfunctional Beliefs', by Issendai:

You’re abusive when you refuse to care for my emotional wounds.

If I have an emotional reaction to something someone does, the other person is responsible for my emotions.

If I have an emotional reaction to something, then that something is my business. This is true even if it concerns another person’s private life.

Emotions cause actions. When I feel something, I can’t not act on it. (Or, at least, it’s wrong not to act on it.)

People aren’t responsible for what they feel.

I’m not responsible for my emotions, and emotion causes action, so I’m not responsible for my actions. (The person responsible for my emotions is responsible for my actions.

You made me feel this way, so you made me act this way. If you want to make me act differently, make me feel differently.)

www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/dysfunctional-beliefs.html

#NotHealthyStuff.

truthiness
/ˈtruːθɪnəs/
nounINFORMAL
the quality of seeming or being felt to be true, even if not necessarily true

Beyond pissed off with government agencies and state institutions dealing in truthiness - embarrassing and shameful.

Is anyone else complaining about this officially? Sarah Phillimore have written a lenghty email about their conduct, read it on twitter its brilliant.

The PSNI main twitter account had nothing on their twitter feed the last 3 days but actual crime information, that included info on a woman's murder, another DV incident. Actual fucking crime reporting. They're not perfect but it was refreshing to read in comparison. You deserve better.

Would it be justified to raise awareness about domestic violence by claiming 1 in 12 women are killed by domestic violence? Would it also be justified that we do away with all men’s privacy, dignity and safety because of it?

I suppose 'Reefer Madness' and the suggestion that one puff of weed and you'd be gnawing your own arm off craving heroin.

So, thinking about this, I have seen people in other areas of interest make a similar claim that the numbers or exact circumstances don't matter, so long as the sense of the thing is correct, drugs being an example, but I've also seen it when talking about women's issues, and I've seen it here on these boards on occasion. I've seen people, for example, say there is no reason to try and take apart pay gap statistics and figure out what they really mean, because we all know that it's about the oppression of women, or looking at why a legal judgement was made and objection to pointing out what the technical reasons were, and similar things.

There is a real tendency for everyone to accept things that seem correct to us without to much digging, and often no one points it out, or is supportive of the people who do point it out and get accused of having some sort of agenda.

The point about the whole "War On Drugs" overstatement is that it may have been motivated by good intentions, but the effect was to destroy credibility of any official message on the subject.

Similarly, it is no help for transpeople to have the baseball-bat wielding 'shut the eff up, bitch' brigade as their advocates, however well-intentioned (even) they might be.